Capacitor RFI/EMI line filters?

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Re: windows

WILLE BÖRLIN
Charles.

I responded to the fact that it seems to be a complete waste of time and
money to "fix" a little bit here or a bit there.
First you must consider how bad off you are from radiation, then take
measures accordingly.
That might end up with mowing to a better spot, ( which is hard to find
in Europe today ).
Alternavely you must prepare a real functioning shielding by e.g. build
you self a good shielding cage where you can function.
A little fabric here, wallpaper there is maybe good , each by each, but
must make a practical solution that you can live with!
The problem is seldom the large parts but the seems, around the doosr,
windows etc etc.
You also need air !
And HOW do you handle the floor and roof? , hardly with wowen
fabrics............................

It might sound harsh but either you have a problem or not!

To put 800$ gadgets on the floor here and there is not the remedy but
proven and tested shielding techniques is the key to a better health
among those who suffer from this syndrom.

I have a friend, who is also with this list, who built himself a good
shield 10 years ago. Maybe we can get him to write a description and
what results you can espect.
-----
You wrote that, the damping factor of different materials has to do with
the level of radiation !
Sorry but no, if a material dampens 10dB, 15 in is 5 out, 25 in is 15
out and so on.
What is true though is that the damping is frequencydependent .

Yours

Wille Borlin




charles wrote:

>Hello Wille Borlin,
>
>I am sorry that my english is not clear to you.
>I did not recommend anything.
>I just gave an explanation what is going on with sun shielding window panes.
>
>The windows are commonly the weakest part of the house.
>Why do you think that shielding them is a waste of money?
>In order to see through the windows, those films are the only solution of
>shielding them.
>Or do you know something we don't know?
>Please enlighten us.
>
>Now for the sake of argument.
>HF radiation passes through wood as it does through brick, although brick
>holds back a little more.
>It also depends on the level of radiation.
>And depending the amount of radiation, one may make a choice among several
>materials.
>There are woven fabrics, mesh fabrics, wall papers, textures, and there are
>paints.
>So there is really a choice to pick from.
>
>Greetings,
>Charles Claessens
>member Verband Baubiologie
>http://members.rott.chello.nl/cclaessens/
>http://www.hese-project.org
>checked by Norton Antivirus
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "WILLE BÖRLIN" <[hidden email]>
>To: <[hidden email]>
>Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 21:34
>Subject: Re: [eSens] longitudinal waves
>
>
>  
>
>>Charles.
>>
>>Apart from the waste of money you recommend when treating the windows.
>>How shall Nil shield the walls?
>>For the sake of argument lets say that he;
>>1./ lives in a wood house.
>>2./ lives in a brick house.
>>
>>Wille Borlin
>>SWEDEN
>>
>>
>>
>>charles wrote:
>>
>>    
>>
>>>Hello Nil,
>>>
>>>window panes which have a sun-shielding are very well known to shield
>>>      
>>>
>high
>  
>
>>>frequency fields, like those of mobile phones.
>>>This sun shielding abtained because very small metal particles are
>>>manufactured on the surface of the pane.
>>>
>>>The same effect you can obtain with normal window panes, when you put
>>>      
>>>
>these
>  
>
>>>transparent hf shielding films on the glass.
>>>These films consist of two layers. The upper must be taken off, the
>>>      
>>>
>window
>  
>
>>>pane should be wetted with clear water, and the now open side of the film
>>>placed against the glass. The water must be pushed away, and the
>>>      
>>>
>oversized
>  
>
>>>sides of the film be cut with a sharp knife.
>>>Although these films are transparent, they tend to make it a little
>>>      
>>>
>darker
>  
>
>>>in the room.
>>>Biologa has a range of those films, named RDF.
>>>See www.enviratest.com , Biologa, Hochfrequenz HF
>>>
>>>Sorry, most Germans speak only German, and are a bit lazy in making their
>>>information sheet also in english.
>>>They fear, that they have to make them in many languages, but aside
>>>      
>>>
>german,
>  
>
>>>I think english is neccessary for a lot of other countries.
>>>I do hope, that Biologa will do their best in doing that soon.
>>>
>>>Greetings,
>>>Charles Claessens
>>>member Verband Baubiologie
>>>http://members.rott.chello.nl/cclaessens/
>>>http://www.hese-project.org
>>>checked by Norton Antivirus
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>From: "Nymphaea/formerly nil" <[hidden email]>
>>>To: <[hidden email]>
>>>Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 02:22
>>>Subject: Re: [eSens] longitudinal waves
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>Hi all,
>>>>
>>>>I had a cell phone which did not work in my flat. I was being able to
>>>>        
>>>>
>use
>  
>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>it only at the balcony,outside. Than I had to change it.I thought that
>>>problem was my double layer window glasses. Would you think double layer
>>>glass window will help to stop some of the cell site radiation from
>>>      
>>>
>outside?
>  
>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>Thanks
>>>>Nil
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: Cindy Sage
>>>> To: [hidden email]
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 5:43 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [eSens] longitudinal waves
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Yahoo! Groups Links
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>    
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: windows

Marc Martin
Administrator
>To put 800$ gadgets on the floor here and there is not the remedy but
>proven and tested shielding techniques is the key to a better health
>among those who suffer from this syndrom.

But again, there are other solutions than shielding. I'm not using
shielding *at all*, because:

1) it wasn't working for me
2) even if it would work, it's not portable, so it's not going
to help you on the job, while shopping, on vacation, etc.

I've gone from terrible ES to virtually no symptoms at all. And I'm not
using any shielding.

Just foods, supplements, and EMF protection devices. That's it.

Marc

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Re: windows

charles-2
In reply to this post by WILLE BÖRLIN
Hello Wille Borlin,

You misunderstood my remark; the damping factor of different materials has
nothing to do with
the level of radiation.
I meant: The choice of materials has to do with the amount of radiation.
My point was, that the shielding materials must be in accordance with the
amount of radiation.
With little radiation, let's assume 20 uW/m2 in a bedroom, the choice is
easier to make with simpler materials that shield 15 dB.
If you have as an example 200 uW/m2, than you need materials that shield
30-40 dB.
Therefore it is good in looking at the curves of the materials.
Most are fine with 900 Mhz, but are less at 1800 and 2000 MHz.
So, it is important to know which frequency you are dealing with.
And a 100 % shielding does not exist.
I prefer looking at damping in dB, than those 99.9% or 99.96% or 99.99%,
which does not give me a clue.
Peter Pauli and Dietrich Moldan heve published a booklet with the curves of
must commonly used shielding materials.
It is called *Reduzierung hochfrequenter Strahlung, Baustoffe unf
Abschirmmaterialien*
Look at http://www.drmoldan.de/html/publikationen.htm
where you can order it, and download a short sample.

Most of the times, the radiation comes horizontally, through the walls and
the windows.
Sometimes in appartments, the DECT phones of neighbours come from ceiling or
floor.
I have reasonable results with this ISPO or G-ES. (I have placed it against
the walls and even in front of large window panes.
For the ceiling, one may use some aluminium film or the *Diamant Gewebe*
from Biologa or Marburg-technic.
The floor is difficult.
If one has wood parquet, it is quite difficult to put something underneath.
If you have carpet, aluminium film can be placed under it.
But never, all the walls, ceiling and floor should be shielded.
Always leave something open.

Of course, there may be problematic situations in huoses, where common
shielding is difficult.
There are now paints for high frequency, that may shield 30, 40 and 50 dB.
One has to paint minimum two layers, but more are possible.
The color is like in the old T-Fords days, only black. But you may paint it
over or put wallpaper over it.
However, this paint must be grounded seriously, because this paint is
electrically conductive.

Your friend with his shielding of 10 years ago will have now problems, I
suppose.
Because the radiation levels now today are much higher than 10 years ago.

And, sure, the windows are the weakest parts in the house. Not only the
glass, but also the (wooden) window frames must be shielded.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
http://members.rott.chello.nl/cclaessens/
http://www.hese-project.org
checked by Norton Antivirus



----- Original Message -----
From: "WILLE BÖRLIN" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sunday, February 29, 2004 21:24
Subject: Re: [eSens] windows


Charles.

I responded to the fact that it seems to be a complete waste of time and
money to "fix" a little bit here or a bit there.
First you must consider how bad off you are from radiation, then take
measures accordingly.
That might end up with mowing to a better spot, ( which is hard to find
in Europe today ).
Alternavely you must prepare a real functioning shielding by e.g. build
you self a good shielding cage where you can function.
A little fabric here, wallpaper there is maybe good , each by each, but
must make a practical solution that you can live with!
The problem is seldom the large parts but the seems, around the doosr,
windows etc etc.
You also need air !
And HOW do you handle the floor and roof? , hardly with wowen
fabrics............................

It might sound harsh but either you have a problem or not!

To put 800$ gadgets on the floor here and there is not the remedy but
proven and tested shielding techniques is the key to a better health
among those who suffer from this syndrom.

I have a friend, who is also with this list, who built himself a good
shield 10 years ago. Maybe we can get him to write a description and
what results you can espect.
-----
You wrote that, the damping factor of different materials has to do with
the level of radiation !
Sorry but no, if a material dampens 10dB, 15 in is 5 out, 25 in is 15
out and so on.
What is true though is that the damping is frequencydependent .

Yours

Wille Borlin




charles wrote:

>Hello Wille Borlin,
>
>I am sorry that my english is not clear to you.
>I did not recommend anything.
>I just gave an explanation what is going on with sun shielding window
panes.

>
>The windows are commonly the weakest part of the house.
>Why do you think that shielding them is a waste of money?
>In order to see through the windows, those films are the only solution of
>shielding them.
>Or do you know something we don't know?
>Please enlighten us.
>
>Now for the sake of argument.
>HF radiation passes through wood as it does through brick, although brick
>holds back a little more.
>It also depends on the level of radiation.
>And depending the amount of radiation, one may make a choice among several
>materials.
>There are woven fabrics, mesh fabrics, wall papers, textures, and there are
>paints.
>So there is really a choice to pick from.
>
>Greetings,
>Charles Claessens
>member Verband Baubiologie
>http://members.rott.chello.nl/cclaessens/
>http://www.hese-project.org
>checked by Norton Antivirus
>
>

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Re: windows

charles-2
In reply to this post by Marc Martin
Hello Marc,

it depends.

I do not need shielding.
I do not need EMF protection devices.
(And I am certainly not a *normal* person. ;o)) )

But my wife needs shielding at home, and especially the bedroom.
And she needs also EMF protection devices.
And she always feel a bit better, when she has done a *liver cleansing*
according to Hulda Clark.
But alongside the autoroutes, she is not influenced by all thos GSM masts,
like before.
She only uses this BioProtect card as EMF protection device.

So, it depends, on the persons level of electrosensibility.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
http://members.rott.chello.nl/cclaessens/
http://www.hese-project.org
checked by Norton Antivirus



----- Original Message -----
From: "Marc Martin" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sunday, February 29, 2004 22:04
Subject: Re: [eSens] windows


> >To put 800$ gadgets on the floor here and there is not the remedy but
> >proven and tested shielding techniques is the key to a better health
> >among those who suffer from this syndrom.
>
> But again, there are other solutions than shielding. I'm not using
> shielding *at all*, because:
>
> 1) it wasn't working for me
> 2) even if it would work, it's not portable, so it's not going
> to help you on the job, while shopping, on vacation, etc.
>
> I've gone from terrible ES to virtually no symptoms at all. And I'm not
> using any shielding.
>
> Just foods, supplements, and EMF protection devices. That's it.
>
> Marc
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Re: windows

WILLE BÖRLIN
In reply to this post by charles-2
Well Charles.

I think we have some different approaches and i don´t think we can get  
much closer.
Obviously the object must be to kill incoming radiation completely,
always chase for the stars.............
So why not always choose the best?

My friends cage has nothing to do with what was radiating ten years ago,
it was so well planned that it is still state of the art,
since the basic physics concerning radiation has not changed.

Finally you say that the paint has to be grounded.
Grounding has absolutely no effect in medium and high-frequency shielding.
Either you have a good shield or not.

Which is a little mysterious when you say;

"But never, all the walls, ceiling and floor should be shielded.
Always leave something open."

Why ?
If you leave one sector open it may enhance the effects of radiation so
once again, what do you mean?

Wille Borlin
SWEDEN


charles wrote:

>Hello Wille Borlin,
>
>You misunderstood my remark; the damping factor of different materials has
>nothing to do with
>the level of radiation.
>I meant: The choice of materials has to do with the amount of radiation.
>My point was, that the shielding materials must be in accordance with the
>amount of radiation.
>With little radiation, let's assume 20 uW/m2 in a bedroom, the choice is
>easier to make with simpler materials that shield 15 dB.
>If you have as an example 200 uW/m2, than you need materials that shield
>30-40 dB.
>Therefore it is good in looking at the curves of the materials.
>Most are fine with 900 Mhz, but are less at 1800 and 2000 MHz.
>So, it is important to know which frequency you are dealing with.
>And a 100 % shielding does not exist.
>I prefer looking at damping in dB, than those 99.9% or 99.96% or 99.99%,
>which does not give me a clue.
>Peter Pauli and Dietrich Moldan heve published a booklet with the curves of
>must commonly used shielding materials.
>It is called *Reduzierung hochfrequenter Strahlung, Baustoffe unf
>Abschirmmaterialien*
>Look at http://www.drmoldan.de/html/publikationen.htm
>where you can order it, and download a short sample.
>
>Most of the times, the radiation comes horizontally, through the walls and
>the windows.
>Sometimes in appartments, the DECT phones of neighbours come from ceiling or
>floor.
>I have reasonable results with this ISPO or G-ES. (I have placed it against
>the walls and even in front of large window panes.
>For the ceiling, one may use some aluminium film or the *Diamant Gewebe*
>from Biologa or Marburg-technic.
>The floor is difficult.
>If one has wood parquet, it is quite difficult to put something underneath.
>If you have carpet, aluminium film can be placed under it.
>But never, all the walls, ceiling and floor should be shielded.
>Always leave something open.
>
>Of course, there may be problematic situations in huoses, where common
>shielding is difficult.
>There are now paints for high frequency, that may shield 30, 40 and 50 dB.
>One has to paint minimum two layers, but more are possible.
>The color is like in the old T-Fords days, only black. But you may paint it
>over or put wallpaper over it.
>However, this paint must be grounded seriously, because this paint is
>electrically conductive.
>
>Your friend with his shielding of 10 years ago will have now problems, I
>suppose.
>Because the radiation levels now today are much higher than 10 years ago.
>
>And, sure, the windows are the weakest parts in the house. Not only the
>glass, but also the (wooden) window frames must be shielded.
>
>Greetings,
>Charles Claessens
>member Verband Baubiologie
>http://members.rott.chello.nl/cclaessens/
>http://www.hese-project.org
>checked by Norton Antivirus
>
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "WILLE BÖRLIN" <[hidden email]>
>To: <[hidden email]>
>Sent: Sunday, February 29, 2004 21:24
>Subject: Re: [eSens] windows
>
>
>Charles.
>
>I responded to the fact that it seems to be a complete waste of time and
>money to "fix" a little bit here or a bit there.
>First you must consider how bad off you are from radiation, then take
>measures accordingly.
>That might end up with mowing to a better spot, ( which is hard to find
>in Europe today ).
>Alternavely you must prepare a real functioning shielding by e.g. build
>you self a good shielding cage where you can function.
>A little fabric here, wallpaper there is maybe good , each by each, but
>must make a practical solution that you can live with!
>The problem is seldom the large parts but the seems, around the doosr,
>windows etc etc.
>You also need air !
>And HOW do you handle the floor and roof? , hardly with wowen
>fabrics............................
>
>It might sound harsh but either you have a problem or not!
>
>To put 800$ gadgets on the floor here and there is not the remedy but
>proven and tested shielding techniques is the key to a better health
>among those who suffer from this syndrom.
>
>I have a friend, who is also with this list, who built himself a good
>shield 10 years ago. Maybe we can get him to write a description and
>what results you can espect.
>-----
>You wrote that, the damping factor of different materials has to do with
>the level of radiation !
>Sorry but no, if a material dampens 10dB, 15 in is 5 out, 25 in is 15
>out and so on.
>What is true though is that the damping is frequencydependent .
>
>Yours
>
>Wille Borlin
>
>
>
>
>charles wrote:
>
>  
>
>>Hello Wille Borlin,
>>
>>I am sorry that my english is not clear to you.
>>I did not recommend anything.
>>I just gave an explanation what is going on with sun shielding window
>>    
>>
>panes.
>  
>
>>The windows are commonly the weakest part of the house.
>>Why do you think that shielding them is a waste of money?
>>In order to see through the windows, those films are the only solution of
>>shielding them.
>>Or do you know something we don't know?
>>Please enlighten us.
>>
>>Now for the sake of argument.
>>HF radiation passes through wood as it does through brick, although brick
>>holds back a little more.
>>It also depends on the level of radiation.
>>And depending the amount of radiation, one may make a choice among several
>>materials.
>>There are woven fabrics, mesh fabrics, wall papers, textures, and there are
>>paints.
>>So there is really a choice to pick from.
>>
>>Greetings,
>>Charles Claessens
>>member Verband Baubiologie
>>http://members.rott.chello.nl/cclaessens/
>>http://www.hese-project.org
>>checked by Norton Antivirus
>>
>>
>>    
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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RE: Capacitor RFI/EMI line filters?

Lachlan Mudge
In reply to this post by Marc Martin
Hi Willie Borlin,

You wrote:

A small door is small wheter you enter it from the outside or the inside !
The same goes for EMI-filters.
Remember we are talking AC here.

Your comments have caused me to doubt my understanding and I would like to
discuss this with you so that I ensure I have the best understanding of these
RFI/EMI filters. As I understand it, an RFI/EMI (low pass) filter is best
constructed so that the path of what we are trying to filter first meets an
inductor, which is connected in series to the path. The impedance of this
inductor increases with frequency, therefore it effectively attenuates a
significant amount of high frequency noise on the path. Next in the path, one
places a capacitor, however the capacitor is not connected in series. Rather
the other side of the capacitor is connected to 'ground'. As I understand it,
the impedance of the capacitor decreases as frequency increases, therefore any
remaining high frequency noise that is not attenuated by the series inductor
will pass to ground through the capacitor.
I was informed that the configuration of such filters allows them to operate
with maximum efficiency in one direction only. I don't dispute that this type
of filter will attenuate high frequency noise in both directions, but my
question to you or anyone else is whether their effectiveness is actually
directional. I would appreciate your help on this so that I, and any others
that wish to try this technique of noise elimination, can do so with
confidence. Thankyou
Lachlan

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Re: longitudinal ?

Gruendg
In reply to this post by WILLE BÖRLIN
In einer eMail vom 26.02.2004 10:38:35 (MEZ) Mitteleuropäische Zeit schreibt
[hidden email]:

>
>
> I'd like to ask some more questions, if you don't mind.
>
> - you say that longitudinal waves are altered when traveling trough a Cage
> of Faraday. A glass of water in a Cage of Faraday with a mobile phone outside
> it is more negatively altered then without the Cage. In a personal e-mailyou
> told me that longitudinal waves are altered to be less harmfull when
> traveling trough a Cage of Faraday. Could you please clarify this for me?

Dear Niels,

The System of meridians reacts positive if exposed to microwaves of a mobile
that have passed through metal schielding. Without this shielding it reacts
negative. This positive reaction I could test even in a sleeping room totally
shielded against EMF. Even though this seems to be positive, and it is the
experience of many electrosensitive persons that they are relieved from their
symptoms, if I grow wheat germs with water, that has been in such a faradayan cage
and exposed to microwaves from outside the cage, these wheat germs grow slower
as with normal water.

>
> - according to you transversal waves are not harmfull, right? They only
> affect living beings by the heating effect. But if they can do heating, which is
> resonance of mainly water, don't they also bring all other body components
> into resonance? Thus being harmfull? You tell that cells communicate with
> photons. Aren't they transversal too?

If the negative effect of the longitudinal waves is neutralized, the
transversal waves remain unchanged, you can use the mobile and measure the radiation,
but the acupuncture system shows no reaction nor positiv nor negative. The
acupuncture system reacts on the other hand very sensitive to your glasses,or
looking at a nice picture or just taking a piece of plastic in your hand. If
there is no reaction to the transversal waves of a mobile, then there hardly
could any negative effect from them. The heating effect is anpurely physical
effect on the water molecules. It delivers no information to the cells, which may
make them react. Photons are understood as little partikels not as waves and
light is both simultaneously, which is hard to understand.

>
> - did you in the past 2 years find out if your anti-electrosmog product,
> which neutralizes the longitudinal waves, became less powerfull? Or that it
> didn't seem to work anymore after a period of time?

So far i did not find a decrease in the effect oft the BioProtect cards. Some
of my patients showed me the rather worn out cards form daily use and I
exchanged them for new ones to test the old ones. Even in these rare cases,where
someone felt as if the card did not work any more and sent it back, this cards
were still ok. Something in the person must have changed.

>
> The reason that I ask these questions is that I'm wondering if I should
> shield my bedroom with Cage of Faraday shielding. One expert says to do it, the
> other to do not. So I'm trying to find out what's going on.

The experience of quite a few people with these faradayan cage shieldings is
an improvement of the situation, but not always. And even when it is very
professionaly done, some say, to sleep in a place far away from mobile stations is
still better. You are also shielding the natural electrostatic field and its
wave patterns - Schumann waves- and would have to artificially produce these
fields within your cage. I personally with the background knkowledge of the
longitudinal waves and their importance for the effect on biological oganisms
would not use a fardayan cage.

>
> Best regards,
> Niels
> Best regards

Dietrich

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: Capacitor RFI/EMI line filters?

WILLE BÖRLIN
In reply to this post by Lachlan Mudge
Lachlan.

You are right in your theory discussion on filters.
But in order to make them really efficient you make them symmetrical so
they can kill common-mode disturbances too.

To you and all the others who have thought about these kind of
mains-filters i suggest that you visit.

WWW.SCHURTER.DE

When on the first page choose language,
then CONNECTORS
then BLOCKS
and finally ask for the datasheet on for example FMLB.

This will give you a schematic, component values and general
specifications for a good filter.

Wille Borlin
SWEDEN



Lachlan Mudge wrote:

>Hi Willie Borlin,
>
>You wrote:
>
>A small door is small wheter you enter it from the outside or the inside !
>The same goes for EMI-filters.
>Remember we are talking AC here.
>
>Your comments have caused me to doubt my understanding and I would like to
>discuss this with you so that I ensure I have the best understanding of these
>RFI/EMI filters. As I understand it, an RFI/EMI (low pass) filter is best
>constructed so that the path of what we are trying to filter first meets an
>inductor, which is connected in series to the path. The impedance of this
>inductor increases with frequency, therefore it effectively attenuates a
>significant amount of high frequency noise on the path. Next in the path, one
>places a capacitor, however the capacitor is not connected in series. Rather
>the other side of the capacitor is connected to 'ground'. As I understand it,
>the impedance of the capacitor decreases as frequency increases, therefore any
>remaining high frequency noise that is not attenuated by the series inductor
>will pass to ground through the capacitor.
>I was informed that the configuration of such filters allows them to operate
>with maximum efficiency in one direction only. I don't dispute that this type
>of filter will attenuate high frequency noise in both directions, but my
>question to you or anyone else is whether their effectiveness is actually
>directional. I would appreciate your help on this so that I, and any others
>that wish to try this technique of noise elimination, can do so with
>confidence. Thankyou
>Lachlan
>
>
>
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Re: longitudinal ?

Gruendg
In reply to this post by WILLE BÖRLIN
In einer eMail vom 26.02.2004 10:38:35 (MEZ) Mitteleuropäische Zeit schreibt
[hidden email]:

>
>
> I'd like to ask some more questions, if you don't mind.
>
> - you say that longitudinal waves are altered when traveling trough a Cage
> of Faraday. A glass of water in a Cage of Faraday with a mobile phone outside
> it is more negatively altered then without the Cage. In a personal e-mailyou
> told me that longitudinal waves are altered to be less harmfull when
> traveling trough a Cage of Faraday. Could you please clarify this for me?

Dear Niels,

The System of meridians reacts positive if exposed to microwaves of a mobile
that have passed through metal schielding. Without this shielding it reacts
negative. This positive reaction I could test even in a sleeping room totally
shielded against EMF. Even though this seems to be positive, and it is the
experience of many electrosensitive persons that they are relieved from their
symptoms, if I grow wheat germs with water, that has been in such a faradayan cage
and exposed to microwaves from outside the cage, these wheat germs grow slower
as with normal water.

>
> - according to you transversal waves are not harmfull, right? They only
> affect living beings by the heating effect. But if they can do heating, which is
> resonance of mainly water, don't they also bring all other body components
> into resonance? Thus being harmfull? You tell that cells communicate with
> photons. Aren't they transversal too?

If the negative effect of the longitudinal waves is neutralized, the
transversal waves remain unchanged, you can use the mobile and measure the radiation,
but the acupuncture system shows no reaction nor positiv nor negative. The
acupuncture system reacts on the other hand very sensitive to your glasses,or
looking at a nice picture or just taking a piece of plastic in your hand. If
there is no reaction to the transversal waves of a mobile, then there hardly
could any negative effect from them. The heating effect is anpurely physical
effect on the water molecules. It delivers no information to the cells, which may
make them react. Photons are understood as little partikels not as waves and
light is both simultaneously, which is hard to understand.

>
> - did you in the past 2 years find out if your anti-electrosmog product,
> which neutralizes the longitudinal waves, became less powerfull? Or that it
> didn't seem to work anymore after a period of time?

So far i did not find a decrease in the effect oft the BioProtect cards. Some
of my patients showed me the rather worn out cards form daily use and I
exchanged them for new ones to test the old ones. Even in these rare cases,where
someone felt as if the card did not work any more and sent it back, this cards
were still ok. Something in the person must have changed.

>
> The reason that I ask these questions is that I'm wondering if I should
> shield my bedroom with Cage of Faraday shielding. One expert says to do it, the
> other to do not. So I'm trying to find out what's going on.

The experience of quite a few people with these faradayan cage shieldings is
an improvement of the situation, but not always. And even when it is very
professionaly done, some say, to sleep in a place far away from mobile stations is
still better. You are also shielding the natural electrostatic field and its
wave patterns - Schumann waves- and would have to artificially produce these
fields within your cage. I personally with the background knkowledge of the
longitudinal waves and their importance for the effect on biological oganisms
would not use a fardayan cage.

>
> Best regards,
> Niels
> Best regards

Dietrich

> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: Electroacupuncture.

Gruendg
In reply to this post by WILLE BÖRLIN
Hallo, WilleI

n einer eMail vom 26.02.2004 22:46:46 (MEZ) Mitteleuropäische Zeit schreibt
[hidden email]:

> "This is the
> reason, why pulsed waves like in mobile phones have a much stronger effect
> on
> biological organisms than the same frequency without pulsing."
>
> Well, who said that?

First of all this I know from repeated statements of various experts. And I
measured this myself, finding out that the electrosmog effect of a microwave
oven at 900 watt is the same as the effect of a mobile at probably 1 watt.

>
> If our perception of radio-waves worked the way you sketch i think all
> of us would be quite shaky by now.
> GSM telephones has been around for almost 10 years.
> We has, for example, since WW2 enjoyed the blessings of Radar which is a
> higly pulsed and RF-"product".

You forget that we are biological organisms that react to outer influences
and compensate them if possible. This way we can live farely well in spite of a
lot of adverse influences around us. But if the load of influences becomes too
heavy, you become sick. For a percentage beween 1 and 5 percent of the people
this level has been reached by the microwave pollution of modern times. In
electroacupuncture I see the same negative reaction in everyone, and in
electrosensitive persons a much stronger reaction.

>
> What i try to say is that there can not be such universal explanations
> when it comes to those that experience electrosensitivity.
> ---------
> You talk about electroacupuncture.
> My question is do you let a needle penetrate down through the skin?
> How Deep?

There is no penetration of needles. There is one small electrode that touches
the acupuncture point and in one hand an metallic handle as refererence. Then
the electrical conductance of the point is measured; the current applied is
about a few microampere, the voltage below 1 volt. This is sufficient to
stimulate a proper reaction of the body, that is not harmful.

> If so, how can this be called skin-resistance measurements?
> How do you define the acupuncture points in a glass of water?

> This is not the place to explain all about electroacupuncture. Please
> accept that over 50 years the method has been practised and ever further developed
> and that these people that did this are quite intelligent and serious.

> According to the text you use an E-meter?
> The famous instrument of Mr.Scientology?
> What is the your real intention of this question? To put me into the boatof
> scientology?
> I never used the word e-meter until just now.

> These kind of instruments induces a DC - current in order to be able to
> measure resistance expressed in Ohms.
> Is that not shaking up or biasing your results quite heavily?
>
> I think that if you really believe in such measurements you should try
> to find another kind of measuring system and define the Conductance
> instead as expressed in S/m.

This shows that without havíng the least knowledge of electroacupunkture you
still try to critizise this method. Why are You doing this?
>
> Wille Borlin
> SWEDEN
>
Best regards
Dietrich Grün


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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RE: Capacitor RFI/EMI line filters?

Lachlan Mudge
In reply to this post by Marc Martin
Thankyou very much Willie
I am slowly getting a better understanding of filters, but I have much to
learn. I hope to be able to manufacture a filter here in Australia - I have
not found any suitable devices for ES people. I hope to obtain a filter with
similar configuration to the Shurter FMLB or even the two stage FSS2 filter,
however I would also like to incorporate good magnetic shielding of the filter
container, to avoid any harmful effects of magnetic fields in the inductors. I
imagine I could simply encase a Shurter type filter in a high magnetic
permeability material, such as Mu-Metal. I would be interested to hear your
thoughts on this idea. Thanks again
Lachlan

-----Original Message-----
From: WILLE BÖRLIN [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Thursday, 4 March 2004 9:43 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [eSens] Capacitor RFI/EMI line filters?

Lachlan.

You are right in your theory discussion on filters.
But in order to make them really efficient you make them symmetrical so
they can kill common-mode disturbances too.

To you and all the others who have thought about these kind of
mains-filters i suggest that you visit.

WWW.SCHURTER.DE

When on the first page choose language,
then CONNECTORS
then BLOCKS
and finally ask for the datasheet on for example FMLB.

This will give you a schematic, component values and general
specifications for a good filter.

Wille Borlin
SWEDEN



Lachlan Mudge wrote:

>Hi Willie Borlin,
>
>You wrote:
>
>A small door is small wheter you enter it from the outside or the inside !
>The same goes for EMI-filters.
>Remember we are talking AC here.
>
>Your comments have caused me to doubt my understanding and I would like to
>discuss this with you so that I ensure I have the best understanding of these
>RFI/EMI filters. As I understand it, an RFI/EMI (low pass) filter is best
>constructed so that the path of what we are trying to filter first meets an
>inductor, which is connected in series to the path. The impedance of this
>inductor increases with frequency, therefore it effectively attenuates a
>significant amount of high frequency noise on the path. Next in the path,one
>places a capacitor, however the capacitor is not connected in series. Rather
>the other side of the capacitor is connected to 'ground'. As I understandit,
>the impedance of the capacitor decreases as frequency increases, thereforeany
>remaining high frequency noise that is not attenuated by the series inductor
>will pass to ground through the capacitor.
>I was informed that the configuration of such filters allows them to operate
>with maximum efficiency in one direction only. I don't dispute that this type
>of filter will attenuate high frequency noise in both directions, but my
>question to you or anyone else is whether their effectiveness is actually
>directional. I would appreciate your help on this so that I, and any others
>that wish to try this technique of noise elimination, can do so with
>confidence. Thankyou
>Lachlan
>
>
>
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  
>



 
Yahoo! Groups Links



 

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Re: Electroacupuncture.

WILLE BÖRLIN
In reply to this post by Gruendg
Dietrich.

In your mail of the 25/01/04 you wrote;

"Since the waves are still there, your e-meter will show no change in
its readings!"

That is why i asked you about the e-meter.
An "instrument" invented by L.Ron Hubbard, founder of the "church of Scientology".
-----

I still wonder how you find a acupuncture spot in a glass of water?
-----

How do you set up a comparing experiment like your example with the micro vs. mobilephone?
-----

You write; "why are you critizing something you don´t understand."

The answer is quite simple, i don´t understand it, but i am a very curious person, that´s why i ask.
But i always get suscpious, when i instead of explanations is accused of critizing, that normally means that there is no explanation.
Another way of fighting of questions is to say that this or that is based on old knowledge.
Personally i am not that impressed by all old knowledge and is quite thankul for the progress in the scientific field.

( If you read my text there is only questions, no critizism, just a simple suggestion that you might switch to conductance instead of resistance ).

Yours

Wille Borlin
SWEDEN







[hidden email] wrote:

>Hallo, WilleI
>
>n einer eMail vom 26.02.2004 22:46:46 (MEZ) Mitteleuropäische Zeit schreibt
>[hidden email]:
>
>  
>
>>"This is the
>>reason, why pulsed waves like in mobile phones have a much stronger effect
>>on
>>biological organisms than the same frequency without pulsing."
>>
>>Well, who said that?
>>    
>>
>
>First of all this I know from repeated statements of various experts. And I
>measured this myself, finding out that the electrosmog effect of a microwave
>oven at 900 watt is the same as the effect of a mobile at probably 1 watt.
>
>  
>
>>If our perception of radio-waves worked the way you sketch i think all
>>of us would be quite shaky by now.
>>GSM telephones has been around for almost 10 years.
>>We has, for example, since WW2 enjoyed the blessings of Radar which is a
>>higly pulsed and RF-"product".
>>    
>>
>
>You forget that we are biological organisms that react to outer influences
>and compensate them if possible. This way we can live farely well in spiteof a
>lot of adverse influences around us. But if the load of influences becomestoo
>heavy, you become sick. For a percentage beween 1 and 5 percent of the people
>this level has been reached by the microwave pollution of modern times. In
>electroacupuncture I see the same negative reaction in everyone, and in
>electrosensitive persons a much stronger reaction.
>
>  
>
>>What i try to say is that there can not be such universal explanations
>>when it comes to those that experience electrosensitivity.
>>---------
>>You talk about electroacupuncture.
>>My question is do you let a needle penetrate down through the skin?
>>How Deep?
>>    
>>
>
>There is no penetration of needles. There is one small electrode that touches
>the acupuncture point and in one hand an metallic handle as refererence. Then
>the electrical conductance of the point is measured; the current applied is
>about a few microampere, the voltage below 1 volt. This is sufficient to
>stimulate a proper reaction of the body, that is not harmful.
>
>  
>
>>If so, how can this be called skin-resistance measurements?
>>How do you define the acupuncture points in a glass of water?
>>    
>>
>
>  
>
>>This is not the place to explain all about electroacupuncture. Please
>>accept that over 50 years the method has been practised and ever further developed
>>and that these people that did this are quite intelligent and serious.
>>    
>>
>
>  
>
>>According to the text you use an E-meter?
>>The famous instrument of Mr.Scientology?
>>What is the your real intention of this question? To put me into the boatof
>>scientology?
>>I never used the word e-meter until just now.
>>    
>>
>
>  
>
>>These kind of instruments induces a DC - current in order to be able to
>>measure resistance expressed in Ohms.
>>Is that not shaking up or biasing your results quite heavily?
>>
>>I think that if you really believe in such measurements you should try
>>to find another kind of measuring system and define the Conductance
>>instead as expressed in S/m.
>>    
>>
>
>This shows that without havíng the least knowledge of electroacupunktureyou
>still try to critizise this method. Why are You doing this?
>  
>
>>Wille Borlin
>>SWEDEN
>>
>>    
>>
>Best regards
>Dietrich Grün
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
>  
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: Electroacupuncture.

Nikolaj Holtermann
In reply to this post by Gruendg
Wille,

There are plenty documentation about adverse health effects from TV, radio and radar exposure.

I have written an article about it in danish, that you should be able to read as swedish.

See www.sundhedskonsulenten.tk
 
Nikolaj
 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Nikolaj Holtermann,
cand. scient., sundhedskonsulent
Rosengården 14, 3.tv
DK - 1174 København K
tlf 33930070
email [hidden email]
www.sundhedskonsulenten.tk (.tk og ikke .dk)
http://hjem.get2net.dk/nikolaj_holtermann

----- Original Message -----
From: [hidden email]
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2004 12:26 AM
Subject: Re: [eSens] Electroacupuncture.


Hallo, WilleI

n einer eMail vom 26.02.2004 22:46:46 (MEZ) Mitteleuropäische Zeit schreibt
[hidden email]:

> "This is the
> reason, why pulsed waves like in mobile phones have a much stronger effect
> on
> biological organisms than the same frequency without pulsing."
>
> Well, who said that?

First of all this I know from repeated statements of various experts. AndI
measured this myself, finding out that the electrosmog effect of a microwave
oven at 900 watt is the same as the effect of a mobile at probably 1 watt.

>
> If our perception of radio-waves worked the way you sketch i think all
> of us would be quite shaky by now.
> GSM telephones has been around for almost 10 years.
> We has, for example, since WW2 enjoyed the blessings of Radar which is a
> higly pulsed and RF-"product".

You forget that we are biological organisms that react to outer influences
and compensate them if possible. This way we can live farely well in spite of a
lot of adverse influences around us. But if the load of influences becomes too
heavy, you become sick. For a percentage beween 1 and 5 percent of the people
this level has been reached by the microwave pollution of modern times. In
electroacupuncture I see the same negative reaction in everyone, and in
electrosensitive persons a much stronger reaction.

>
> What i try to say is that there can not be such universal explanations
> when it comes to those that experience electrosensitivity.
> ---------
> You talk about electroacupuncture.
> My question is do you let a needle penetrate down through the skin?
> How Deep?

There is no penetration of needles. There is one small electrode that touches
the acupuncture point and in one hand an metallic handle as refererence. Then
the electrical conductance of the point is measured; the current applied is
about a few microampere, the voltage below 1 volt. This is sufficient to
stimulate a proper reaction of the body, that is not harmful.

> If so, how can this be called skin-resistance measurements?
> How do you define the acupuncture points in a glass of water?

> This is not the place to explain all about electroacupuncture. Please
> accept that over 50 years the method has been practised and ever further developed
> and that these people that did this are quite intelligent and serious.

> According to the text you use an E-meter?
> The famous instrument of Mr.Scientology?
> What is the your real intention of this question? To put me into the boat of
> scientology?
> I never used the word e-meter until just now.

> These kind of instruments induces a DC - current in order to be able to
> measure resistance expressed in Ohms.
> Is that not shaking up or biasing your results quite heavily?
>
> I think that if you really believe in such measurements you should try
> to find another kind of measuring system and define the Conductance
> instead as expressed in S/m.

This shows that without havíng the least knowledge of electroacupunkture you
still try to critizise this method. Why are You doing this?
>
> Wille Borlin
> SWEDEN
>
Best regards
Dietrich Grün


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eSens/
     
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Re: Discussion on the Bioharmonics Website

Nikolaj Holtermann
In reply to this post by Marc Martin
Hi Marc,

How do you have your EAV tester test you for which EMF protection devices you should use at your computer at home and at work? I guess you don't bringthe PC equipment with you to the EAV tester?

BTW, I am interested in practical solutions, because I am using a kinesiologist to achieve the same benefits myself.

Nikolaj Holtermann

 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Nikolaj Holtermann,
cand. scient., sundhedskonsulent
Rosengården 14, 3.tv
DK - 1174 København K
tlf 33930070
email [hidden email]
www.sundhedskonsulenten.tk (.tk og ikke .dk)
http://hjem.get2net.dk/nikolaj_holtermann

----- Original Message -----
From: Marc Martin
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2004 6:52 PM
Subject: [eSens] Discussion on the Bioharmonics Website


Hi all,

There is a discussion going on at the Bioharmonics website, which has
essentially turned into a disagreement between myself and the person in
charge of the company. Basically, it seems to be her opinion that most
of the EMF devices available today are harmful to people's health --
except hers, of course. My opinion is that I agree that her devices (the
Springlife Polarizers) are good, but that shouldn't rule out that they
may be even better used in combination with other devices. For example,
I have found that while the Springlife Polarizers seem to be a complete
solution for most environments, I find that they could use some help with
large screen CRT monitors (note that they seem fine for LCD monitors).
Anyway, if anyone wants to read (or participate) in this discussion, here
is a link:

http://forums.bioharmonics.com/index.php?showtopic=22

Although, I wouldn't be surprised if they delete some of my posts!  
(after all, it might hurt their business)

Marc


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a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eSens/
     
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Re: Discussion on the Bioharmonics Website

Marc Martin
Administrator
>How do you have your EAV tester test you for which EMF protection devices
>you >should use at your computer at home and at work? I guess you don't
>bring the PC >equipment with you to the EAV tester?

My EAV tester uses a mix of EAV testing and kinesiology. First, she uses
EAV testing to determine which combination of supplements I should be
taking to "balance" my organs. Since she does this by putting the
supplements on the EAV testing "tray", she can also do the same thing with
EMF protection devices.

Then, when she has found the right combination of supplements and devices
with EAV testing, she then determines dosage with kinesiology. As far as I
can tell, she *thinks* of a certain dosage, and then does a muscle test on
whether or not that dosage is correct. So for the EMF protection devices,
she thinks of a particular device, or a particular place that device should
be located, or how long it should be worn, etc., and then does a muscle
test to see the bodies reaction.

Kinesiology is certainly a controversial subject, because to most people it
sounds totally ridiculous. In fact, it sounds no more scientific than
asking questions of a "Magic 8 Ball". And yet, in my own personal
experience with recovery from this illness, kinesiology has repeatedly
proven itself in improving my health where other methods have repeatedly
failed.

I will say however that the results between practitioners are certainly NOT
consistent -- 3 years ago, I went to 3 different practitioners within a
week, bringing the same bag of supplements with me each time. Each
practitioner came up with a different subset of what I was supposed to
take. HOWEVER, there were a surprising amount of similarities in the
recommendations, and the supplements they chose were generally the ones
that I had already determined myself were working. So there are issues
with practitioner bias, and perhaps the questions they are asking, and also
the order that they put the supplements on your body (if they are testing
them all at once, not individually, then the results are order-dependent).

Also, there still seems to be a problem with kinesiolgy in general, in that
for example, a cocaine addict with test strong for taking more cocaine.
That is because when the body is addicted to something, it will test strong
for it whether it's good for you or not. So you can get false results. In
fact, I don't think most practitioners pay enough attention to this, so if
you've tried kinesiology but weren't happy with the results, you might be
do better by trying someone else.

Marc

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Re: Electroacupuncture.

charles-2
In reply to this post by WILLE BÖRLIN
Hello,

as far as I know, this kind of meters are Galvanic Skin Response Meters,
that function like a biofeedback monitor, that is especially designed to
assist in psycho-therapeutic and personal development procedures.
It is like some kind of lie-detector.

One of the first references to the use of GSR instruments in psychoanalysis
is in
the book by Carl Gustav Jung, entitled "Studies in Word Analysis", published
in
1906.
Volney Mathison was the man who had a lot of experience with lie-detectors,
and made the first the modern type of portable transistorised GSR Meter,
a type that has survived with very little change, until the present day.
The Hubbard E-meter was based on its design.

There are many manufacturors.
The best are the Ability and the Clarity meter.
An overview is at http://freesolo.homepage.dk/themeter.htm
and at : http://allmeters.netfirms.com/


In short, for those who do not understand what we are talking about her.
As an example: when I ask you what kind of weather we have outside,
befor you have realised what I have asked you, these meters do give a
reading.
They are very quick in reading your brains.


A man who is writing a lot about them, is Peter Sheperd.
To be found at: http://www.trans4mind.com/

Several interesting documents can be dowmloaded there.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
http://members.rott.chello.nl/cclaessens/
http://www.hese-project.org
checked by Norton Antivirus




----- Original Message -----
From: "WILLE BÖRLIN" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 16:09
Subject: Re: [eSens] Electroacupuncture.


Dietrich.

In your mail of the 25/01/04 you wrote;

"Since the waves are still there, your e-meter will show no change in
its readings!"

That is why i asked you about the e-meter.
An "instrument" invented by L.Ron Hubbard, founder of the "church of
Scientology".
Yours

Wille Borlin
SWEDEN

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Re: Capacitor RFI/EMI line filters?

WILLE BÖRLIN
In reply to this post by Lachlan Mudge
Lachlan

I don´t think you have to care too much about better shielding.
Mu-metal is shit working with. We used it around the necks of radar-ppi
,s and also for some special transformers.
The stupid material loses its properties if you handle it mechanically.
e.g. drilling in it !
So first you must make your thing and then heat in different ways so it
regain its good properties.
Expensive and tedious is only the first
name.................................

If your filter is symmetrical and properly connected the radiation
should be very low.
I don´t think you can build it cheaper than bought complete from
Schurter or some other manufacturer.
Remember that you are working with mains and potentially hazardous
voltages.
If you are not used to do this i seriously ask you leave the work to
somebody who is trained or knowledgable of high-voltage.

Yours

Wille Borlin


Lachlan Mudge wrote:

>Thankyou very much Willie
>I am slowly getting a better understanding of filters, but I have much to
>learn. I hope to be able to manufacture a filter here in Australia - I have
>not found any suitable devices for ES people. I hope to obtain a filter with
>similar configuration to the Shurter FMLB or even the two stage FSS2 filter,
>however I would also like to incorporate good magnetic shielding of the filter
>container, to avoid any harmful effects of magnetic fields in the inductors. I
>imagine I could simply encase a Shurter type filter in a high magnetic
>permeability material, such as Mu-Metal. I would be interested to hear your
>thoughts on this idea. Thanks again
>Lachlan
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: WILLE BÖRLIN [mailto:[hidden email]]
>Sent: Thursday, 4 March 2004 9:43 AM
>To: [hidden email]
>Subject: Re: [eSens] Capacitor RFI/EMI line filters?
>
>Lachlan.
>
>You are right in your theory discussion on filters.
>But in order to make them really efficient you make them symmetrical so
>they can kill common-mode disturbances too.
>
>To you and all the others who have thought about these kind of
>mains-filters i suggest that you visit.
>
>WWW.SCHURTER.DE
>
>When on the first page choose language,
>then CONNECTORS
>then BLOCKS
>and finally ask for the datasheet on for example FMLB.
>
>This will give you a schematic, component values and general
>specifications for a good filter.
>
>Wille Borlin
>SWEDEN
>
>
>
>Lachlan Mudge wrote:
>
>
>
>>Hi Willie Borlin,
>>
>>You wrote:
>>
>>A small door is small wheter you enter it from the outside or the inside !
>>The same goes for EMI-filters.
>>Remember we are talking AC here.
>>
>>Your comments have caused me to doubt my understanding and I would like to
>>discuss this with you so that I ensure I have the best understanding of these
>>RFI/EMI filters. As I understand it, an RFI/EMI (low pass) filter is best
>>constructed so that the path of what we are trying to filter first meets an
>>inductor, which is connected in series to the path. The impedance of this
>>inductor increases with frequency, therefore it effectively attenuates a
>>significant amount of high frequency noise on the path. Next in the path, one
>>places a capacitor, however the capacitor is not connected in series. Rather
>>the other side of the capacitor is connected to 'ground'. As I understand it,
>>the impedance of the capacitor decreases as frequency increases, therefore any
>>remaining high frequency noise that is not attenuated by the series inductor
>>will pass to ground through the capacitor.
>>I was informed that the configuration of such filters allows them to operate
>>with maximum efficiency in one direction only. I don't dispute that this type
>>of filter will attenuate high frequency noise in both directions, but my
>>question to you or anyone else is whether their effectiveness is actually
>>directional. I would appreciate your help on this so that I, and any others
>>that wish to try this technique of noise elimination, can do so with
>>confidence. Thankyou
>>Lachlan
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>

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RE: Capacitor RFI/EMI line filters?

Lachlan Mudge
In reply to this post by Marc Martin
Thanks again Willie. I had heard that there were problems working with
Mu-Metal but it's useful to get feedback from someone with actual experience.
As far as working with high voltage, I do have a number of experienced
electrical/electronic technicians able to help me out with this, however I very
much appreciate your input. I am thinking that the best option is to buy a
Shurter filter (I was very impressed by their design) and measure the power
quality and fields associated with their operation. This would seem to be the
only way to assess any need to shield.

I am interested to know whether you, or anyone else on the list, think thatthe
fields associated with inductors (like those used in filters) are likely tobe
significant to people suffering EHS or the general public. Thanks,
Lachlan

-----Original Message-----
From: WILLE BÖRLIN [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Monday, 8 March 2004 8:26 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [eSens] Capacitor RFI/EMI line filters?

Lachlan

I don´t think you have to care too much about better shielding.
Mu-metal is shit working with. We used it around the necks of radar-ppi
,s and also for some special transformers.
The stupid material loses its properties if you handle it mechanically.
e.g. drilling in it !
So first you must make your thing and then heat in different ways so it
regain its good properties.
Expensive and tedious is only the first
name.................................

If your filter is symmetrical and properly connected the radiation
should be very low.
I don´t think you can build it cheaper than bought complete from
Schurter or some other manufacturer.
Remember that you are working with mains and potentially hazardous
voltages.
If you are not used to do this i seriously ask you leave the work to
somebody who is trained or knowledgable of high-voltage.

Yours

Wille Borlin


Lachlan Mudge wrote:

>Thankyou very much Willie
>I am slowly getting a better understanding of filters, but I have much to
>learn. I hope to be able to manufacture a filter here in Australia - I have
>not found any suitable devices for ES people. I hope to obtain a filter with
>similar configuration to the Shurter FMLB or even the two stage FSS2 filter,
>however I would also like to incorporate good magnetic shielding of the filter
>container, to avoid any harmful effects of magnetic fields in the inductors.
I

>imagine I could simply encase a Shurter type filter in a high magnetic
>permeability material, such as Mu-Metal. I would be interested to hear your
>thoughts on this idea. Thanks again
>Lachlan
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: WILLE BÖRLIN [mailto:[hidden email]]
>Sent: Thursday, 4 March 2004 9:43 AM
>To: [hidden email]
>Subject: Re: [eSens] Capacitor RFI/EMI line filters?
>
>Lachlan.
>
>You are right in your theory discussion on filters.
>But in order to make them really efficient you make them symmetrical so
>they can kill common-mode disturbances too.
>
>To you and all the others who have thought about these kind of
>mains-filters i suggest that you visit.
>
>WWW.SCHURTER.DE
>
>When on the first page choose language,
>then CONNECTORS
>then BLOCKS
>and finally ask for the datasheet on for example FMLB.
>
>This will give you a schematic, component values and general
>specifications for a good filter.
>
>Wille Borlin
>SWEDEN
>
>
>
>Lachlan Mudge wrote:
>
>  
>
>>Hi Willie Borlin,
>>
>>You wrote:
>>
>>A small door is small wheter you enter it from the outside or the inside!
>>The same goes for EMI-filters.
>>Remember we are talking AC here.
>>
>>Your comments have caused me to doubt my understanding and I would like to
>>discuss this with you so that I ensure I have the best understanding of these
>>RFI/EMI filters. As I understand it, an RFI/EMI (low pass) filter is best
>>constructed so that the path of what we are trying to filter first meets an
>>inductor, which is connected in series to the path. The impedance of this
>>inductor increases with frequency, therefore it effectively attenuates a
>>significant amount of high frequency noise on the path. Next in the path,
one
>>places a capacitor, however the capacitor is not connected in series. Rather
>>the other side of the capacitor is connected to 'ground'. As I understand
it,
>>the impedance of the capacitor decreases as frequency increases, therefore
any
>>remaining high frequency noise that is not attenuated by the series inductor
>>will pass to ground through the capacitor.
>>I was informed that the configuration of such filters allows them to operate
>>with maximum efficiency in one direction only. I don't dispute that this
type

>>of filter will attenuate high frequency noise in both directions, but my
>>question to you or anyone else is whether their effectiveness is actually
>>directional. I would appreciate your help on this so that I, and any others
>>that wish to try this technique of noise elimination, can do so with
>>confidence. Thankyou
>>Lachlan
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>  
>



 
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Re: Kinesiology: Was: Re: [eSens] Discussion on the Bioharmonics Website

Nikolaj Holtermann
In reply to this post by Marc Martin
I have very good experience with kinesiology myself. Mine uses about the same methods, and last time she tested my QLink Pendant for any positive EMF qualities by having me hold her PC while her testing the QLink. She found, I should wear it 10 hours a day - last month it was 12 hours a day.

I figure out, I shouldn't wear it too much due to detox, or perhaps as it influences on natural brain wave patterns during sleep? (I should only wear it during daytime)

Nikolaj
 
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Nikolaj Holtermann,
cand. scient., sundhedskonsulent
Rosengården 14, 3.tv
DK - 1174 København K
tlf 33930070
email [hidden email]
www.sundhedskonsulenten.tk (.tk og ikke .dk)
http://hjem.get2net.dk/nikolaj_holtermann

----- Original Message -----
From: Marc Martin
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 7:30 PM
Subject: Re: [eSens] Discussion on the Bioharmonics Website


>How do you have your EAV tester test you for which EMF protection devices
>you >should use at your computer at home and at work? I guess you don't
>bring the PC >equipment with you to the EAV tester?

My EAV tester uses a mix of EAV testing and kinesiology. First, she uses
EAV testing to determine which combination of supplements I should be
taking to "balance" my organs. Since she does this by putting the
supplements on the EAV testing "tray", she can also do the same thing with
EMF protection devices.

Then, when she has found the right combination of supplements and devices
with EAV testing, she then determines dosage with kinesiology. As far asI
can tell, she *thinks* of a certain dosage, and then does a muscle test on
whether or not that dosage is correct. So for the EMF protection devices,
she thinks of a particular device, or a particular place that device should
be located, or how long it should be worn, etc., and then does a muscle
test to see the bodies reaction.

Kinesiology is certainly a controversial subject, because to most people it
sounds totally ridiculous. In fact, it sounds no more scientific than
asking questions of a "Magic 8 Ball". And yet, in my own personal
experience with recovery from this illness, kinesiology has repeatedly
proven itself in improving my health where other methods have repeatedly
failed.

I will say however that the results between practitioners are certainly NOT
consistent -- 3 years ago, I went to 3 different practitioners within a
week, bringing the same bag of supplements with me each time. Each
practitioner came up with a different subset of what I was supposed to
take. HOWEVER, there were a surprising amount of similarities in the
recommendations, and the supplements they chose were generally the ones
that I had already determined myself were working. So there are issues
with practitioner bias, and perhaps the questions they are asking, and also
the order that they put the supplements on your body (if they are testing
them all at once, not individually, then the results are order-dependent).

Also, there still seems to be a problem with kinesiolgy in general, in that
for example, a cocaine addict with test strong for taking more cocaine.
That is because when the body is addicted to something, it will test strong
for it whether it's good for you or not. So you can get false results. In
fact, I don't think most practitioners pay enough attention to this, so if
you've tried kinesiology but weren't happy with the results, you might be
do better by trying someone else.

Marc

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Re: Kinesiology

Marc Martin
Administrator
> I figure out, I shouldn't wear it too much due to detox, or perhaps as
> it influences on natural brain wave patterns during sleep? (I should
> only wear it during daytime)

My practitioner also recommended that I do not wear the Springlife
Polarizers while sleeping. I had already determined that when I do this,
I wake up with excessive detox symptoms (headache, dehydration, sore
throat). However, I do keep it ~3 feet away from me, which provides me
with a restful sleep that I would not get if was 20 feet away from me.

My practitioner's recommendations on how I should use my EMF devices are
also consistent with what I've learned through my own trial & error
experiments. For example, she noted that I should only wear the large
Springlife Polarizer ("Slimline") in my pocket for around 5 hours. I had
already noticed that I have excessive detox and have to get away from it
at about 6-7 hours.

Marc

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