Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

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Marc Martin

Feb 20, 2010; 11:55pm

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

Administrator

> What supplements do you take? I read in one of your posts that your level
> of sensitivity has decreased.

I take a lot of supplements, and it varies from year to year, but they
are often low-potency, whole-food type supplements (as I tend to react
to the high potency, synthetic stuff). For reduction of ES symptoms, I
find several supplements quite helpful:

- H-Minus, by e3Live (antioxidant)
- Cellfood, by Lumina Health (antioxidant, minerals)
- Eleuthero, by Medi-Herb (siberian ginseng, good for radiation exposure)
- NDF, by BioRay (heavy metal detox)
- Echinacea Premium, by Medi-Herb (immune support, blood cleanser)
- Cholocol II, by Standard Process (bentonite clay absorbs gut toxins)
- Cataplex ACP, by Standard Process (whole food vitamin A and C, plus bioflavenoids)
- Agrisept-L (immune support, fungus fighter)

I also use some adrenal support supplements to fight fatigue
(IsoCort, Dr. Wilson's Adrenal Rebuilder).

Also, lately I've been experimenting with OSR and alpha lipoic acid
for heavy metal removal (which actually makes my ES worse while
taking these), and OKG, as my doctor thinks my liver is not properly
converting ammonia into urea (seemed helpful at first, but not
so sure now).

Also, skin lotion is helpful for "face burning" symptoms from
excessive computer use (e.g. Shikai Borage Oil skin lotion).
The most helpful skin thing I've found is USF ointment from
Standard Process, but that stuff stinks (fragrance?) and makes
my skin look greasy.

Marc

Loni Rosser

Feb 22, 2010; 2:12am

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

What do you think of the Adrenal Rebuilder? Loni

--- On Sat, 2/20/10, Marc Martin <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: Marc Martin <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?
To: [hidden email]
Date: Saturday, February 20, 2010, 4:55 PM

> What supplements do you take? I read in one of your posts that your level
> of sensitivity has decreased.

I take a lot of supplements, and it varies from year to year, but they
are often low-potency, whole-food type supplements (as I tend to react
to the high potency, synthetic stuff). For reduction of ES symptoms, I
find several supplements quite helpful:

- H-Minus, by e3Live (antioxidant)
- Cellfood, by Lumina Health (antioxidant, minerals)
- Eleuthero, by Medi-Herb (siberian ginseng, good for radiation exposure)
- NDF, by BioRay (heavy metal detox)
- Echinacea Premium, by Medi-Herb (immune support, blood cleanser)
- Cholocol II, by Standard Process (bentonite clay absorbs gut toxins)
- Cataplex ACP, by Standard Process (whole food vitamin A and C, plus bioflavenoids)
- Agrisept-L (immune support, fungus fighter)

I also use some adrenal support supplements to fight fatigue
(IsoCort, Dr. Wilson's Adrenal Rebuilder).

Also, lately I've been experimenting with OSR and alpha lipoic acid
for heavy metal removal (which actually makes my ES worse while
taking these), and OKG, as my doctor thinks my liver is not properly
converting ammonia into urea (seemed helpful at first, but not
so sure now).

Also, skin lotion is helpful for "face burning" symptoms from
excessive computer use (e.g. Shikai Borage Oil skin lotion).
The most helpful skin thing I've found is USF ointment from
Standard Process, but that stuff stinks (fragrance?) and makes
my skin look greasy.

Marc

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Marc Martin

Feb 22, 2010; 2:23am

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

Administrator

> What do you think of the Adrenal Rebuilder? Loni

Hard to say with supplements that work slowly over the long term.
It *might* be helping... it's tolerable to take, at least...

Marc

Svetaswan-2

Feb 22, 2010; 8:45am

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

In reply to this post by BiBrun

I figured that there should be printers on the market now that had these capabilities. I see that there are printers that allow you to hook up, say, a digital camera directly to it and "preview" the pics on an embedded screen - so I thought that there should be printers that would allow you to hookup a Flash Drive or something like that, and preview documents. But the printers I was looking at on amazon.com (though I didn't look at all of them) only mentioned digital camera and (IIRC) cell phones/blackberries as connectible devices - not memory drives. The info on these printers also didn't make any reference to being able to preview documents - only photos.

I also noticed that more and more printers are boasting "wireless" capabilities - and at this point, I'm leery of anything wireless. Could it be that these companies assume that people would prefer to print documents using a wireless command - rather than use a memory stick, so they build these printers with wireless capabilities but with no real option for printing docus from memory sticks?

Maybe I need to do more research. (The time/energy I've spent trying to figure this stuff out has gone toward trying to figure out a "safer" computer to buy.)

~Svetaswan

--- In [hidden email], Bill Bruno <wbruno@...> wrote:

>
> Most printers now can print from a thumb drive or
> memory stick, so you don't need the whole computer.
>
>
> Bill
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 15, 2010 at 4:29 AM, svetaswan <svetaswan@...> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>> > As good as this desktop, or nettop sounds, I'm afraid that it just won't be
> > very practical for me go the desktop route (even very small ones would pose
> > a problem). Just one of the reasons: I need something portable that I can
> > hook up to a printer in the basement - I need to bring the computer to the
> > printer, because I won't be able to bring the printer to the computer. (This
> > nettop seems pretty portable, but I would need a monitor to be able to use
> > the printer.)
> > ~Svetaswan
> >
> >

... [show rest of quote]

Svetaswan-2

Feb 22, 2010; 9:24am

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

In reply to this post by stephen_vandevijvere

Hi Stephen - you seem to be right in speculating that everyone is different. For about two years, I've been using a Dell Latitude D600 (laptop) that a family member brought home from his job. I found out that this particular model was released in 2003 or 2004, so I'm assuming that this particular laptop is around that age.

Well, I've had pretty significant/bothersome symptoms from this laptop thathas caused me to learn about electrosensitivity the hard way. Before thislaptop, I really didn't have any noticeable electrosensitivity that I can recall...I don't think I was even aware that there was a such thing as electrosensitivity!

So I've gotten sick/worse using a laptop that's older than yours.

For myself, I just don't see how things could be much worse using a newer laptop. Lord help me if the newer laptops are somehow worse than this one!

As for your theory on the laptop processors - from what I've read or been told, some of the newest laptops use "low voltage" or "ultra low voltage" processors (such as some of the Intel Atom processors) that are supposed to emit less emf, and lead to better tolerance. So perhaps there are better options than there were even two years ago. My knowledge/understanding this subject is quite limited - so I can't speak with any certainty on whether these "low voltage processors" would "compensate" (and nullify the possible benefits) by using more of the bothersome, (super) high-frequency currents.I somehow equate "lower voltage" with "higher frequency". But people whoare far more knowledgable than I am seem to believe that these low-voltageprocessors would help. Eli recently submitted a post that listed exactly which processors to look for.

~Svetaswan

--- In [hidden email], "stephen_vandevijvere" <stephen_vandevijvere@...> wrote:

>
> No idea why I can bear the old Acer laptop... Probably I can bear other laptops that are 5 years old...
>
> I think it should be one of these 4 that's bothering me with new laptops:
>
> 1. The processor/motherboard
> The new laptops all use the same Intel-processors (also Apple) which are much faster and probably emit other/higher frequencies... but I (think) I can stand new destkops (which use the same processors I suppose?), so that doesn't make sense...
>
> 2. Harddrive
> It could also be the EMF from the harddrive but I don't think so, I have a recent external drive and I can stand that...
>
> 3. Wifi card
> There is no Wifi card on the old Acer, which is just great! ;)
> But whilst testing recent models I did put off the Wifi so... I had an external Wifi card on the Acer and felt no difference (although I could measure the difference).
>
> 4. 3G card
> For a short period I had a 3G-card from somebody else (for surfing on thecellphone-masts; this is for Europe) and that did got me really sick, but on the laptops I tested 2 years ago there was no 3G-card for standard...
>
> So it's not easy to tell why... Probably it's different for everybody...
>
> Stephen.
>
>
>
>

... [show rest of quote]

Svetaswan-2

Feb 22, 2010; 9:44am

Re: software solutions for the computer

In reply to this post by Marc Martin

Hi Marc and David,

Do you know how exactly this software works? In your experience, does it actually alter the emfs coming from the computer/monitor - or does it simplymake you *feel* better while using the computer (even though the emfs are not technically reduced)?

I'm not trying to be skepical or doubtful - but my recent experience (and also the article "EMF Scams" on the Conrad Biologic website) has made me cautious about these "miracle" products. I've tried orgonite - and I've triedsmall, ceramic, chip-like "resonators" that were purported to "change harmful frequencies into more beneficial frequencies" - and I'm seriously wondering if I've been scammed.

~Svetaswan

--- In [hidden email], "Marc Martin" <marc@...> wrote:

>
> > I have the WDS product Computer Clear on my PC. This helps neutralise
> > EMFs coming out of monitor and PC. WDS are a company who work on
> > making products from Bio Resonance technology. I'm very happy with
> > their products, and I can personally recommend them. Here's a link
> > to them, if you want to investigate:
> >
> > http://www.wds-global.com/
>
> I once tried the "Computer Clear" software on my computer (must
> have been at least 6 years ago), and about the only thing I noticed
> was that I got heart palpitations when sitting in front of the computer,
> when I never did before (or since).
>
> I think the only software product I've tried that has proven itself
> to me that it reduces my computer symptoms is "Quantum Byte" from
> www.quantumproducts.com . I recently tried another software
> product from www.globalcoherence.com, and that just seemed to make
> my symptoms worse... (although I have not revisited this to see if
> that was an initial detox reaction that I might be able to get
> past)
>
> Marc
>

... [show rest of quote]

PUK

Feb 22, 2010; 9:49am

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

In reply to this post by Poker Addict

In a message dated 22/02/2010 09:25:07 GMT Standard Time,
[hidden email] writes:

For myself, I just don't see how things could be much worse using a newer
laptop. Lord help me if the newer laptops are somehow worse than this one!

As for your theory on the laptop processors - from what I've read or been
told, some of the newest laptops use "low voltage" or "ultra low voltage"
processors (such as some of the Intel Atom processors) that are supposed to
emit less emf, and lead to better tolerance. So perhaps there are better
options than there were even two years ago. My knowledge/understanAs for
your theory on

Puk replies - Sometimes it seems as crazy as a person who has a peanut
allergy still trying to work out how to stay employed in the Snickers factory
! Laptops and PCs are one of the most intimate EMF (SPARING THE
MOBILE)devices that we work with, they all spew out EMR, over a range of frequencies
from the unit as a whole, the only way to stop that is to locate the on/off
button and hit the unit with a large hammer ! I guess as I have learnt
over the years, life is full of trade offs, that is especially true when it
comes to making decisions about our health, we tend to accept the ill
feelings, take risks and so on, where there is a good enough reward for doing so,
smoking/drinking..... using a mobile perhaps, oh and Work!

I dont think that there is a laptop out there that can be that EMR quiet
that it wont skrew up a good percentage of Essers, it is perhaps the cycle of
excessive suffer/reward that brought many an Esser to develop the
condition in the first place, so perhaps it would be better to move away from such
slavish reliance on these technologies and only use them as absolutely
necessary thus keeping the suffering to a minimum... I say all of this eating
my words as I type on this PC, beginning to feel like crap, Does anyone know
a PC that I can use that wont make me feel this way - Confused - you will
be !!!

Puk ps Distance is everthing

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Marc Martin

Feb 22, 2010; 2:48pm

Re: software solutions for the computer

Administrator

In reply to this post by Svetaswan-2

> Do you know how exactly this software works? In your experience, does
> it actually alter the emfs coming from the computer/monitor - or does
> it simply make you *feel* better while using the computer (even though
> the emfs are not technically reduced)?

Well, the software *is* doing something... and I think we'd be in
violation of the terms and conditions of the software agreement if we
tried to figure out exactly what it was doing. :-) The GlobalCoherence
website has some oscilloscope plots showing that it reduces the noise
coming from the computer, although this is the software that gives me a
splitting headache...

...and I'm not sure how you'd get "scammed" from the GlobalCoherence
software, since it's free. If you don't like it, remove it from your
computer.

Marc

stephen_vandevijvere

Feb 22, 2010; 3:58pm

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

In reply to this post by Svetaswan-2

Hi Svetaswan,

About the laptops, it might be worth trying the low voltage processors... Me, I haven't come up with any recent laptop that works for me. Immediately I get a headache... Last week my client took his laptop... ouch!

The only thing I know for sure is that it is best to actually try before buying and all the rest is speculation... ;)

So what works best for me is my 4.5 year old Acer (Travelmate 240; 2.60 GHzand 750 Mb Ram) or I think (new) desktops...

Recently I was with my graphic designer, he has two new Apple/Mac and I stayed quite close to the Mac's for at least 4 hours and I was fine or at least not having the immediate headache as with new laptops.

If you don't necessarily need a laptop, I would definitely advise a desktop... Even if it's harming you as much as a laptop you still can put the desktop further away from you...

For any laptop you would use, always hook up an external (non-wireless) keyboard (much less emf whilst typing).

David has written good things on the desktop from -Asrock:
http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/eSens/message/16423

> > A few days in the PC is turning out to be a great purchase, EMF and
dirty
> > electricity readings have kept very low.
> >
> >
> >
> > The magnetic readings come out of at 1.5ish on the 0-3 magnetic range on
> a
> > Trifield meter. Nothing coming out of radio or electric ranges. I
decided
> > to turn the Wi-fi off.
> >

Greets,
Stephen.

--- In [hidden email], "svetaswan" <svetaswan@...> wrote:

>
>
>
> Hi Stephen - you seem to be right in speculating that everyone is different. For about two years, I've been using a Dell Latitude D600 (laptop) that a family member brought home from his job. I found out that this particular model was released in 2003 or 2004, so I'm assuming that this particular laptop is around that age.
>
> Well, I've had pretty significant/bothersome symptoms from this laptop that has caused me to learn about electrosensitivity the hard way. Before this laptop, I really didn't have any noticeable electrosensitivity that I can recall...I don't think I was even aware that there was a such thing as electrosensitivity!
>
> So I've gotten sick/worse using a laptop that's older than yours.
>
> For myself, I just don't see how things could be much worse using a newerlaptop. Lord help me if the newer laptops are somehow worse than this one!
>
> As for your theory on the laptop processors - from what I've read or beentold, some of the newest laptops use "low voltage" or "ultra low voltage" processors (such as some of the Intel Atom processors) that are supposed toemit less emf, and lead to better tolerance. So perhaps there are better options than there were even two years ago. My knowledge/understanding this subject is quite limited - so I can't speak with any certainty on whetherthese "low voltage processors" would "compensate" (and nullify the possible benefits) by using more of the bothersome, (super) high-frequency currents. I somehow equate "lower voltage" with "higher frequency". But people who are far more knowledgable than I am seem to believe that these low-voltage processors would help. Eli recently submitted a post that listed exactly which processors to look for.
>
> ~Svetaswan
>
> --- In [hidden email], "stephen_vandevijvere" <stephen_vandevijvere@> wrote:
> >
> > No idea why I can bear the old Acer laptop... Probably I can bear otherlaptops that are 5 years old...
> >
> > I think it should be one of these 4 that's bothering me with new laptops:
> >
> > 1. The processor/motherboard
> > The new laptops all use the same Intel-processors (also Apple) which are much faster and probably emit other/higher frequencies... but I (think) Ican stand new destkops (which use the same processors I suppose?), so thatdoesn't make sense...
> >
> > 2. Harddrive
> > It could also be the EMF from the harddrive but I don't think so, I have a recent external drive and I can stand that...
> >
> > 3. Wifi card
> > There is no Wifi card on the old Acer, which is just great! ;)
> > But whilst testing recent models I did put off the Wifi so... I had an external Wifi card on the Acer and felt no difference (although I could measure the difference).
> >
> > 4. 3G card
> > For a short period I had a 3G-card from somebody else (for surfing on the cellphone-masts; this is for Europe) and that did got me really sick, but on the laptops I tested 2 years ago there was no 3G-card for standard...
> >
> > So it's not easy to tell why... Probably it's different for everybody...
> >
> > Stephen.
> >
> >
> >
> >
>

... [show rest of quote]

Marc Martin

Feb 22, 2010; 8:11pm

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

Administrator

In reply to this post by PUK

> For myself, I just don't see how things could be much worse using a
> newer laptop. Lord help me if the newer laptops are somehow worse than this
> one!

Well, as computers get faster and faster, I think there is more potential
for damaging frequencies coming out of them. We've now got faster CPU's,
faster motherboards, faster memory, faster interfaces with our hard drives,
faster ethernet, higher-resolution video, more energy-efficient power
supplies, etc.

We've simply got to get better faster than the rate of everything around
us getting worse!

Marc

David Clover

Feb 22, 2010; 9:41pm

Re: software solutions for the computer

In reply to this post by Svetaswan-2

Hi,

The WDS product was developed from the E-lybra machine. Here's some useful
links to the concept

Overview of E-lybra/bioresonance technology.

http://www.energetic-medicine.net/e-lybra.html

The categories that the E-lybra machine test against, and then
balances/treats

http://www.the-natural-choice.co.uk/documents/16349/Categories.pdf

I had treatment from an E-lybra machine at Xmas. It's done wonders for me.
I'd been working long hours for a number of years and I went down with
Shingles last year, and my adrenal glands were completely wacked. This lead
to me being very sensitive to EMFs. I did a number of things to turn things
around, but the E-lybra treatment was the most significant. I bough the
Computer clear product a few weeks ago and this has helped me further.
from what I understand it sends out balancing frequencies that counteract
the EMF.

Regards

David

From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
svetaswan
Sent: 22 February 2010 09:45
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [eSens] Re: software solutions for the computer

Hi Marc and David,

Do you know how exactly this software works? In your experience, does it
actually alter the emfs coming from the computer/monitor - or does it simply
make you *feel* better while using the computer (even though the emfs are
not technically reduced)?

I'm not trying to be skepical or doubtful - but my recent experience (and
also the article "EMF Scams" on the Conrad Biologic website) has made me
cautious about these "miracle" products. I've tried orgonite - and I've
tried small, ceramic, chip-like "resonators" that were purported to "change
harmful frequencies into more beneficial frequencies" - and I'm seriously
wondering if I've been scammed.

~Svetaswan

--- In [hidden email] <mailto:eSens%40yahoogroups.com> , "Marc
Martin" <marc@...> wrote:

... [show rest of quote]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Marc Martin

Feb 23, 2010; 7:47pm

RE: computer clear software

Administrator

In reply to this post by David Clover

> I have the WDS product Computer Clear on my PC. This helps neutralise
> EMFs coming out of monitor and PC. WDS are a company who work on making
> products from Bio Resonance technology. I'm very happy with their products, and I
> can personally recommend them. Here's a link to them, if you want to
> investigate:
>
> http://www.wds-global.com/

I just got around to checking this out. Although I did use Computer Clear
many (8?) years ago, what they are selling now is quite a bit different.
For one, they *do* now have a 30-day free trial, so one can see if it helps
before buying. Also, they now have a "strength" adjustment, where
the version I used was simply "on" or "off". Finally, the software has
some usability improvements, with a little icon on the Windows taskbar,
and a more modern interface.

The download link and PDF Users Guide can be found here:

http://www.wds-global.com/computerclear/

Note that this is a large download ~ 100 MB.

I'll try it out and see if it's helpful now (the old version I tried
wasn't)

Marc

johnottawa80

Feb 24, 2010; 4:02pm

Grounding Disc Doctor ( Was: Re: computer clear software)

I saw the link to wds-global here, so I thought I'd just mention that I several years ago went to an alternativ medical doctor who said that every patient he'd had with electrical sensitivity got relief from their condition using the Disc Doctor called 'Grounding'. I didn't notice anything from it though, so I can't recommend it, but as it is quite inexpensive, someone on the list might want to check it out.
Here's the link:
http://www.wds-global.com/products/diskdoctors.aspx

John.

--- In [hidden email], "Marc Martin" <marc@...> wrote:

>
> > I have the WDS product Computer Clear on my PC. This helps neutralise
> > EMFs coming out of monitor and PC. WDS are a company who work on making
> > products from Bio Resonance technology. I'm very happy with their products, and I
> > can personally recommend them. Here's a link to them, if you want to
> > investigate:
> >
> > http://www.wds-global.com/
>
> I just got around to checking this out. Although I did use Computer Clear
> many (8?) years ago, what they are selling now is quite a bit different.
> For one, they *do* now have a 30-day free trial, so one can see if it helps
> before buying. Also, they now have a "strength" adjustment, where
> the version I used was simply "on" or "off". Finally, the software has
> some usability improvements, with a little icon on the Windows taskbar,
> and a more modern interface.
>
> The download link and PDF Users Guide can be found here:
>
> http://www.wds-global.com/computerclear/
>
> Note that this is a large download ~ 100 MB.
>
> I'll try it out and see if it's helpful now (the old version I tried
> wasn't)
>
> Marc
>

... [show rest of quote]

Marc Martin

Feb 24, 2010; 5:11pm

Re: Grounding Disc Doctor ( Was: Re: computer clear software)

Administrator

> I saw the link to wds-global here, so I thought I'd just mention that I
> several years ago went to an alternativ medical doctor who said that
> every patient he'd had with electrical sensitivity got relief from their
> condition using the Disc Doctor called 'Grounding'. I didn't notice
> anything from it though, so I can't recommend it, but as it is quite
> inexpensive, someone on the list might want to check it out.

Yes, several years ago I tried a few of those discs for various conditions
(allergies, etc.) and didn't notice them doing anything.

Marc

Poker Addict

Feb 24, 2010; 8:54pm

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

In reply to this post by Marc Martin

I suspect it has a lot more factors involved then just EMF
waves. Chemicals used in manufacturing, wi-fi, and perhaps other
toxic aspects of computers we arent even aware of such as the plastics
or metals they use.

I know it is more then just EMF, cause a lot of computers and computer
components and other devices bother me even when they are turned off!

--- On Fri, 2/19/10, Marc Martin <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: Marc Martin <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?
To: [hidden email]
Date: Friday, February 19, 2010, 9:45 AM

> No idea why I can bear the old Acer laptop... Probably I can bear other

> laptops that are 5 years old...

It's also possible that it has nothing to do with the vintage of the

laptop. I know that we once had a Dell laptop made around 1998 that

was utterly intolerable to me, yet a 2006 IBM laptop was pretty good...

Marc

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

PUK

Feb 25, 2010; 9:57am

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

In reply to this post by Poker Addict

In a message dated 24/02/2010 21:27:38 GMT Standard Time,
[hidden email] writes:

No idea why I can bear the old Acer laptop... Probably I can bear other

> laptops that are 5 years old...

It's also possible that it has nothing to do with the vintage of the

laptop. I know that we once had a Dell laptop made around 1998 that

was utterly intolerable to me, yet a 2006 IBM laptop was pretty good...

PUK REPLIES - Maybe it is simply poor EMC design of the product, perhaps as
the manufacterers have had to cater for a larger more product hungry
market they simply cut corners and become more lax with the latter rather like
Toyota whos Ceo admitted that they had in a roundabout way secome to greed
where the high pace turnover of the product outstripped the technical
abilities of thier staff. It could be siad that many of the products such as TVs
pcs, mobiles are slowly killing us, but unfortunately the regulations are
so skewed such harmful effects dont evan touch the sides ! Old computers
may have had the luxury of better and more careful design, modern life is
littered with this phenomenon of short term thinking.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

stephen_vandevijvere

Feb 25, 2010; 1:52pm

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

Regulation for emf (low emf as well) is lowest in Russia. Maybe we should go buy our electronics in Russia!

Maybe laptops being sold in Russia will emit less emf than the ones sold inthe States?

Stephen.

Sources:

1.
http://www.tesla.ru/english/protection/standards.html
Thus, EMF maximum permissible levels established by Russian national standards at 0 Hz - 300 GHz frequency range are the strictest ones in worldwide and provide the maximal protection of human under the EMF exposure.

2.
http://archives.lists.indymedia.org/imc-uk/2003-December/002179.html

All the above has been widely known for some 40 years, as these effects
were first documented by Russian scientists from the late 1950s onward.

When it first became known in the "West" the US/NATO (yes the Yanks),
dismissed it as black propaganda. Since 1990 the IEEE have repeatedly
attempted to "harmonize" the Russian standards by raising the "safe"
levels in Russia upwards by 1000 times. The answer is still NO.

The driving force behind maintaining the high unsafe standard in the
West (UK/EU/USA/Can/Aus/NZ) is the financial implication for the cold
war warriors.

If the lower standard were adopted the MILITARY would need to purchase
many square miles of land around their high power radar and radio sites
to remove the public from areas where the lower standard said was unsafe.

The MILITARY could also expect to pay out vast sums in successful death
and injury claims to ex-military and civilian persons who have been
affected by exposure to previously consider "safe" RF levels.

3.
http://www.who.int/docstore/peh-emf/EMFStandards/who-0102/Worldmap5.htm
EMF Regulations for each country

--- In [hidden email], paulpjc@... wrote:

>
>
> In a message dated 24/02/2010 21:27:38 GMT Standard Time,
> acekingsuited06@... writes:
>
> No idea why I can bear the old Acer laptop... Probably I can bear other
>
> > laptops that are 5 years old...
>
> It's also possible that it has nothing to do with the vintage of the
>
> laptop. I know that we once had a Dell laptop made around 1998 that
>
> was utterly intolerable to me, yet a 2006 IBM laptop was pretty good...
>
>
>
>
> PUK REPLIES - Maybe it is simply poor EMC design of the product, perhaps as
> the manufacterers have had to cater for a larger more product hungry
> market they simply cut corners and become more lax with the latter rather like
> Toyota whos Ceo admitted that they had in a roundabout way secome to greed
> where the high pace turnover of the product outstripped the technical
> abilities of thier staff. It could be siad that many of the products such as TVs
> pcs, mobiles are slowly killing us, but unfortunately the regulations are
> so skewed such harmful effects dont evan touch the sides ! Old computers
> may have had the luxury of better and more careful design, modern life is
> littered with this phenomenon of short term thinking.
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

... [show rest of quote]

PUK

Feb 25, 2010; 2:48pm

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

In reply to this post by Poker Addict

In a message dated 25/02/2010 13:58:25 GMT Standard Time,
[hidden email] writes:

Regulation for emf (low emf as well) is lowest in Russia. Maybe we should
go buy our electronics in Russia!

Maybe laptops being sold in Russia will emit less emf than the ones sold
in the States?

Stephen.

puk replies - you could also check out military spec laptops these are well
sheilded and rugged.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

heinrichmontana

Feb 28, 2010; 9:34am

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

I'm new to the group, but this thread is in-line with what I've been dealing with so I figured I'd share my history as it may help someone out. I'm inthe information technology industry so staying away from PCs is hard :)

I am sensitive newer machines (desktops or laptops) so for the last 5 yearsor so I've been using an older Toshiba Protégé M200 Table PC. To get more processing power I use Windows "Remote Desktop" to connect to more powerful machines that are in different buildings. So far this has been working great, but I continue to look into whether I'll ever be able to get a faster laptop. Here's what I've tried:

1. Had to give my Toshiba M200 back to my previous employer three years agoand I purchased an AMD Dual Core driven HP Laptop and found I was sensitive to laptops for the first time (was already senstive to newer cell phones so I had an idea of what was going on). I returned it.
2. I then tried a Lenovo X200 Tablet (had dual core Intel processors) thinking it may be the processor brand and found I was sensitive to that.
3. I then tried a newer version of the Toshiba Protégé (had Dual Core Intel Processors) thinking it was the brand of PC, but I still had issues
3. I ended up buying a used Toshiba M200 Tablet like I had at my previous employer which I still use now
4. Purchased a Compaq Presario driven by a Intel Celeron for my wife and I have no issues so I thought maybe it had to do with the processors and the new ULV processors would be better when they came out (they weren't released yet)
5. Recently purchased a Lenovo with ULV processors and although my sensitivity is not as bad as most other machines I still have issues (enough to keep me looking)
6. I love the Lenovo so I sent the laptop to http://www.safelevel.com/ for shielding to test that out, but it didn't seem to help. They shielded the Low Frequencies so I'm assuming since I still have issues I'm sensitive to higher frequencies. I'm going to continue using the Lenovo for now in hopes I adjust to it..wishful thinking I know.
7. As a final test on determining if it's based on processors I just ordered a Dell using an singe core Intel Celeron processor...I'm hoping I'll be able to use that and I'll let everyone know the results once I get it.

So in summary, I have no solution yet other than a work around by using an older machine and if you need more processing power find a way to store a high powered machine somewhere else and leverage "Remote Desktop".

--- In [hidden email], paulpjc@... wrote:

>
>
> In a message dated 25/02/2010 13:58:25 GMT Standard Time,
> stephen_vandevijvere@... writes:
>
> Regulation for emf (low emf as well) is lowest in Russia. Maybe we should
> go buy our electronics in Russia!
>
> Maybe laptops being sold in Russia will emit less emf than the ones sold
> in the States?
>
> Stephen.
>
>
>
> puk replies - you could also check out military spec laptops these are well
> sheilded and rugged.
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

... [show rest of quote]

stephen_vandevijvere

Feb 28, 2010; 5:07pm

Re: Computers and Laptops: whats the solution?

Hi Heinrich,

Welcome here,

I kinda have the same problem with laptops. I'm now still working on a 4.5 year old Acer as this is the only laptop I know I can stand...

Like you, I've tried a lot of new laptops of different brands (I tried like7 different ones) and with all of them I get sick.

I don't have that much problem with desktops (any brand)/

About shielding, I don't know anything about that. Probably interesting things on this you can find by searching on older posts (download files and use PG Offload Shareware).

I think the best to do is to put your laptop as far away from you as possible, I've read posts of people that hook up a projector for projection on the wall or on a tv-screen... I just have a seperate keyboard as I've read itmakes a big difference (and you should also have a seperate mouse).

Stephen.

--- In [hidden email], "heinrichmontana" <heinrichmontana@...> wrote:

>
>
>
>
> I'm new to the group, but this thread is in-line with what I've been dealing with so I figured I'd share my history as it may help someone out. I'm in the information technology industry so staying away from PCs is hard :)
>
> I am sensitive newer machines (desktops or laptops) so for the last 5 years or so I've been using an older Toshiba Protégé M200 Table PC. To get more processing power I use Windows "Remote Desktop" to connect to more powerful machines that are in different buildings. So far this has been working great, but I continue to look into whether I'll ever be able to get a faster laptop. Here's what I've tried:
>
> 1. Had to give my Toshiba M200 back to my previous employer three years ago and I purchased an AMD Dual Core driven HP Laptop and found I was sensitive to laptops for the first time (was already senstive to newer cell phones so I had an idea of what was going on). I returned it.
> 2. I then tried a Lenovo X200 Tablet (had dual core Intel processors) thinking it may be the processor brand and found I was sensitive to that.
> 3. I then tried a newer version of the Toshiba Protégé (had Dual CoreIntel Processors) thinking it was the brand of PC, but I still had issues
> 3. I ended up buying a used Toshiba M200 Tablet like I had at my previousemployer which I still use now
> 4. Purchased a Compaq Presario driven by a Intel Celeron for my wife and I have no issues so I thought maybe it had to do with the processors and the new ULV processors would be better when they came out (they weren't released yet)
> 5. Recently purchased a Lenovo with ULV processors and although my sensitivity is not as bad as most other machines I still have issues (enough to keep me looking)
> 6. I love the Lenovo so I sent the laptop to http://www.safelevel.com/ for shielding to test that out, but it didn't seem to help. They shielded theLow Frequencies so I'm assuming since I still have issues I'm sensitive tohigher frequencies. I'm going to continue using the Lenovo for now in hopes I adjust to it..wishful thinking I know.
> 7. As a final test on determining if it's based on processors I just ordered a Dell using an singe core Intel Celeron processor...I'm hoping I'll beable to use that and I'll let everyone know the results once I get it.
>
> So in summary, I have no solution yet other than a work around by using an older machine and if you need more processing power find a way to store ahigh powered machine somewhere else and leverage "Remote Desktop".
>
> --- In [hidden email], paulpjc@ wrote:
> >
> >
> > In a message dated 25/02/2010 13:58:25 GMT Standard Time,
> > stephen_vandevijvere@ writes:
> >
> > Regulation for emf (low emf as well) is lowest in Russia. Maybe we should
> > go buy our electronics in Russia!
> >
> > Maybe laptops being sold in Russia will emit less emf than the ones sold
> > in the States?
> >
> > Stephen.
> >
> >
> >
> > puk replies - you could also check out military spec laptops these are well
> > sheilded and rugged.
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>

... [show rest of quote]

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