Why do so many treatments just make this illness worse?!

 
Hi, Loni,
 
Enzymes--good idea!  Enzymes + thymus glandular works even better for me,if you aren't afraid to take it due to cross-over viruses.  Good luck, dear.  Hope you get what your body is craving.
 
Be well,
Diane

--- On Fri, 9/11/09, Loni <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: Loni <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] new genetic molecule discovery (formerly "Het bitje..."
To: [hidden email]
Date: Friday, September 11, 2009, 11:37 AM


 



I think initial gut disorders could be the main trigger in our health decline. I have leaky gut but tested ok for celiac disease however I cannot tolerate gluten really. I try to stay away from it but it is very hard. In sooooooooooo many things you know.
 
70% of your immune system is your gut! so I am trying to heal my gut & support other organs as well as eating better. More raw foods for vitamins & minerals & ENZYMES!
 
EeeeeeSH! Lot of work.
 
Loni

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, Evie <evie15422@yahoo. com> wrote:

From: Evie <evie15422@yahoo. com>
Subject: Re: [eSens] new genetic molecule discovery (formerly "Het bitje..."
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 5:43 PM

 

Hi, Sandi,
 
This post will sound like I am saying every one here has celiac disease, but I don't believe that at all.  Just keep reading to get to the meat of what I am saying.....  Personally, I was told celiac disease causes an over-active immune system.  Celiac disease is at the heart of my liver problems too.  Run amok cytokines and inflammation loops.... are all too common in cd.  Cd is also linked to auto-immune diseases of every ilk and isitself an auto-immune disease.  (I am also type 2 diabetic, tho technically borderline, since I chose to arrest it there by a low-carb, no sugar orsugar alcohols diet before it got out of control.) 
 
I keep abreast of recent research as best I can.  Cd is also a channelopathy (an ion channel disease).  I bring this up because I have read that ES researchers and docs think ES has the potential to affect only 20% or so of the population.  Ion channel diseases are also thought to affect this many.  Dr Marios Hadjivassilious of the UK discovered a tight junction permeability gene (a channelopathy term) which he estimates exists in 20-23% of the population and without that gene you can have all the other cd genes but not get cd.  Now I have read that a celiac research doc has tiedthis to a genetic mutation precurser molecule which exists in approximately 20% of the population.  This part of the population includes cd and other auto-immune diseased people.  I am excited.  I hope it leads to a resolution of our problems, Sandi.  Some may consider this off-topic,but I really feel ES is connected into all of this.  You can read about this
molecule discovery here:
 
http://www.scienced aily.com/ releases/ 2009/09/09090716 2322.htm
 
This celiac pediatrician' s wife has MS, Sandi.  He started his research looking for a cure for MS.  His ultimate goal is to find a cure which addresses all the auto-immune diseases at one time.  I hope you can hold on to hope of a cure without doing something drastic and irreversible.  He has made great progress.
 
my best to you, Dear,
Diane
 

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, seandaly33 <seandaly33@ hotmail. com> wrote:

From: seandaly33 <seandaly33@ hotmail. com>
Subject: [eSens] Re: english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 1:47 PM

 

I would go along with those posts below stating that immune system problemshave to be the major cause in this whole issue, whether it has been damaged by external factors or internal health issues.

I myself have type 1 diabetes, basically caused by the immune system going haywire and attacking cells in the pancreas that produce insulin. So I often wondered if the immune system was the crux of my ES problem since becoming electrosensitive nearly three years ago. I did ask my doctor, who never heard of ES of course, whether I may have an immune problem. He did a normalblood test, and with the white blood cell count showing up ok, he determined that it wasn't an immune system issue. I have since gone on to learn, ashas been stated by others on this forum, that the immune system is a very complex system,and a simple blood test such as that doesn't give the whole picture. (As a matter of interest, has anyone gone to see an immunologist about the problem ever, or would it be worth the bother?)

Recently, my interest was taken by an article I came across in a science magazine related to the immune system and diabetes. Trials on type 1 diabetics carried out in Brazil, but run in coordination with an American university doctor, saw 15 participants basically having their immune systems shut down, and having new stem cells injected into their bodies to build a new, healthier immune system. For 13 of the 15 people, their "new" immune system stopped attacking their pancreatic cells, and they were able to stop taking insulin injections. see here: http://www.msnbc. msn.com/id/ 18040485/ .htm
The article does mention the danger of the procedure; the patients' old immune systems were shut down using chemotherapy, which is obviously dangerous. Other risks are involved also.
The article does go on to mention that this kind of procedure was also successful with other autoimmune diseases, such as lupus and multiple sclerosis. Obviously this kind of thing is still in the early stages of research anddevelopment, but I was just thinking, that it might offer some potential hope for something like ES if it is indeed an immune system malfunction or whatever. Obviously eradicating all wireless and other ES-causing factors would be preferable in the meantime!

Sean

--- In eSens@yahoogroups. com, Loni <loni326@... > wrote:
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

















     

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

It is interesting that most people including myself have gone through this Celiac Disease testing. For years I ate gluten free diet. I  always used ot say to my friends "the better the grain the bigger the pain."  I could tolerate some white bread as it has already been stripped of most wheat and gluten.
 
 Now that I have removed  myself from the RF torture, I can eat pastagalore and 12 grain bread and have a completely normal digestion. Digestion has been my measurement tool for years. When I was somewhere remote away form EMF my digestion would normalize in a day. Coming back to the EMF jungle, the same as before.  I thought it was due to stress in Toronto. Little did I know that it was an environmental EMF stress and not your regular everyday stress.
 
After researching Celiac to death this is what stuck with me and how I tested it many times.
 
Celiac disease affects a very small number of population and true patients are born with a defective genes. The only way to be truly diagnosed is bytaking a small intestinal sample and to have it examined.   I think what I had is Gluten Intolerance caused by ES. Other people may have it due to lack of enzymes and there could be many reasons for intestinal disbiosys in other words, the leaky gut syndrome.
 
This is how I tested it numerous times. Elaine Gotshall  dedicated her life to researching gluten intolerance and she wrote "Breaking the Vicious Cycle."  Her book describes the protocol on relieving gluten intolerance.Everyone suffering from your garden variety gluten intolerance and following this strict protocol would get better within days and usually cured within a year. There are many testimonials about this. However,  I was only having some improvement when following her protocol. I would stop and start it so many times always thinking, this time it will work. It never did.Nor did probiotics or many cleansing sessions an everything else I tried.  This is when I knew that my case was different, something else was creating my inability to create normal bowel even when on a gluten free diet. I just could not clue in to ES for many years.  
 
Later on this particular symptom was the key to the puzzle for me.  If you look at Gilligan's web page you will see that this was one of his symptoms. Everything I read about ES always lists this particular symptom.
 
 If we know that nutrients are taken at the end of the digestion process from the small intestine, it is easy to figure out that ES people suffer nutrient deficiency. Hence, our nervous system being undernourished and acting up. Many of my symptoms are nervous system related, probably all of us suffer from it. Again, I often refer to the Gilligan's page to see what he did about it. He mentioned Lechitin as one of the supplements to straighten nerves, I am sure there are many others.
 
Having resolved my digestion issue, I think I might be a little closer to acomplete recovery. I finally have some benefit from all the good food I am eating, in addition to all other synthetic stuff  I am ingesting.
 
So if you are in doubt if you suffer from a general gluten intolerance orES related gluten intolerance you can test it by trying Elaine's protocol and you will know within days.
 
Anyways, this my three cents.
 
 Sandra
 
 
 
 
 


--- On Fri, 9/11/09, Loni <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: Loni <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] new genetic molecule discovery (formerly "Het bitje..."
To: [hidden email]
Received: Friday, September 11, 2009, 8:37 AM


 



I think initial gut disorders could be the main trigger in our health decline. I have leaky gut but tested ok for celiac disease however I cannot tolerate gluten really. I try to stay away from it but it is very hard. In sooooooooooo many things you know.
 
70% of your immune system is your gut! so I am trying to heal my gut & support other organs as well as eating better. More raw foods for vitamins & minerals & ENZYMES!
 
EeeeeeSH! Lot of work.
 
Loni

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, Evie <evie15422@yahoo. com> wrote:

From: Evie <evie15422@yahoo. com>
Subject: Re: [eSens] new genetic molecule discovery (formerly "Het bitje..."
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 5:43 PM

 

Hi, Sandi,
 
This post will sound like I am saying every one here has celiac disease, but I don't believe that at all.  Just keep reading to get to the meat of what I am saying.....  Personally, I was told celiac disease causes an over-active immune system.  Celiac disease is at the heart of my liver problems too.  Run amok cytokines and inflammation loops.... are all too common in cd.  Cd is also linked to auto-immune diseases of every ilk and isitself an auto-immune disease.  (I am also type 2 diabetic, tho technically borderline, since I chose to arrest it there by a low-carb, no sugar orsugar alcohols diet before it got out of control.) 
 
I keep abreast of recent research as best I can.  Cd is also a channelopathy (an ion channel disease).  I bring this up because I have read that ES researchers and docs think ES has the potential to affect only 20% or so of the population.  Ion channel diseases are also thought to affect this many.  Dr Marios Hadjivassilious of the UK discovered a tight junction permeability gene (a channelopathy term) which he estimates exists in 20-23% of the population and without that gene you can have all the other cd genes but not get cd.  Now I have read that a celiac research doc has tiedthis to a genetic mutation precurser molecule which exists in approximately 20% of the population.  This part of the population includes cd and other auto-immune diseased people.  I am excited.  I hope it leads to a resolution of our problems, Sandi.  Some may consider this off-topic,but I really feel ES is connected into all of this.  You can read about this
molecule discovery here:
 
http://www.scienced aily.com/ releases/ 2009/09/09090716 2322.htm
 
This celiac pediatrician' s wife has MS, Sandi.  He started his research looking for a cure for MS.  His ultimate goal is to find a cure which addresses all the auto-immune diseases at one time.  I hope you can hold on to hope of a cure without doing something drastic and irreversible.  He has made great progress.
 
my best to you, Dear,
Diane
 

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, seandaly33 <seandaly33@ hotmail. com> wrote:

From: seandaly33 <seandaly33@ hotmail. com>
Subject: [eSens] Re: english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 1:47 PM

 

I would go along with those posts below stating that immune system problemshave to be the major cause in this whole issue, whether it has been damaged by external factors or internal health issues.

I myself have type 1 diabetes, basically caused by the immune system going haywire and attacking cells in the pancreas that produce insulin. So I often wondered if the immune system was the crux of my ES problem since becoming electrosensitive nearly three years ago. I did ask my doctor, who never heard of ES of course, whether I may have an immune problem. He did a normalblood test, and with the white blood cell count showing up ok, he determined that it wasn't an immune system issue. I have since gone on to learn, ashas been stated by others on this forum, that the immune system is a very complex system,and a simple blood test such as that doesn't give the whole picture. (As a matter of interest, has anyone gone to see an immunologist about the problem ever, or would it be worth the bother?)

Recently, my interest was taken by an article I came across in a science magazine related to the immune system and diabetes. Trials on type 1 diabetics carried out in Brazil, but run in coordination with an American university doctor, saw 15 participants basically having their immune systems shut down, and having new stem cells injected into their bodies to build a new, healthier immune system. For 13 of the 15 people, their "new" immune system stopped attacking their pancreatic cells, and they were able to stop taking insulin injections. see here: http://www.msnbc. msn.com/id/ 18040485/ .htm
The article does mention the danger of the procedure; the patients' old immune systems were shut down using chemotherapy, which is obviously dangerous. Other risks are involved also.
The article does go on to mention that this kind of procedure was also successful with other autoimmune diseases, such as lupus and multiple sclerosis. Obviously this kind of thing is still in the early stages of research anddevelopment, but I was just thinking, that it might offer some potential hope for something like ES if it is indeed an immune system malfunction or whatever. Obviously eradicating all wireless and other ES-causing factors would be preferable in the meantime!

Sean

--- In eSens@yahoogroups. com, Loni <loni326@... > wrote:
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

It's a UK product and can be bought from its manufacturers, EMFields Ltd,
the trading arm of A&J Phillips. Simple and basic, but cheap (just over £
50) and it works - in that it shows an MW signal is there and whether your
shielding has done any good. Sue carries it around also to detect any
"hidden" masts near houses, picnic areas, petrol stations etc.
 
I don't know whether this or an equivalent can be purchased in the USA -
anyone else know?
 
Ian

_____  

From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Loni
Sent: 11 September 2009 16:30
To: [hidden email]
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009


 

Where did you get the electrosmog detector?

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@
<mailto:ianandsue.kemp%40ukgateway.net> ukgateway.net> wrote:

From: Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ <mailto:ianandsue.kemp%40ukgateway.net>
ukgateway.net>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. <mailto:eSens%40yahoogroups.com> com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 3:41 PM

 

Yes, as you say, finding the underlying root cause is very hard, and often
expensive :-(

For antennas and masts, it's worth remembering that microwaves pass straight
through glass but are significantly absorbed by walls (brick, wood etc). Sue
found metallised netting, especially over windows, helped a lot. We could
see the difference easily using the "electrosmog detector" with or without
the netting.

Ian

_____

From: eSens@yahoogroups. com [mailto:eSens@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
Loni
Sent: 10 September 2009 17:58
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

Hi Diane & Ian:

When we get to the point where we are effected to this degree it has to be a
systemic failure of sorts. A wholistic approach is what is called for. The
question for us is what system in the body was initially weak that started
the cascade?! Which came first the chicken or the egg? Getting to the root
cause is the hard question.

If we treat the whole body we are going in the right direction & that starts
with the right kinds of foods in my experience.

The difficulty for me are the 8 and growing antennas outside my back window
that are visible. quarter mile away. Hard to fight when you are bombarded
you know.

Loni

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, Evie <evie15422@yahoo. <mailto:evie15422% 40yahoo.com>
com> wrote:

From: Evie <evie15422@yahoo. <mailto:evie15422% 40yahoo.com> com>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. <mailto:eSens% 40yahoogroups. com> com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 6:55 AM

Hi, Loni,

I agree with you also that the liver and (at least) the autonomic nervous
system are involved, along with the immune system. At least this seems to
be the case with me personally.

be well,
Diane
--- On Wed, 9/9/09, Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net> wrote:

From: Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Date: Wednesday, September 9, 2009, 7:01 PM

Hi Loni, yes definitely agree that liver and neurological system can play a
major part, I tend to lump them all together with immune system. Some of my
earlier posts in the archive describe how Sue has made progress and the
treatment she's had - but as Marc says, what works for one person may not
for another. Ideally one will find the root cause but there are a lot of
linked possibilities and the tests are expensive. Basically Sue is now able
to lead a much more normal life than 4 years ago, but we still turn the
power off at night and she doesn't use a computer and only infrequently
watches TV. Our current house is about a mile from the nearest mast. She
drove an old car for some years but can now manage a normal one, however we
have just managed to buy a newish car without central locking or electric
windows which is great for her. We avoid getting new furniture or other
things that offgas; if they do, we use an ozone generator - this reduces the
metabolic load on the liver.

Ian

_____

From: eSens@yahoogroups. com [mailto:eSens@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
Loni
Sent: 09 September 2009 18:54
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

I personally believe it is more than just immune system. I think it is liver
& nervous system damage as well. Living in the country as hard as that can
be being isolated is what we need to heal & have quality of life. Being in
the city & feeling miserable is just not worth it. Unfortuneatly, it's where
I have to be for now. Trying to make the best of it.

I'm working on healing the body but when it is constantly bombarded it makes
it very difficult. Loni

--- On Tue, 9/8/09, S.T. <stcro@rogers. <mailto:stcro% 40rogers. com> com>
wrote:

From: S.T. <stcro@rogers. <mailto:stcro% 40rogers. com> com>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. <mailto:eSens% 40yahoogroups. com> com
Date: Tuesday, September 8, 2009, 4:28 PM

I have a feeling that Charles has stumbled upon something big and hopefully
he finds it in his heart to share it with us, soon. I am dying to hear it. I
cannot imagine that I would be able to live back in Toronto. Not I do not
like it in the country just completely isolated and thinking of getting a
horse. LOL

--- On Tue, 9/8/09, Loni <loni326@yahoo. com> wrote:

From: Loni <loni326@yahoo. com>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Received: Tuesday, September 8, 2009, 8:28 AM

Where is the info on what to do to fix or improve the immune system? What
did your wife do to be able to handle all the electrosmog? Loni

--- On Sun, 9/6/09, Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net> wrote:

From: Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Date: Sunday, September 6, 2009, 5:44 PM

Perhaps the most interesting thing in Charles' publication is the test he
used, which actually shows a measurable response to an electrical stimulus.

Which leads to another big question, is this response different between
electrosensibles and "normal" people, if both are tested? Because if so, we
have a potential test to demonstrate that some people are ES under
conditions when most are OK. This would be an important step forward!

The suggested link between immune system weakness and susceptibility to ES
fits with lots of other evidence and suggestions made in this group over the
past few years. Worth noting, however, that there are a small number of
people whose medical histories do not seem to show any significant immune
problems (or MCS etc), including a couple of high-profile cases (Brian
Stein). However, these people seem to have been exposed to exceptionally
high levels of mobile phone radiation etc. So the two effects appear to be
partly additive.

Ian

_____

From: eSens@yahoogroups. com [mailto:eSens@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
charles@milieuziekt es.be
Sent: 23 August 2009 15:03
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Subject: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

Hello,

on: http://www.hetbitje <http://www.hetbitje .nl/bitjeE2909c. pdf>
.nl/bitjeE2909c. pdf

I have placed now the english version of my free publication of *het bitje*
September 2009.

In it I describe some measurements on electrosensible persons directly.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes. nl
www.milieuziektes. be
www.hetbitje. nl
www.fscan.be
checked by Norton

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thanks Ian, I'll look for it. Loni

--- On Sun, 9/13/09, Ian Kemp <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: Ian Kemp <[hidden email]>
Subject: RE: [eSens] electrosmog detector
To: [hidden email]
Date: Sunday, September 13, 2009, 2:42 AM


 



It's a UK product and can be bought from its manufacturers, EMFields Ltd,
the trading arm of A&J Phillips. Simple and basic, but cheap (just over £
50) and it works - in that it shows an MW signal is there and whether your
shielding has done any good. Sue carries it around also to detect any
"hidden" masts near houses, picnic areas, petrol stations etc.

I don't know whether this or an equivalent can be purchased in the USA -
anyone else know?

Ian

_____

From: eSens@yahoogroups. com [mailto:eSens@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of Loni
Sent: 11 September 2009 16:30
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

Where did you get the electrosmog detector?

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@
<mailto:ianandsue. kemp%40ukgateway .net> ukgateway.net> wrote:

From: Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ <mailto:ianandsue. kemp%40ukgateway .net>
ukgateway.net>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. <mailto:eSens% 40yahoogroups. com> com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 3:41 PM

Yes, as you say, finding the underlying root cause is very hard, and often
expensive :-(

For antennas and masts, it's worth remembering that microwaves pass straight
through glass but are significantly absorbed by walls (brick, wood etc). Sue
found metallised netting, especially over windows, helped a lot. We could
see the difference easily using the "electrosmog detector" with or without
the netting.

Ian

_____

From: eSens@yahoogroups. com [mailto:eSens@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
Loni
Sent: 10 September 2009 17:58
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

Hi Diane & Ian:

When we get to the point where we are effected to this degree it has to be a
systemic failure of sorts. A wholistic approach is what is called for. The
question for us is what system in the body was initially weak that started
the cascade?! Which came first the chicken or the egg? Getting to the root
cause is the hard question.

If we treat the whole body we are going in the right direction & that starts
with the right kinds of foods in my experience.

The difficulty for me are the 8 and growing antennas outside my back window
that are visible. quarter mile away. Hard to fight when you are bombarded
you know.

Loni

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, Evie <evie15422@yahoo. <mailto:evie15422% 40yahoo.com>
com> wrote:

From: Evie <evie15422@yahoo. <mailto:evie15422% 40yahoo.com> com>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. <mailto:eSens% 40yahoogroups. com> com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 6:55 AM

Hi, Loni,

I agree with you also that the liver and (at least) the autonomic nervous
system are involved, along with the immune system. At least this seems to
be the case with me personally.

be well,
Diane
--- On Wed, 9/9/09, Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net> wrote:

From: Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Date: Wednesday, September 9, 2009, 7:01 PM

Hi Loni, yes definitely agree that liver and neurological system can play a
major part, I tend to lump them all together with immune system. Some of my
earlier posts in the archive describe how Sue has made progress and the
treatment she's had - but as Marc says, what works for one person may not
for another. Ideally one will find the root cause but there are a lot of
linked possibilities and the tests are expensive. Basically Sue is now able
to lead a much more normal life than 4 years ago, but we still turn the
power off at night and she doesn't use a computer and only infrequently
watches TV. Our current house is about a mile from the nearest mast. She
drove an old car for some years but can now manage a normal one, however we
have just managed to buy a newish car without central locking or electric
windows which is great for her. We avoid getting new furniture or other
things that offgas; if they do, we use an ozone generator - this reduces the
metabolic load on the liver.

Ian

_____

From: eSens@yahoogroups. com [mailto:eSens@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
Loni
Sent: 09 September 2009 18:54
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

I personally believe it is more than just immune system. I think it is liver
& nervous system damage as well. Living in the country as hard as that can
be being isolated is what we need to heal & have quality of life. Being in
the city & feeling miserable is just not worth it. Unfortuneatly, it's where
I have to be for now. Trying to make the best of it.

I'm working on healing the body but when it is constantly bombarded it makes
it very difficult. Loni

--- On Tue, 9/8/09, S.T. <stcro@rogers. <mailto:stcro% 40rogers. com> com>
wrote:

From: S.T. <stcro@rogers. <mailto:stcro% 40rogers. com> com>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. <mailto:eSens% 40yahoogroups. com> com
Date: Tuesday, September 8, 2009, 4:28 PM

I have a feeling that Charles has stumbled upon something big and hopefully
he finds it in his heart to share it with us, soon. I am dying to hear it. I
cannot imagine that I would be able to live back in Toronto. Not I do not
like it in the country just completely isolated and thinking of getting a
horse. LOL

--- On Tue, 9/8/09, Loni <loni326@yahoo. com> wrote:

From: Loni <loni326@yahoo. com>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Received: Tuesday, September 8, 2009, 8:28 AM

Where is the info on what to do to fix or improve the immune system? What
did your wife do to be able to handle all the electrosmog? Loni

--- On Sun, 9/6/09, Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net> wrote:

From: Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Date: Sunday, September 6, 2009, 5:44 PM

Perhaps the most interesting thing in Charles' publication is the test he
used, which actually shows a measurable response to an electrical stimulus.

Which leads to another big question, is this response different between
electrosensibles and "normal" people, if both are tested? Because if so, we
have a potential test to demonstrate that some people are ES under
conditions when most are OK. This would be an important step forward!

The suggested link between immune system weakness and susceptibility to ES
fits with lots of other evidence and suggestions made in this group over the
past few years. Worth noting, however, that there are a small number of
people whose medical histories do not seem to show any significant immune
problems (or MCS etc), including a couple of high-profile cases (Brian
Stein). However, these people seem to have been exposed to exceptionally
high levels of mobile phone radiation etc. So the two effects appear to be
partly additive.

Ian

_____

From: eSens@yahoogroups. com [mailto:eSens@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
charles@milieuziekt es.be
Sent: 23 August 2009 15:03
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Subject: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

Hello,

on: http://www.hetbitje <http://www.hetbitje .nl/bitjeE2909c. pdf>
.nl/bitjeE2909c. pdf

I have placed now the english version of my free publication of *het bitje*
September 2009.

In it I describe some measurements on electrosensible persons directly.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes. nl
www.milieuziektes. be
www.hetbitje. nl
www.fscan.be
checked by Norton

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Hi, Sandra,
 
Interesting 3 cents!  My emails sometimes don't get across what I am trying to say.  This was exactly what I was trying to say.  The EMS can open up the gut and BBB barrier (probably thru tight junctions and ion channels) the same way celiac disease does.  EMS works the same way cd does.  If you are one with the permeability genetics, you are open to EMS, CD, andall the auto-immune diseases.
 
my 2 cents,  ;)
Diane

--- On Fri, 9/11/09, S.T. <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: S.T. <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] new genetic molecule discovery (formerly "Het bitje..."
To: [hidden email]
Date: Friday, September 11, 2009, 6:42 PM


 



It is interesting that most people including myself have gone through this Celiac Disease testing. For years I ate gluten free diet. I  always used ot say to my friends "the better the grain the bigger the pain."  I could tolerate some white bread as it has already been stripped of most wheat and gluten.
 
 Now that I have removed  myself from the RF torture, I can eat pastagalore and 12 grain bread and have a completely normal digestion. Digestion has been my measurement tool for years. When I was somewhere remote away form EMF my digestion would normalize in a day. Coming back to the EMF jungle, the same as before.  I thought it was due to stress in Toronto. Little did I know that it was an environmental EMF stress and not your regular everyday stress.
 
After researching Celiac to death this is what stuck with me and how I tested it many times.
 
Celiac disease affects a very small number of population and true patients are born with a defective genes. The only way to be truly diagnosed is bytaking a small intestinal sample and to have it examined.   I think what I had is Gluten Intolerance caused by ES. Other people may have it due to lack of enzymes and there could be many reasons for intestinal disbiosys in other words, the leaky gut syndrome.
 
This is how I tested it numerous times. Elaine Gotshall  dedicated her life to researching gluten intolerance and she wrote "Breaking the Vicious Cycle."  Her book describes the protocol on relieving gluten intolerance.Everyone suffering from your garden variety gluten intolerance and following this strict protocol would get better within days and usually cured within a year. There are many testimonials about this. However,  I was only having some improvement when following her protocol. I would stop and start it so many times always thinking, this time it will work. It never did.Nor did probiotics or many cleansing sessions an everything else I tried.  This is when I knew that my case was different, something else was creating my inability to create normal bowel even when on a gluten free diet. I just could not clue in to ES for many years.  
 
Later on this particular symptom was the key to the puzzle for me.  If you look at Gilligan's web page you will see that this was one of his symptoms. Everything I read about ES always lists this particular symptom.
 
 If we know that nutrients are taken at the end of the digestion process from the small intestine, it is easy to figure out that ES people suffer nutrient deficiency. Hence, our nervous system being undernourished and acting up. Many of my symptoms are nervous system related, probably all of us suffer from it. Again, I often refer to the Gilligan's page to see what he did about it. He mentioned Lechitin as one of the supplements to straighten nerves, I am sure there are many others.
 
Having resolved my digestion issue, I think I might be a little closer to acomplete recovery. I finally have some benefit from all the good food I am eating, in addition to all other synthetic stuff  I am ingesting.
 
So if you are in doubt if you suffer from a general gluten intolerance orES related gluten intolerance you can test it by trying Elaine' s protocol and you will know within days.
 
Anyways, this my three cents.
 
 Sandra
 
 
 
 
 

--- On Fri, 9/11/09, Loni <loni326@yahoo. com> wrote:

From: Loni <loni326@yahoo. com>
Subject: Re: [eSens] new genetic molecule discovery (formerly "Het bitje..."
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Received: Friday, September 11, 2009, 8:37 AM

 

I think initial gut disorders could be the main trigger in our health decline. I have leaky gut but tested ok for celiac disease however I cannot tolerate gluten really. I try to stay away from it but it is very hard. In sooooooooooo many things you know.
 
70% of your immune system is your gut! so I am trying to heal my gut & support other organs as well as eating better. More raw foods for vitamins & minerals & ENZYMES!
 
EeeeeeSH! Lot of work.
 
Loni

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, Evie <evie15422@yahoo. com> wrote:

From: Evie <evie15422@yahoo. com>
Subject: Re: [eSens] new genetic molecule discovery (formerly "Het bitje..."
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 5:43 PM

 

Hi, Sandi,
 
This post will sound like I am saying every one here has celiac disease, but I don't believe that at all.  Just keep reading to get to the meat of what I am saying.....  Personally, I was told celiac disease causes an over-active immune system.  Celiac disease is at the heart of my liver problems too.  Run amok cytokines and inflammation loops.... are all too common in cd.  Cd is also linked to auto-immune diseases of every ilk and isitself an auto-immune disease.  (I am also type 2 diabetic, tho technically borderline, since I chose to arrest it there by a low-carb, no sugar orsugar alcohols diet before it got out of control.) 
 
I keep abreast of recent research as best I can.  Cd is also a channelopathy (an ion channel disease).  I bring this up because I have read that ES researchers and docs think ES has the potential to affect only 20% or so of the population.  Ion channel diseases are also thought to affect this many.  Dr Marios Hadjivassilious of the UK discovered a tight junction permeability gene (a channelopathy term) which he estimates exists in 20-23% of the population and without that gene you can have all the other cd genes but not get cd.  Now I have read that a celiac research doc has tiedthis to a genetic mutation precurser molecule which exists in approximately 20% of the population.  This part of the population includes cd and other auto-immune diseased people.  I am excited.  I hope it leads to a resolution of our problems, Sandi.  Some may consider this off-topic,but I really feel ES is connected into all of this.  You can read about this
molecule discovery here:
 
http://www.scienced aily.com/ releases/ 2009/09/09090716 2322.htm
 
This celiac pediatrician' s wife has MS, Sandi.  He started his research looking for a cure for MS.  His ultimate goal is to find a cure which addresses all the auto-immune diseases at one time.  I hope you can hold on to hope of a cure without doing something drastic and irreversible.  He has made great progress.
 
my best to you, Dear,
Diane
 

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, seandaly33 <seandaly33@ hotmail. com> wrote:

From: seandaly33 <seandaly33@ hotmail. com>
Subject: [eSens] Re: english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 1:47 PM

 

I would go along with those posts below stating that immune system problemshave to be the major cause in this whole issue, whether it has been damaged by external factors or internal health issues.

I myself have type 1 diabetes, basically caused by the immune system going haywire and attacking cells in the pancreas that produce insulin. So I often wondered if the immune system was the crux of my ES problem since becoming electrosensitive nearly three years ago. I did ask my doctor, who never heard of ES of course, whether I may have an immune problem. He did a normalblood test, and with the white blood cell count showing up ok, he determined that it wasn't an immune system issue. I have since gone on to learn, ashas been stated by others on this forum, that the immune system is a very complex system,and a simple blood test such as that doesn't give the whole picture. (As a matter of interest, has anyone gone to see an immunologist about the problem ever, or would it be worth the bother?)

Recently, my interest was taken by an article I came across in a science magazine related to the immune system and diabetes. Trials on type 1 diabetics carried out in Brazil, but run in coordination with an American university doctor, saw 15 participants basically having their immune systems shut down, and having new stem cells injected into their bodies to build a new, healthier immune system. For 13 of the 15 people, their "new" immune system stopped attacking their pancreatic cells, and they were able to stop taking insulin injections. see here: http://www.msnbc. msn.com/id/ 18040485/ .htm
The article does mention the danger of the procedure; the patients' old immune systems were shut down using chemotherapy, which is obviously dangerous. Other risks are involved also.
The article does go on to mention that this kind of procedure was also successful with other autoimmune diseases, such as lupus and multiple sclerosis. Obviously this kind of thing is still in the early stages of research anddevelopment, but I was just thinking, that it might offer some potential hope for something like ES if it is indeed an immune system malfunction or whatever. Obviously eradicating all wireless and other ES-causing factors would be preferable in the meantime!

Sean

--- In eSens@yahoogroups. com, Loni <loni326@... > wrote:
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In a message dated 13/09/2009 18:34:41 GMT Daylight Time, [hidden email]
writes:

It's a UK product and can be bought from its manufacturers, EMFields Ltd,
the trading arm of A&J Phillips. Simple and basic, but cheap (just over £
50) and it works - in that it shows an MW signal is there and whether your
shielding has done any good. Sue carries it around also to detect any
"hidden" masts near houses, picnic areas, petrol stations etc.

I don't know whether this or an equivalent can be purchased in the USA


pAUL UK REPLIES - I have had this product for a few years now and yes its
very god but dont forget that some of the wireless applications now work at
higher frequencies to the max 3 gig that the esmog detector works to. A  
simple AM radio, trial and error to find a good one, is also a good tool,  
especially for finding those hot spots on walls whre your neighbours tv or  
sattelite gear is sited, it is also good at finding dirty power issues much  
unerestimeted by Essers I think, Its not just the purposeful radiowave  
applications that threaten our health but often consumer products such as TVs  
computers etc that can turn your dwelling wiring into a radiowave feeder at  
goodness knows what manner of frequencies. Theu say keep your enemies close  
butin our case keep them as far away as possible !
 
puk


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Which detector would work for emissions of 3 gigs?? Both in US or UK. It might be cheaper in the US?? Fnx.


--- In [hidden email], paulpjc@... wrote:

In a message dated 13/09/2009 21:54:40 GMT Daylight Time,
[hidden email] writes:

Which detector would work for emissions of 3 gigs?? Both in US or UK. It
might be cheaper in the US?? Fnx.




tHE BRITISH eLECTROSMOG DETECTOR PICKS UP MAX 3 GIG, BUT MANY APPLICATIONS
ARE MOVING TO HIGHER FREQUENCIES SUCH AS 5-6GIG


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Are there no policies against this happening? This seems to be above safetylevel...


--- In [hidden email], paulpjc@... wrote:

The new detector will be very interesting Charles! Can you give us any
further details yet, e.g. likely price? Will it be available in Europe, UK
and US?
Ian

_____

From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
[hidden email]
Sent: 11 September 2009 16:36
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009




Soon I will show a very new detector, especially developed for
electrosensibles.
Very, very sensitive.
Range from 10 MHz up to 10 GHz.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
www.milieuziektes.be
www.hetbitje.nl
checked by Norton

----- Original Message -----
From: "Loni" <loni326@yahoo. <mailto:loni326%40yahoo.com> com>
To: <eSens@yahoogroups. <mailto:eSens%40yahoogroups.com> com>
Sent: Friday, September 11, 2009 5:29 PM
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

Where did you get the electrosmog detector?

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@
<mailto:ianandsue.kemp%40ukgateway.net> ukgateway.net> wrote:

From: Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ <mailto:ianandsue.kemp%40ukgateway.net>
ukgateway.net>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. <mailto:eSens%40yahoogroups.com> com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 3:41 PM

Yes, as you say, finding the underlying root cause is very hard, and often
expensive :-(

For antennas and masts, it's worth remembering that microwaves pass straight
through glass but are significantly absorbed by walls (brick, wood etc). Sue
found metallised netting, especially over windows, helped a lot. We could
see the difference easily using the "electrosmog detector" with or without
the netting.

Ian

_____

From: eSens@yahoogroups. com [mailto:eSens@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
Loni
Sent: 10 September 2009 17:58
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

Hi Diane & Ian:

When we get to the point where we are effected to this degree it has to be a
systemic failure of sorts. A wholistic approach is what is called for. The
question for us is what system in the body was initially weak that started
the cascade?! Which came first the chicken or the egg? Getting to the root
cause is the hard question.

If we treat the whole body we are going in the right direction & that starts
with the right kinds of foods in my experience.

The difficulty for me are the 8 and growing antennas outside my back window
that are visible. quarter mile away. Hard to fight when you are bombarded
you know.

Loni

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, Evie <evie15422@yahoo. <mailto:evie15422% 40yahoo.com>
com> wrote:

From: Evie <evie15422@yahoo. <mailto:evie15422% 40yahoo.com> com>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. <mailto:eSens% 40yahoogroups. com> com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 6:55 AM

Hi, Loni,

I agree with you also that the liver and (at least) the autonomic nervous
system are involved, along with the immune system. At least this seems to
be the case with me personally.

be well,
Diane
--- On Wed, 9/9/09, Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net> wrote:

From: Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Date: Wednesday, September 9, 2009, 7:01 PM

Hi Loni, yes definitely agree that liver and neurological system can play a
major part, I tend to lump them all together with immune system. Some of my
earlier posts in the archive describe how Sue has made progress and the
treatment she's had - but as Marc says, what works for one person may not
for another. Ideally one will find the root cause but there are a lot of
linked possibilities and the tests are expensive. Basically Sue is now able
to lead a much more normal life than 4 years ago, but we still turn the
power off at night and she doesn't use a computer and only infrequently
watches TV. Our current house is about a mile from the nearest mast. She
drove an old car for some years but can now manage a normal one, however we
have just managed to buy a newish car without central locking or electric
windows which is great for her. We avoid getting new furniture or other
things that offgas; if they do, we use an ozone generator - this reduces the
metabolic load on the liver.

Ian

_____

From: eSens@yahoogroups. com [mailto:eSens@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
Loni
Sent: 09 September 2009 18:54
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

I personally believe it is more than just immune system. I think it is liver
& nervous system damage as well. Living in the country as hard as that can
be being isolated is what we need to heal & have quality of life. Being in
the city & feeling miserable is just not worth it. Unfortuneatly, it's where
I have to be for now. Trying to make the best of it.

I'm working on healing the body but when it is constantly bombarded it makes
it very difficult. Loni

--- On Tue, 9/8/09, S.T. <stcro@rogers. <mailto:stcro% 40rogers. com> com>
wrote:

From: S.T. <stcro@rogers. <mailto:stcro% 40rogers. com> com>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. <mailto:eSens% 40yahoogroups. com> com
Date: Tuesday, September 8, 2009, 4:28 PM

I have a feeling that Charles has stumbled upon something big and hopefully
he finds it in his heart to share it with us, soon. I am dying to hear it. I
cannot imagine that I would be able to live back in Toronto. Not I do not
like it in the country just completely isolated and thinking of getting a
horse. LOL

--- On Tue, 9/8/09, Loni <loni326@yahoo. com> wrote:

From: Loni <loni326@yahoo. com>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Received: Tuesday, September 8, 2009, 8:28 AM

Where is the info on what to do to fix or improve the immune system? What
did your wife do to be able to handle all the electrosmog? Loni

--- On Sun, 9/6/09, Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net> wrote:

From: Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Date: Sunday, September 6, 2009, 5:44 PM

Perhaps the most interesting thing in Charles' publication is the test he
used, which actually shows a measurable response to an electrical stimulus.

Which leads to another big question, is this response different between
electrosensibles and "normal" people, if both are tested? Because if so, we
have a potential test to demonstrate that some people are ES under
conditions when most are OK. This would be an important step forward!

The suggested link between immune system weakness and susceptibility to ES
fits with lots of other evidence and suggestions made in this group over the
past few years. Worth noting, however, that there are a small number of
people whose medical histories do not seem to show any significant immune
problems (or MCS etc), including a couple of high-profile cases (Brian
Stein). However, these people seem to have been exposed to exceptionally
high levels of mobile phone radiation etc. So the two effects appear to be
partly additive.

Ian

_____

From: eSens@yahoogroups. com [mailto:eSens@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
charles@milieuziekt es.be
Sent: 23 August 2009 15:03
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Subject: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

Hello,

on: http://www.hetbitje <http://www.hetbitje .nl/bitjeE2909c. pdf>
.nl/bitjeE2909c. pdf

I have placed now the english version of my free publication of *het bitje*
September 2009.

In it I describe some measurements on electrosensible persons directly.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes. nl
www.milieuziektes. be
www.hetbitje. nl
www.fscan.be
checked by Norton

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------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

In answer to Loni's question; magnesium sulphate is a simple compound and
both components can be beneficial. It also has the big advantage of being
cheap and easily available as "Epsom salts" - not a drug or supplement.

Magnesium is an essential mineral and can have particular benefits in
reducing inflammation etc. Sue has found it makes a big difference in
reducing the effect of her ES-induced tinnitus. It's considered to help the
nerve system, combat stress and some other diseases such as osteoporosis.

Sulphate is one of the 4 key "Phase 2" liver detox pathways which help us
metabolise the things we eat and drink. If it's very low, the extra load is
thrown on other detox pathways or the substance may not be metabolised at
all and just builds up. Normally supplementation with cysteine or MSM is
used to help increase sulphur levels and the body converts this to sulphate.
However in Sue's case we found her cysteine levels were OK but sulphate
appallingly low, so her body isn't doing the conversion process. So she
needs direct magnesium sulphate supplementation - which is cheaper than MSM
or cysteine anyway.

Magnesium sulphate can be taken in 4 ways:
1. Orally, by dissolving Epsom salts in water and drinking it. Cheap and
easy, but if your gut is damaged (e.g. failing a leaky gut test), it may not
absorb by this route.
2. Through the skin, by dissolving Epsom salts in a bowl of water and using
it as a footbath. Again cheap, and usually very effective. Keep the dose
low at first, as you may detox a lot of accumulated toxins from the body
very suddenly and feel ill - this happened to Sue.
3. By injections. Effective, but can be painful (not from the needle, but
localised cramps and pain)
4. By intravenous infusion. The most effective method, gives a precise
quantity and delivers it straight into the bloodstream, but expensive
because it must be done at a clinic or private hospital. Again, can give
pain and cramps if too high a dose is used.

In large doses, magnesium sulphate is a laxative, so take care :-) James
Herriot, who wrote a very popular and entertaining series of books about
life as a vet (familar to UK readers but probably not in North America?)
described how, in the days before drugs, he successfully treated calves for
lead poisoning (caused by them licking old paint) using Epsom salts, and the
farmer's comment "Eey-ar, you'll skitter the poor beggars to death!" But it
worked - basically another detoxification process.

Ian

_____

From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Loni
Sent: 11 September 2009 16:25
To: [hidden email]
Subject: RE: [eSens] liver treatments, cavitations, thyroid etc




Oh thanks Ian. I do the injectable glutitithione myself. What does the mag
sulphate do if you know? I'll have to look in to that. I also have low
glutithione. Loni

--- On Thu, 9/10/09, Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@
<mailto:ianandsue.kemp%40ukgateway.net> ukgateway.net> wrote:

From: Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ <mailto:ianandsue.kemp%40ukgateway.net>
ukgateway.net>
Subject: RE: [eSens] liver treatments, cavitations, thyroid etc
To: eSens@yahoogroups. <mailto:eSens%40yahoogroups.com> com
Date: Thursday, September 10, 2009, 3:34 PM



Hi Loni, the most successful treatment for Sue has been intravenous
infusions, particularly glutathione and magnesium sulphate. She had tests
which showed that these essential liver chemicals were low (confirmed more
recently by a genetic test). So for other people with a different root
cause, this may not work. We tried lots of other things such as acupuncture
and bioresonance machines which had no effect (or sometimes made things
worse).

One thing that did help was that the problems had begun when she had had her
wisdom teeth out (giving chronic fatigue symptoms) and one area of jaw was
tender, so we went to a cavitation dentist and he found a cavity which he
opened and mended, after which Sue did a lot better. We didn't dare do a
Cavitat scan at the time, but had one a couple of years later which showed
everything was now OK. There is also increasing evidence that general
anasthetic can seriously harm some people with susceptible immune systems,
and Sue had it for her extraction. This is what makes things so confusing,
lots of factors all rolled in together.

Sue was also found to have borderline low thyroid and a poor conversion of
T4 to T3. She did not benefit from standard thyroxine (T4 only) but is
definitely helped by small doses of Armour thyroid (T4/T3 mixed) -this keep
her more mentally alert and reduces "brain fog".

Ian

_____

From: eSens@yahoogroups. com [mailto:eSens@yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
Loni
Sent: 10 September 2009 17:46
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

Hi Ian: What treatment did she find that worked the most for her? I am
considering NAET or some type of acupuncture. Loni

--- On Wed, 9/9/09, Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@
<mailto:ianandsue. kemp%40ukgateway .net> ukgateway.net> wrote:

From: Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ <mailto:ianandsue. kemp%40ukgateway .net>
ukgateway.net>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. <mailto:eSens% 40yahoogroups. com> com
Date: Wednesday, September 9, 2009, 4:01 PM

Hi Loni, yes definitely agree that liver and neurological system can play a
major part, I tend to lump them all together with immune system. Some of my
earlier posts in the archive describe how Sue has made progress and the
treatment she's had - but as Marc says, what works for one person may not
for another. Ideally one will find the root cause but there are a lot of
linked possibilities and the tests are expensive. Basically Sue is now able
to lead a much more normal life than 4 years ago, but we still turn the
power off at night and she doesn't use a computer and only infrequently
watches TV. Our current house is about a mile from the nearest mast. She
drove an old car for some years but can now manage a normal one, however we
have just managed to buy a newish car without central locking or electric
windows which is great for her. We avoid getting new furniture or other
things that offgas; if they do, we use an ozone generator - this reduces the
metabolic load on the liver.

Ian

_____

From: eSens@yahoogroups. com [mailto:eSens@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
Loni
Sent: 09 September 2009 18:54
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

I personally believe it is more than just immune system. I think it is liver
& nervous system damage as well. Living in the country as hard as that can
be being isolated is what we need to heal & have quality of life. Being in
the city & feeling miserable is just not worth it. Unfortuneatly, it's where
I have to be for now. Trying to make the best of it.

I'm working on healing the body but when it is constantly bombarded it makes
it very difficult. Loni

--- On Tue, 9/8/09, S.T. <stcro@rogers. <mailto:stcro% 40rogers. com> com>
wrote:

From: S.T. <stcro@rogers. <mailto:stcro% 40rogers. com> com>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. <mailto:eSens% 40yahoogroups. com> com
Date: Tuesday, September 8, 2009, 4:28 PM

I have a feeling that Charles has stumbled upon something big and hopefully
he finds it in his heart to share it with us, soon. I am dying to hear it. I
cannot imagine that I would be able to live back in Toronto. Not I do not
like it in the country just completely isolated and thinking of getting a
horse. LOL

--- On Tue, 9/8/09, Loni <loni326@yahoo. com> wrote:

From: Loni <loni326@yahoo. com>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Received: Tuesday, September 8, 2009, 8:28 AM

Where is the info on what to do to fix or improve the immune system? What
did your wife do to be able to handle all the electrosmog? Loni

--- On Sun, 9/6/09, Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net> wrote:

From: Ian Kemp <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net>
Subject: RE: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Date: Sunday, September 6, 2009, 5:44 PM

Perhaps the most interesting thing in Charles' publication is the test he
used, which actually shows a measurable response to an electrical stimulus.

Which leads to another big question, is this response different between
electrosensibles and "normal" people, if both are tested? Because if so, we
have a potential test to demonstrate that some people are ES under
conditions when most are OK. This would be an important step forward!

The suggested link between immune system weakness and susceptibility to ES
fits with lots of other evidence and suggestions made in this group over the
past few years. Worth noting, however, that there are a small number of
people whose medical histories do not seem to show any significant immune
problems (or MCS etc), including a couple of high-profile cases (Brian
Stein). However, these people seem to have been exposed to exceptionally
high levels of mobile phone radiation etc. So the two effects appear to be
partly additive.

Ian

_____

From: eSens@yahoogroups. com [mailto:eSens@ yahoogroups. com] On Behalf Of
charles@milieuziekt es.be
Sent: 23 August 2009 15:03
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Subject: [eSens] english version of *het bitje* september 2009

Hello,

on: http://www.hetbitje <http://www.hetbitje .nl/bitjeE2909c. pdf>
.nl/bitjeE2909c. pdf

I have placed now the english version of my free publication of *het bitje*
September 2009.

In it I describe some measurements on electrosensible persons directly.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes. nl
www.milieuziektes. be
www.hetbitje. nl
www.fscan.be
checked by Norton

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hello Ian,

I have no details at the moment.
But it will be available soon in Europe and the US.
(The UK is within Europe, I thought. ;o) )

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
www.milieuziektes.be
www.hetbitje.nl
checked by Norton




----- Original Message -----
From: "Ian Kemp" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 12:51 AM
Subject: RE: [eSens] new electrosmog detector

In a message dated 13/09/2009 22:05:30 GMT Daylight Time,
[hidden email] writes:

tHE BRITISH eLECTROSMOG DETECTOR PICKS UP MAX 3 GIG, BUT MANY APPLICATIONS

> ARE MOVING TO HIGHER FREQUENCIES SUCH AS 5-6GIG



puk replies - no they are within the spectrum of frequencies that are
licensed for such use


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

The higher frequency bands are also licensed.
Coming is the 2.6 GHz band.
Wimax 3.5 Ghz is already there.
WLAN 5.15, 5.25, 5.47 and 5.725 GHz.

And don't forget, that the analogue TV band of 700 MHz will be free as of 1
January 2010, and will be used for also mobile phone, that is some sort of
Wimax, with CIFDM technology.
The present COFDM technology of Wimax cannot be used in this 700 MHz band.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
www.milieuziektes.be
www.hetbitje.nl
checked by Norton




----- Original Message -----
From: <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 10:24 AM
Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: electrosmog detector

In a message dated 14/09/2009 10:19:04 GMT Daylight Time,
[hidden email] writes:

The higher frequency bands are also licensed.
Coming is the 2.6 GHz band.
Wimax 3.5 Ghz is already there.
WLAN 5.15, 5.25, 5.47 and 5.725 GHz.

And don't forget, that the analogue TV band of 700 MHz will be free as of
1
January 2010, and will be used for also mobile phone, that is some sort of
Wimax, with CIFDM technology.
The present COFDM technology of Wimax cannot be used in this 700 MHz band.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens



puk - Yes we have a roller coaster ride on its way and we get to ride for
free so hold onto your seats !


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> However in Sue's case we found her cysteine levels were OK but sulphate
> appallingly low, so her body isn't doing the conversion process.

Ian,
what you write here about sulphur-to-sulphate-conversion is interesting.
I have over the last couple of years developed tics (unvolunteer muscle contractions, or 'jerks'). It seems to increase when I eat sulphur-containing foods (like eggs, kale, onions). Could it perhaps be that my abillity to convert sulphur to sulphate is very low?

I still don't see how an 'accumulation' of sulphur (cystein etc.) would (biochemically) cause the tics though.
Perhaps anybody has any ideas/explainations?

Is it the liver which does the sulphur-to-sulphate conversion?
Is this conversion perhaps a part of the sulphate detox pathway, or is thistwo seperate processes?

Ian, can you tell me what kind of test one should do to find out how the sulphate liver-detox pathway is functioning? (Name and lab.)
Or perhaps there's another test which just measures sulphate and cysteine in blood?

James
> Herriot, who wrote a very popular and entertaining series of books about
> life as a vet (familar to UK readers but probably not in North America?)
> described how, in the days before drugs, he successfully treated calves for
> lead poisoning (caused by them licking old paint) using Epsom salts

This is very interesting!
So: Is it the Magnesium or the Sulphate which detoxifies lead?
Is it perhaps the sulphate which makes the liver's ability to detoxify leadincrease?
It is recommended by many 'experts' to eat cystein-rich foods (or take N-acetyl-cystein as a supplement) when dealing with heavy metal detoxification.I always thought that it was for the thiol-groups in cystein, which would have an affinity to e.g. mercury, but perhaps cystein is recommended because it (after first being converted to sulphate) increases the 'strength' of the sulphate-detox-pathway in the liver?
If so, if one is low in sulphate, it seems crusial to get sulphate in supplement-form (epsom salts) in order to deal with heavy-metal-detoxification.
Does anybody know more about this?

Regards,
John O.

>I don't know whether this or an equivalent can be purchased in the USA -
anyone else know?

Electrosmog Detector is available in US here:
http://www.lessemf.com/rf2.html#442

Emil

 Soon I will show a very new detector, especially developed for
> electrosensibles.
> Very, very sensitive.
> Range from 10 MHz up to 10 GHz.
 
 
Hi Charles,
 
Ok, I might be missing something here but we have been holding our breathsince you told us about fixing immune system and the ability to function in a EMF jungle. I am not seeing a relationship between a detector andthe immune system improvement. If you are charging for your findings I understand, nothing is free and that can be discussed.

Sandra

--- On Sun, 9/13/09, [hidden email] <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] new electrosmog detector
To: [hidden email]
Received: Sunday, September 13, 2009, 11:15 PM


 



Hello Ian,

I have no details at the moment.
But it will be available soon in Europe and the US.
(The UK is within Europe, I thought. ;o) )

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes. nl
www.milieuziektes. be
www.hetbitje. nl
checked by Norton

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ian Kemp" <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net>
To: <eSens@yahoogroups. com>
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 12:51 AM
Subject: RE: [eSens] new electrosmog detector
















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hello Sandra,

you are missing something indeed.

You are not seeing a relationship between a detector and the immune system
improvement.
Well, first of all, in order to start the healing process, you should be in
an elektrosmog-poor environment.
And that can only be determind with some sort of detector.

Personnally, I am not fond of the aforementioned Electrosmog Detector.
I have one, but find, that it starts at a too high level, giving a false
feeling of securtity.

Since there is a demand for a good detector within a wider range of
frequencies, I could persuade somebody to develope such a metering devoce.
The technical detector part is ready, and it is much more sensitive than was
expected for.
Now they are developing the housing.
Beware, it is a broadband detector, not a meter!

The price should be around 150 Euro.

As soon as I have more details I will post it here.

That the american dollar is expensive now is not our fault, but those of the
americans who let the Marxx Brothers go broke, and other banks, which
started the Crisis we are now in.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
www.milieuziektes.be
www.hetbitje.nl
checked by Norton




----- Original Message -----
From: "S.T." <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 4:49 PM
Subject: Re: [eSens] new electrosmog detector



Soon I will show a very new detector, especially developed for
> electrosensibles.
> Very, very sensitive.
> Range from 10 MHz up to 10 GHz.


Hi Charles,

Ok, I might be missing something here but we have been holding our breath
since you told us about fixing immune system and the ability to function in
a EMF jungle. I am not seeing a relationship between a detector and the
immune system improvement. If you are charging for your findings I
understand, nothing is free and that can be discussed.

Sandra

--- On Sun, 9/13/09, [hidden email] <[hidden email]>
wrote:


From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] new electrosmog detector
To: [hidden email]
Received: Sunday, September 13, 2009, 11:15 PM






Hello Ian,

I have no details at the moment.
But it will be available soon in Europe and the US.
(The UK is within Europe, I thought. ;o) )

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes. nl
www.milieuziektes. be
www.hetbitje. nl
checked by Norton

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ian Kemp" <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net>
To: <eSens@yahoogroups. com>
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 12:51 AM
Subject: RE: [eSens] new electrosmog detector
















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

Charles,
Do you have any time frame that you think it will be available? Loni

--- On Mon, 9/14/09, [hidden email] <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] new electrosmog detector
To: [hidden email]
Date: Monday, September 14, 2009, 8:08 AM


 



Hello Sandra,

you are missing something indeed.

You are not seeing a relationship between a detector and the immune system
improvement.
Well, first of all, in order to start the healing process, you should be in
an elektrosmog- poor environment.
And that can only be determind with some sort of detector.

Personnally, I am not fond of the aforementioned Electrosmog Detector.
I have one, but find, that it starts at a too high level, giving a false
feeling of securtity.

Since there is a demand for a good detector within a wider range of
frequencies, I could persuade somebody to develope such a metering devoce.
The technical detector part is ready, and it is much more sensitive than was
expected for.
Now they are developing the housing.
Beware, it is a broadband detector, not a meter!

The price should be around 150 Euro.

As soon as I have more details I will post it here.

That the american dollar is expensive now is not our fault, but those of the
americans who let the Marxx Brothers go broke, and other banks, which
started the Crisis we are now in.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes. nl
www.milieuziektes. be
www.hetbitje. nl
checked by Norton

----- Original Message -----
From: "S.T." <stcro@rogers. com>
To: <eSens@yahoogroups. com>
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 4:49 PM
Subject: Re: [eSens] new electrosmog detector

Soon I will show a very new detector, especially developed for
> electrosensibles.
> Very, very sensitive.
> Range from 10 MHz up to 10 GHz.

Hi Charles,

Ok, I might be missing something here but we have been holding our breath
since you told us about fixing immune system and the ability to function in
a EMF jungle. I am not seeing a relationship between a detector and the
immune system improvement. If you are charging for your findings I
understand, nothing is free and that can be discussed.

Sandra

--- On Sun, 9/13/09, charles@milieuziekt es.be <charles@milieuziekt es.be>
wrote:

From: charles@milieuziekt es.be <charles@milieuziekt es.be>
Subject: Re: [eSens] new electrosmog detector
To: eSens@yahoogroups. com
Received: Sunday, September 13, 2009, 11:15 PM

Hello Ian,

I have no details at the moment.
But it will be available soon in Europe and the US.
(The UK is within Europe, I thought. ;o) )

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes. nl
www.milieuziektes. be
www.hetbitje. nl
checked by Norton

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ian Kemp" <ianandsue.kemp@ ukgateway. net>
To: <eSens@yahoogroups. com>
Sent: Monday, September 14, 2009 12:51 AM
Subject: RE: [eSens] new electrosmog detector

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------ --------- --------- ------

Yahoo! Groups Links

















     

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]