Why has shielding made things worse?
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Hi everyone havnt posted in a while.
I live on the same block as 2 cell towers and a 3 story building called earth connections which has a few big satelite recievers that are visible on the roof and there may also have antennas. They are like half a block from my house and my room is on the side of the house closest to them. I had painted my room with y-shield about 2 years ago grounded to a 5ft ground rod outside and also tried it ungrounded but both ways made things worse. The best way I can explain it is that it felt like some of the radiation was blocked but a portion was amplified and made worse. It was more intolerable to be inside the room with the paint than when it didnt have the paint. After about 1 year of sleeping in that room I stripped the paint and felt better. Ive also tried sleeping with a copper fabric blanket grounded and ungrounded and it was very similar feeling but more intense to when I was sleeping in the room with the y-shield. Ive had some mild success with the naturashield fabric and copper fabric only when covering certain parts of my body but not as a blanket. I figured that my unsuccesful attempts at shielding were maybe because Ive been using materials that reflect rf and my understanding is that they can cause resonances and if there is a leak then those waves can bounce around inside until they are absorbed. Now my next attempt is by using materials that will absorb the rf waves instead. I figured an absorptive material should not cause these problems and it doesnt need to be grounded. So I bought a queen loft bed which is basically a bunk bed without the bottom bunk. My plan was too cover it on every side with cement board and sleep inside on the bottom. I started by covering the top with two hardibacker 500 cementboards I already had and there was about a 10% drop on the readings on my rf meter. So I slept under this for a week and its actually somewhat worse! Similar to how it was in the room with the paint. I decided to try some natural stone slate tile on top which Ive been sleeping under for about 1 week now and same! It just feels more uncomfortable, at first it felt like there was a noticeable decrease in symptoms like the fields just got quieter but after a while of being under there it got more uncomfortable , also the slight high pitched ringing in my ears is louder and much more noticeable. This does not give me hope that covering all sides will make things better or that an absorption approach will work. Ive slept in the living room which is on the side of the house furthest from the cell towers and is about 20 feet away from my room. I feel more comfortable there the only thing I could explain is that the extra drywall is absorbing more of the rf fields. The rf readings are slightly lower there than in my room like 10-20% lower. So my understanding is that cell phone signals and the like are composed of a carrier signal which is usually high frequency and the modulated signal which is a lower frequency. The modulated signal being what affects us the most. When we are shielding we are shielding the Carrier signal right? So is it possible that the modulated signal is not being blocked or absorbed and possible made more powerful in some way? The rf signal is composed also of a electric and a magnetic portion is maybe the electric portion being absorbed and not the magnetic? -Cris |
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--- At 11:08 PM 21 03 2011, cris_aov wrote: > >Hi everyone havnt posted in a while. > >I live on the same block as 2 cell towers and a 3 story building called earth connections which has a few big satelite recievers that are visible on the roof and there may also have antennas. They are like half a block from my house and my room is on the side of the house closest to them. ...... What carrier frequencies do you need to shield? This material should help, for up to at least 10 GHz: LAMINATED MICROWAVE ABSORBING SHEET for RF Shielding with Minimal Reflection Has non-woven carbon fibers, to achieve both good microwave shielding and high absorption Carbon base material - this improved version is plastic laminated on both sides Double or triple the layers of MW Absorbing Sheet to increase effectiveness. http://www.lessemf.com/fabric.html#259N http://www.lessemf.com/259.pdf JD > |
Re: Why has shielding made things worse?
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In reply to this post by cris_aov
Hi, Cris! Welcome to the Club! :-) Your description fully matches my experience (described at previous "Faraday Cage" threads, and also several others presented already at Esens... When I had raised that issue a long time ago, the "Club" was rather small, at least - people were reluctant to accept that the stereotype of EM waves harming us is not fully applicable... We have to say that we don't know enough about the ES mechanisms... Just have in mind that there is no measurable effect of the "gadgets", some of which are obvious to be efficient... Just imagine the Faraday cages could have worked the unknown way (besides shielding) in sense that they act as some weird gadgets, but in counter-direction... So I am not proposing any solution, just insisting that shielding is problematic. It is not the issue of reflection, I have tried non reflective layers (LaVita gypsum boards)... Also, reflections should have appeared at the meter. You have the interesting observation of high-pitched "sound" remaining inside, it is exactly what I observe, but theoretically there is no way to shield the carrier while passing as you call it "the modulation". So I have no guess why it appears... As I had once mentioned, I have a strange feeling that overhead shields are specially tormenting, but I didn't have time to further experiment with cages without ceiling... Anyway, I would appreciate any observations on the issue! Last year I wanted to research all that further, but didn't catch up with time... Maybe we can start a research group dedicated to the issue, some of next days... Regards, Drasko --- In [hidden email], "cris_aov" <cris_aov@...> wrote: > > Hi everyone havnt posted in a while. > > I live on the same block as 2 cell towers and a 3 story building called earth connections which has a few big satelite recievers that are visible on the roof and there may also have antennas. They are like half a block from my house and my room is on the side of the house closest to them. > > I had painted my room with y-shield about 2 years ago grounded to a 5ft ground rod outside and also tried it ungrounded but both ways made things worse. The best way I can explain it is that it felt like some of the radiation was blocked but a portion was amplified and made worse. It was more intolerable to be inside the room with the paint than when it didnt have the paint. After about 1 year of sleeping in that room I stripped the paint and felt better. > > Ive also tried sleeping with a copper fabric blanket grounded and ungrounded and it was very similar feeling but more intense to when I was sleeping in the room with the y-shield. > > Ive had some mild success with the naturashield fabric and copper fabric only when covering certain parts of my body but not as a blanket. > > I figured that my unsuccesful attempts at shielding were maybe because Ive been using materials that reflect rf and my understanding is that they can cause resonances and if there is a leak then those waves can bounce around inside until they are absorbed. > > Now my next attempt is by using materials that will absorb the rf waves instead. I figured an absorptive material should not cause these problems and it doesnt need to be grounded. > > So I bought a queen loft bed which is basically a bunk bed without the bottom bunk. My plan was too cover it on every side with cement board and sleep inside on the bottom. I started by covering the top with two hardibacker 500 cementboards I already had and there was about a 10% drop on the readings on my rf meter. So I slept under this for a week and its actually somewhat worse! Similar to how it was in the room with the paint. I decided to try some natural stone slate tile on top which Ive been sleeping under for about 1 week now and same! It just feels more uncomfortable, at first it felt like there was a noticeable decrease in symptoms like the fields just got quieter but after a while of being under there it got more uncomfortable , also the slight high pitched ringing in my ears is louder and much more noticeable. This does not give me hope that covering all sides will make things better or that an absorption approach will work. > > Ive slept in the living room which is on the side of the house furthest from the cell towers and is about 20 feet away from my room. I feel more comfortable there the only thing I could explain is that the extra drywall is absorbing more of the rf fields. The rf readings are slightly lower there than in my room like 10-20% lower. > > > So my understanding is that cell phone signals and the like are composed of a carrier signal which is usually high frequency and the modulated signal which is a lower frequency. The modulated signal being what affects us the most. When we are shielding we are shielding the Carrier signal right? So is it possible that the modulated signal is not being blocked or absorbed and possible made more powerful in some way? > > The rf signal is composed also of a electric and a magnetic portion is maybe the electric portion being absorbed and not the magnetic? > > > -Cris > |
Re: Why has shielding made things worse?
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In reply to this post by cris_aov
I used the y-shield paint in my room & I can't sleep in there either. Interesting you had the same experience with it.
Have you shielded the windows at all? Loni --- On Mon, 3/21/11, cris_aov <[hidden email]> wrote: From: cris_aov <[hidden email]> Subject: [eSens] Why has shielding made things worse? To: [hidden email] Date: Monday, March 21, 2011, 11:08 PM Hi everyone havnt posted in a while. I live on the same block as 2 cell towers and a 3 story building called earth connections which has a few big satelite recievers that are visible on the roof and there may also have antennas. They are like half a block from my house and my room is on the side of the house closest to them. I had painted my room with y-shield about 2 years ago grounded to a 5ft ground rod outside and also tried it ungrounded but both ways made things worse. The best way I can explain it is that it felt like some of the radiation was blocked but a portion was amplified and made worse. It was more intolerable to be inside the room with the paint than when it didnt have the paint. After about 1 year of sleeping in that room I stripped the paint and felt better. Ive also tried sleeping with a copper fabric blanket grounded and ungrounded and it was very similar feeling but more intense to when I was sleeping in the room with the y-shield. Ive had some mild success with the naturashield fabric and copper fabric only when covering certain parts of my body but not as a blanket. I figured that my unsuccesful attempts at shielding were maybe because Ive been using materials that reflect rf and my understanding is that they can cause resonances and if there is a leak then those waves can bounce around inside until they are absorbed. Now my next attempt is by using materials that will absorb the rf waves instead. I figured an absorptive material should not cause these problems and it doesnt need to be grounded. So I bought a queen loft bed which is basically a bunk bed without the bottom bunk. My plan was too cover it on every side with cement board and sleep inside on the bottom. I started by covering the top with two hardibacker 500 cementboards I already had and there was about a 10% drop on the readings on my rf meter. So I slept under this for a week and its actually somewhat worse! Similar to how it was in the room with the paint. I decided to try some natural stone slate tile on top which Ive been sleeping under for about 1 week now and same! It just feels more uncomfortable, at first it felt like there was a noticeable decrease in symptoms like the fields just got quieter but after a while of being under there it got more uncomfortable , also the slight high pitched ringing in my ears is louder and much more noticeable. This does not give me hope that covering all sides will make things better or that an absorption approach will work. Ive slept in the living room which is on the side of the house furthest from the cell towers and is about 20 feet away from my room. I feel more comfortable there the only thing I could explain is that the extra drywall is absorbing more of the rf fields. The rf readings are slightly lower there than in my room like 10-20% lower. So my understanding is that cell phone signals and the like are composed of a carrier signal which is usually high frequency and the modulated signal which is a lower frequency. The modulated signal being what affects us the most. When we are shielding we are shielding the Carrier signal right? So is it possible that the modulated signal is not being blocked or absorbed and possible made more powerful in some way? The rf signal is composed also of a electric and a magnetic portion is maybe the electric portion being absorbed and not the magnetic? -Cris [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
Re: Why has shielding made things worse?
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In reply to this post by Drasko Cvijovic-2
Cris, do you turn off the electric at night. That would help also. Loni
--- On Tue, 3/22/11, Drasko <[hidden email]> wrote: From: Drasko <[hidden email]> Subject: [eSens] Re: Why has shielding made things worse? To: [hidden email] Date: Tuesday, March 22, 2011, 7:10 AM Hi, Cris! Welcome to the Club! :-) Your description fully matches my experience (described at previous "Faraday Cage" threads, and also several others presented already at Esens... When I had raised that issue a long time ago, the "Club" was rather small, at least - people were reluctant to accept that the stereotype of EM waves harming us is not fully applicable... We have to say that we don't know enough about the ES mechanisms... Just have in mind that there is no measurable effect of the "gadgets", some of which are obvious to be efficient... Just imagine the Faraday cages could have worked the unknown way (besides shielding) in sense that they act as some weird gadgets, but in counter-direction... So I am not proposing any solution, just insisting that shielding is problematic. It is not the issue of reflection, I have tried non reflective layers (LaVita gypsum boards)... Also, reflections should have appeared at the meter. You have the interesting observation of high-pitched "sound" remaining inside, it is exactly what I observe, but theoretically there is no way to shield the carrier while passing as you call it "the modulation". So I have no guess why it appears... As I had once mentioned, I have a strange feeling that overhead shields are specially tormenting, but I didn't have time to further experiment with cages without ceiling... Anyway, I would appreciate any observations on the issue! Last year I wanted to research all that further, but didn't catch up with time... Maybe we can start a research group dedicated to the issue, some of next days... Regards, Drasko --- In [hidden email], "cris_aov" <cris_aov@...> wrote: > > Hi everyone havnt posted in a while. > > I live on the same block as 2 cell towers and a 3 story building called earth connections which has a few big satelite recievers that are visible on the roof and there may also have antennas. They are like half a block from my house and my room is on the side of the house closest to them. > > I had painted my room with y-shield about 2 years ago grounded to a 5ft ground rod outside and also tried it ungrounded but both ways made things worse. The best way I can explain it is that it felt like some of the radiation was blocked but a portion was amplified and made worse. It was more intolerable to be inside the room with the paint than when it didnt have the paint. After about 1 year of sleeping in that room I stripped the paint and felt better. > > Ive also tried sleeping with a copper fabric blanket grounded and ungrounded and it was very similar feeling but more intense to when I was sleeping in the room with the y-shield. > > Ive had some mild success with the naturashield fabric and copper fabric only when covering certain parts of my body but not as a blanket. > > I figured that my unsuccesful attempts at shielding were maybe because Ive been using materials that reflect rf and my understanding is that they can cause resonances and if there is a leak then those waves can bounce around inside until they are absorbed. > > Now my next attempt is by using materials that will absorb the rf waves instead. I figured an absorptive material should not cause these problems and it doesnt need to be grounded. > > So I bought a queen loft bed which is basically a bunk bed without the bottom bunk. My plan was too cover it on every side with cement board and sleep inside on the bottom. I started by covering the top with two hardibacker 500 cementboards I already had and there was about a 10% drop on the readings on my rf meter. So I slept under this for a week and its actually somewhat worse! Similar to how it was in the room with the paint. I decided to try some natural stone slate tile on top which Ive been sleeping under for about 1 week now and same! It just feels more uncomfortable, at first it felt like there was a noticeable decrease in symptoms like the fields just got quieter but after a while of being under there it got more uncomfortable , also the slight high pitched ringing in my ears is louder and much more noticeable. This does not give me hope that covering all sides will make things better or that an absorption approach will work. > > Ive slept in the living room which is on the side of the house furthest from the cell towers and is about 20 feet away from my room. I feel more comfortable there the only thing I could explain is that the extra drywall is absorbing more of the rf fields. The rf readings are slightly lower there than in my room like 10-20% lower. > > > So my understanding is that cell phone signals and the like are composed of a carrier signal which is usually high frequency and the modulated signal which is a lower frequency. The modulated signal being what affects us the most. When we are shielding we are shielding the Carrier signal right? So is it possible that the modulated signal is not being blocked or absorbed and possible made more powerful in some way? > > The rf signal is composed also of a electric and a magnetic portion is maybe the electric portion being absorbed and not the magnetic? > > > -Cris > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
Re: Why has shielding made things worse?
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Hello Chris
That is the problem I am trying to solve. Several summers I have slept in my camper out in the yard. It is aluminum covered--I didn't know that would be a Faraday cage, next summer I will ground it. Sleeping in the camper I noticed that the low grinding frequency I hear is gone but I hear a high frequency instead. The high frequency actually feels good but speeds me up to the point where I can't go to sleep. The first year I decided to ride it out, I spent 3 to 5 days awake but eventualy the high frequency got weaker and I was able to sleep. I pressume my body must have to heal and rebalance and needs several days to recover. When the world wakes up around 8:am there is too much noise for me to sleep. Last year I did the same thing, out in the camper, awake for about 3 days and then was able to sleep. This winter I lined one wall of the bedroom with household aluminim foil and grounded it. I feel better sleeping but hear a high frequency. It has been about a month now, The high frequency did drop off after about 2 weeks. I think it is easier to do in the camper because there is less electricity out there to affect me. Now in the house I am sleeping better with one wall covered but the high frequency has dropped off got stronger and then dropped a little, still a problem, but better. A new problem is that the rest of the house is worse now in comparison because I feel better in the bedroom. I was not able to take melatonin but following advice I found the weakest avaliable, 3mg and take 1/2 of that and find it works. I wish I understood this low--high frequency thing. A low frequency wave may be say- 8 feet a high frequency wave may be say- 2 inches, certain thinkness materials will block one but not the other. If a wave is 8 feet it will bounce in an 8 foot high room, but will not bounce in a 10 foot room. Does anyone understand this ?? Best Wishes, XYZ --- In [hidden email], Loni <loni326@...> wrote: > > Cris, do you turn off the electric at night. That would help also. Loni > > --- On Tue, 3/22/11, Drasko <cvijovic@...> wrote: > > > From: Drasko <cvijovic@...> > Subject: [eSens] Re: Why has shielding made things worse? > To: [hidden email] > Date: Tuesday, March 22, 2011, 7:10 AM > > > Â > > > > > Hi, Cris! > Welcome to the Club! :-) Your description fully matches my experience (described at previous "Faraday Cage" threads, and also several others presented already at Esens... When I had raised that issue a long time ago, the "Club" was rather small, at least - people were reluctant to accept that the stereotype of EM waves harming us is not fully applicable... We have to say that we don't know enough about the ES mechanisms... > Just have in mind that there is no measurable effect of the "gadgets", some of which are obvious to be efficient... Just imagine the Faraday cages could have worked the unknown way (besides shielding) in sense that they act as some weird gadgets, but in counter-direction... So I am not proposing any solution, just insisting that shielding is problematic. It is not the issue of reflection, I have tried non reflective layers (LaVita gypsum boards)... Also, reflections should have appeared at the meter. > You have the interesting observation of high-pitched "sound" remaining inside, it is exactly what I observe, but theoretically there is no way to shield the carrier while passing as you call it "the modulation". So I have no guess why it appears... > As I had once mentioned, I have a strange feeling that overhead shields are specially tormenting, but I didn't have time to further experiment with cages without ceiling... Anyway, I would appreciate any observations on the issue! > Last year I wanted to research all that further, but didn't catch up with time... Maybe we can start a research group dedicated to the issue, some of next days... > Regards, > > Drasko > > --- In [hidden email], "cris_aov" <cris_aov@> wrote: > > > > Hi everyone havnt posted in a while. > > > > I live on the same block as 2 cell towers and a 3 story building called earth connections which has a few big satelite recievers that are visible on the roof and there may also have antennas. They are like half a block from my house and my room is on the side of the house closest to them. > > > > I had painted my room with y-shield about 2 years ago grounded to a 5ft ground rod outside and also tried it ungrounded but both ways made things worse. The best way I can explain it is that it felt like some of the radiation was blocked but a portion was amplified and made worse. It was more intolerable to be inside the room with the paint than when it didnt have the paint. After about 1 year of sleeping in that room I stripped the paint and felt better. > > > > Ive also tried sleeping with a copper fabric blanket grounded and ungrounded and it was very similar feeling but more intense to when I was sleeping in the room with the y-shield. > > > > Ive had some mild success with the naturashield fabric and copper fabric only when covering certain parts of my body but not as a blanket. > > > > I figured that my unsuccesful attempts at shielding were maybe because Ive been using materials that reflect rf and my understanding is that they can cause resonances and if there is a leak then those waves can bounce around inside until they are absorbed. > > > > Now my next attempt is by using materials that will absorb the rf waves instead. I figured an absorptive material should not cause these problems and it doesnt need to be grounded. > > > > So I bought a queen loft bed which is basically a bunk bed without the bottom bunk. My plan was too cover it on every side with cement board and sleep inside on the bottom. I started by covering the top with two hardibacker 500 cementboards I already had and there was about a 10% drop on the readings on my rf meter. So I slept under this for a week and its actually somewhat worse! Similar to how it was in the room with the paint. I decided to try some natural stone slate tile on top which Ive been sleeping under for about 1 week now and same! It just feels more uncomfortable, at first it felt like there was a noticeable decrease in symptoms like the fields just got quieter but after a while of being under there it got more uncomfortable , also the slight high pitched ringing in my ears is louder and much more noticeable. This does not give me hope that covering all sides will make things better or that an absorption approach will work. > > > > Ive slept in the living room which is on the side of the house furthest from the cell towers and is about 20 feet away from my room. I feel more comfortable there the only thing I could explain is that the extra drywall is absorbing more of the rf fields. The rf readings are slightly lower there than in my room like 10-20% lower. > > > > > > So my understanding is that cell phone signals and the like are composed of a carrier signal which is usually high frequency and the modulated signal which is a lower frequency. The modulated signal being what affects us the most. When we are shielding we are shielding the Carrier signal right? So is it possible that the modulated signal is not being blocked or absorbed and possible made more powerful in some way? > > > > The rf signal is composed also of a electric and a magnetic portion is maybe the electric portion being absorbed and not the magnetic? > > > > > > -Cris > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > |
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I won't claim to understand all this, but here are some thoughts.
It may be that a 10 or 20 % reduction is completely insignificant. You can barely see a 10% reduction in lighting, and won't tell the difference between two sounds differing 10% in volume unless they are one right after the other. How quiet the background is would matter more, so a bed with cement board around it may be quieter and that may make the ringing sound worse. As for grounding, if there is an RF resonance, you need a path to ground that is at least 1/8 times as wide as it is long. A skinny grounding rod is not very good at high frequencies. You want that plus some metal flashing. A serious RF ground will have multiple ground rods connected by thick wires, usually welded. Long wires have inductance and it's the combination of inductance and capacitance that gives you resonance. Putting ferrites on wires can disrupt the resonance by adding damping. As for more exotic speculative explanations, many materials like quartz are piezoelectric. If the quartz is all oriented (which is unlikely) it will rectify the RF and generated a demodulated signal. Your bones and tendons may be doing this too, which may be what you can hear. It seems unlikely that cement board would play any role in this, but not inconceivable. Bill On Tue, Mar 22, 2011 at 12:03 PM, [hidden email] < [hidden email]> wrote: > > > Hello Chris > > That is the problem I am trying to solve. > > Several summers I have slept in my camper out in the yard. It is aluminum > covered--I didn't know that would be a Faraday cage, next summer I will > ground it. > > Sleeping in the camper I noticed that the low grinding frequency I hear is > gone but I hear a high frequency instead. The high frequency actually feels > good but speeds me up to the point where I can't go to sleep. > > The first year I decided to ride it out, I spent 3 to 5 days awake but > eventualy the high frequency got weaker and I was able to sleep. I pressume > my body must have to heal and rebalance and needs several days to recover. > When the world wakes up around 8:am there is too much noise for me to sleep. > > Last year I did the same thing, out in the camper, awake for about 3 days > and then was able to sleep. > > This winter I lined one wall of the bedroom with household aluminim foil > and grounded it. > > I feel better sleeping but hear a high frequency. It has been about a month > now, The high frequency did drop off after about 2 weeks. I think it is > easier to do in the camper because there is less electricity out there to > affect me. > > Now in the house I am sleeping better with one wall covered but the high > frequency has dropped off got stronger and then dropped a little, still a > problem, but better. > > A new problem is that the rest of the house is worse now in comparison > because I feel better in the bedroom. > > I was not able to take melatonin but following advice I found the weakest > avaliable, 3mg and take 1/2 of that and find it works. > > I wish I understood this low--high frequency thing. A low frequency wave > may be say- 8 feet a high frequency wave may be say- 2 inches, certain > thinkness materials will block one but not the other. If a wave is 8 feet it > will bounce in an 8 foot high room, but will not bounce in a 10 foot room. > Does anyone understand this ?? > > Best Wishes, XYZ > > > --- In [hidden email], Loni <loni326@...> wrote: > > > > Cris, do you turn off the electric at night. That would help also. Loni > > > > --- On Tue, 3/22/11, Drasko <cvijovic@...> wrote: > > > > > > From: Drasko <cvijovic@...> > > > Subject: [eSens] Re: Why has shielding made things worse? > > To: [hidden email] > > Date: Tuesday, March 22, 2011, 7:10 AM > > > > > > Â > > > > > > > > > > Hi, Cris! > > Welcome to the Club! :-) Your description fully matches my experience > (described at previous "Faraday Cage" threads, and also several others > presented already at Esens... When I had raised that issue a long time ago, > the "Club" was rather small, at least - people were reluctant to accept that > the stereotype of EM waves harming us is not fully applicable... We have to > say that we don't know enough about the ES mechanisms... > > Just have in mind that there is no measurable effect of the "gadgets", > some of which are obvious to be efficient... Just imagine the Faraday cages > could have worked the unknown way (besides shielding) in sense that they act > as some weird gadgets, but in counter-direction... So I am not proposing any > solution, just insisting that shielding is problematic. It is not the issue > of reflection, I have tried non reflective layers (LaVita gypsum boards)... > Also, reflections should have appeared at the meter. > > You have the interesting observation of high-pitched "sound" remaining > inside, it is exactly what I observe, but theoretically there is no way to > shield the carrier while passing as you call it "the modulation". So I have > no guess why it appears... > > As I had once mentioned, I have a strange feeling that overhead shields > are specially tormenting, but I didn't have time to further experiment with > cages without ceiling... Anyway, I would appreciate any observations on the > issue! > > Last year I wanted to research all that further, but didn't catch up with > time... Maybe we can start a research group dedicated to the issue, some of > next days... > > Regards, > > > > Drasko > > > > --- In [hidden email], "cris_aov" <cris_aov@> wrote: > > > > > > Hi everyone havnt posted in a while. > > > > > > I live on the same block as 2 cell towers and a 3 story building called > earth connections which has a few big satelite recievers that are visible on > the roof and there may also have antennas. They are like half a block from > my house and my room is on the side of the house closest to them. > > > > > > I had painted my room with y-shield about 2 years ago grounded to a 5ft > ground rod outside and also tried it ungrounded but both ways made things > worse. The best way I can explain it is that it felt like some of the > radiation was blocked but a portion was amplified and made worse. It was > more intolerable to be inside the room with the paint than when it didnt > have the paint. After about 1 year of sleeping in that room I stripped the > paint and felt better. > > > > > > Ive also tried sleeping with a copper fabric blanket grounded and > ungrounded and it was very similar feeling but more intense to when I was > sleeping in the room with the y-shield. > > > > > > Ive had some mild success with the naturashield fabric and copper > fabric only when covering certain parts of my body but not as a blanket. > > > > > > I figured that my unsuccesful attempts at shielding were maybe because > Ive been using materials that reflect rf and my understanding is that they > can cause resonances and if there is a leak then those waves can bounce > around inside until they are absorbed. > > > > > > Now my next attempt is by using materials that will absorb the rf waves > instead. I figured an absorptive material should not cause these problems > and it doesnt need to be grounded. > > > > > > So I bought a queen loft bed which is basically a bunk bed without the > bottom bunk. My plan was too cover it on every side with cement board and > sleep inside on the bottom. I started by covering the top with two > hardibacker 500 cementboards I already had and there was about a 10% drop on > the readings on my rf meter. So I slept under this for a week and its > actually somewhat worse! Similar to how it was in the room with the paint. I > decided to try some natural stone slate tile on top which Ive been sleeping > under for about 1 week now and same! It just feels more uncomfortable, at > first it felt like there was a noticeable decrease in symptoms like the > fields just got quieter but after a while of being under there it got more > uncomfortable , also the slight high pitched ringing in my ears is louder > and much more noticeable. This does not give me hope that covering all sides > will make things better or that an absorption approach will work. > > > > > > Ive slept in the living room which is on the side of the house furthest > from the cell towers and is about 20 feet away from my room. I feel more > comfortable there the only thing I could explain is that the extra drywall > is absorbing more of the rf fields. The rf readings are slightly lower there > than in my room like 10-20% lower. > > > > > > > > > So my understanding is that cell phone signals and the like are > composed of a carrier signal which is usually high frequency and the > modulated signal which is a lower frequency. The modulated signal being what > affects us the most. When we are shielding we are shielding the Carrier > signal right? So is it possible that the modulated signal is not being > blocked or absorbed and possible made more powerful in some way? > > > > > > The rf signal is composed also of a electric and a magnetic portion is > maybe the electric portion being absorbed and not the magnetic? > > > > > > > > > -Cris > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] ------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eSens/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eSens/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: [hidden email] [hidden email] <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [hidden email] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ |
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In case anyone has thought about buying a "Mega-Chi pendant" in the
past but has not because it costs US$300, I see that there is a used one on eBay right now with a "Buy It Now" price of US$60... I'd buy this myself, except I don't think I need more than I already have! I find this to be one of the more effective "pendant" solutions, although as we all know, everyone responds differently to these sorts of things... Marc |
Re: Why has shielding made things worse?
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In reply to this post by Drasko Cvijovic-2
Drasko wrote:
> So I am not proposing any solution, just insisting that shielding is problematic. I will agree with that. I too get the feeling it is better, then feel later it is not enough. Perhaps this is why I prefer to emphasize getting some Distance between you and the tower, or any strong carrier signal that meters Can pick up. Stewart |
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Shielding concerns only half of the problem.
With shielding, one holds the transversal waves. And the body reacts to that. But the longitudinal waves go right through the shielding, and continue to work on the body. The properties of the longitudinal waves may change when they pass a shielding. Greetings, Charles Claessens member Verband Baubiologie www.milieuziektes.nl www.milieuziektes.be www.hetbitje.nl checked by Norton ----- Original Message ----- From: S Andreason To: [hidden email] Sent: Wednesday, March 23, 2011 12:10 AM Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: Why has shielding made things worse? Drasko wrote: > So I am not proposing any solution, just insisting that shielding is problematic. I will agree with that. I too get the feeling it is better, then feel later it is not enough. Perhaps this is why I prefer to emphasize getting some Distance between you and the tower, or any strong carrier signal that meters Can pick up. Stewart ------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
Re: Why has shielding made things worse?
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In reply to this post by S Andreason
> So I am not proposing any solution, just insisting that shielding
> is problematic. It sounds like some people have benefited from "shielding" with wood. For those of you didn't like what happened after shielding with normal shielding materials, have you tried using wood instead and seen if it helped/hurt/didn't make a difference? Marc |
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In reply to this post by charles-4
""What carrier frequencies do you need to shield?"""
The carrier signals from the cell towers and maybe from the earth connections building. I dont have a spectrum analyzer or anything like that so I cant say what frequencies they are. "This material should help, for up to at least 10 GHz:""" Ive tried the carbon material from lessemf a while back and I also have some graphite felt that is like 1/10" thick and I made cover me on top but that also caused the same uncomfortable feeling. ""Hi, Cris! Welcome to the Club! :-) Your description fully matches my experience (described at previous "Faraday Cage" threads, and also several others presented already at Esens... When I had raised that issue a long time ago, the "Club" was rather small, at least - people were reluctant to accept that the stereotype of EM waves harming us is not fully applicable... We have to say that we don't know enough about the ES mechanisms... Just have in mind that there is no measurable effect of the "gadgets", some of which are obvious to be efficient... Just imagine the Faraday cages could have worked the unknown way (besides shielding) in sense that they act as some weird gadgets, but in counter-direction... So I am not proposing any solution, just insisting that shielding is problematic. It is not the issue of reflection, I have tried non reflective layers (LaVita gypsum boards)... Also, reflections should have appeared at the meter""" -Hi Drasko! Ive read your posts before, yes this is a sad club to be in. The lavita does have a conductive layer on it though that needs to be grounded from what Ive read, I figured if I used a non conductive absorber I might have better success but so far not so much. I figured that maybe the conductive material around us was have the problem since it is not a natural thing, throughout our evolution we have always lived in stone, adobe, or some type of brick or concrete habitat and many people live in stone or brick/concrete homes to this day with no problem. Have you tried concrete or some type of natural stone or ceramic as an absorber before? """You have the interesting observation of high-pitched "sound" remaining inside, it is exactly what I observe, but theoretically there is no way to shield the carrier while passing as you call it "the modulation". So I have no guess why it appears...""" Oh ok so if you shield the carrier signal "the modulation" or the other pulses on the carrier signal will be reduced or blocked to the same degree as the carrier signal, would this be correct? And would this be because the modulated signal cant travel without the carrier even a small distance? """As I had once mentioned, I have a strange feeling that overhead shields are specially tormenting, but I didn't have time to further experiment with cages without ceiling... Anyway, I would appreciate any observations on the issue!""" Ive observed the same thing when I was in the room with the paint I felt as if the negative energy or whatever was coming from the top. I had figured this was maybe because there is more radiation coming from the ceiling since the outside walls of my house have stucco which can absorb some rf, so the rf fields reacted with the paint on the ceiling much stronger. I cant compare right now since I only have the top of the loft bed covered. ""Last year I wanted to research all that further, but didn't catch up with time... Maybe we can start a research group dedicated to the issue, some of next days... Regards, Drasko""""" Definitely! Im in. I want to solve this issue. ""Sleeping in the camper I noticed that the low grinding frequency I hear is gone but I hear a high frequency instead. The high frequency actually feels good but speeds me up to the point where I can't go to sleep."" I also feel like It speeds me up, my heart beats a bit faster and more adrenaline is being produced its uncomfortable and makes it harder to sleep. """Have you shielded the windows at all?""" Yes. Ive also turned off the breaker to my room and this does provide a small measure of relief in some way but I still have the main problem. I also have almost everything in the house connected to isobar power strips to reduce dirty electricity. Im pretty sure dirty electricity is not the main issue since I sleep better in the living room and in another bedroom and they have share the same circuit as my room and have the same level of dirty electricity. Bill, Charles, Marc I will do a little more research and try responding to your posts tomorrow. |
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Just want to add one more question.
My understanding is that when an absorber absorbs an rf signal it converts it into current which then gets converted to heat, is it possible that this current that is produced could somehow be causing the problems were experiencing with shielding? Is the current maybe creating some type of magnetic field? |
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In reply to this post by cris_aov
puk replies - I remember when I purchased high performance silver mesh many
years ago to cover my main bedroom window, as soon as I put it up I could feel the electric fields from it, which really blunted my optimism, but it still hanging there some 8yrs on, I keep my distance from it, that said I has probably past its sell by date now ? Sheilding sounds good but its not a panacea, its great for electronics and military applications but we are working with the complexities of the humans body that want s to live in as natural state as it perceives it can - being in the vicinity of so much artificial radiation is like trying to pug the hoover dam with your fingers and toes, you are fighting a losing battle. As far as this post is concerned I rekon that although the absorbing material will impede the flow of rf energy the theory re current flow and heat is correct to a point, but on the basis that you cant destroy energy only change its state so I would rekon that there is indeed energy in the form of electrons is pooling in the materiel (frequency may be altered here?)and from time to time and when it reaches full capacity is fluxing/flashing out to couple up to the nearest other absorber in the room ie you. Indeed if current flow can be achieved it is likely to be via an earth lead, which should be sheilded and short i would think. You do also have the issue of reflection of rf energy which in itself could create anomolies in the room. The moral of the story is that we dont like cages ! In a message dated 23/03/2011 07:12:55 GMT Standard Time, [hidden email] writes: Just want to add one more question. My understanding is that when an absorber absorbs an rf signal it converts it into current which then gets converted to heat, is it possible that this current that is produced could somehow be causing the problems were experiencing with shielding? Is the current maybe creating some type of magnetic field? [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
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In reply to this post by cris_aov
PUK repllies - I am with Bill all the way, sheilding is probably best left
to highly experienced experts, not diy. In a message dated 22/03/2011 19:16:22 GMT Standard Time, [hidden email] writes: I won't claim to understand all this, but here are some thoughts. It may be that a 10 or 20 % reduction is completely insignificant. You can barely see a 10% reduction in lighting, and won't tell the difference between two sounds differing 10% in volume unless they are one right after the other. How quiet the background is would matter more, so a bed with cement board around it may be quieter and that may make the ringing sound worse. As for grounding, if there is an RF resonance, you need a path to ground that is at least 1/8 times as wide as it is long. A skinny grounding rod is not very good at high frequencies. You want that plus some metal flashing. A serious RF ground will have multiple ground rods connected by thick wires, usually welded. Long wires have inductance and it's the combination of inductance and capacitance that gives you resonance. Putting ferrites on wires can disrupt the resonance by adding damping. As for more exotic speculative explanations, many materials like quartz are piezoelectric. If the quartz is all oriented (which is unlikely) it will rectify the RF and generated a demodulated signal. Your bones and tendons may be doing this too, which may be what you can hear. It seems unlikely that cement board would play any role in this, but not inconceivable. Bill [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
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In reply to this post by Marc Martin
Hi, Marc! Well, regarding wooden shields, I had made some years ago (myself! :-)) a totally wooden house (hut) of some 6 square meters only, walls 2 inches wood, and it did give somewhat different feeling inside but I am not positive on the final conclusion... Than last year I made a bigger hut, of twice thinner wood, and the feeling was similar... I was not very happy with it (keep old stuff and garden tools now there)... But... Maybe it was worth more trials because it does make some difference... What I found the most pronounced was some dizziness after prolonged stay, like lack of mental brightness, but I dare to say that such dizziness is sometimes for me associated with places in wilderness where there is null radiation... Drasko --- In [hidden email], "Marc Martin" <marc@...> wrote: > > > So I am not proposing any solution, just insisting that shielding > > is problematic. > > It sounds like some people have benefited from "shielding" with wood. > For those of you didn't like what happened after shielding with > normal shielding materials, have you tried using wood instead and > seen if it helped/hurt/didn't make a difference? > > Marc > |
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PUK REPLIES - I have a log cabin at the end of my 80m garden its 3.5mx4m
made of 28mm sweedish pine, I find the space better than the house ie no electricity just 12 volt lights and a wood burner. One thought is that the wood probably offers very little protection against rf scources so while the space offers warmth and light you are essentially sitting in the open like a sitting duck. I rekon if I sat almost anywhere for long enough in the open in one small area I would feel familiar ES symptoms. The log cabin has sprung a leak in the roof due to poor quality felt and I was slow to fix it so now I have to remediate black mold patches that set into the wood and as for the wood burner which I made from a gas cinister although a very good effort which served me well for 2 yrs I began to wonder if this was cuasing me additional problems from both the kindling I was using ie, wooden fruit boxes that are likely sprayed over with thiabendozole pesticde and also the menace of carbin minoxide in such a small space - I am now saving to buy a proper sealed wood burner and stainles steel flue. I also have the added menace that when the couple who have the menacing Plasma TV go to bed at 9pm, the man at the end of my garden behind the log cabin starts up his Ham radio ! i REMAIN OPTOMISTIC nevertheless.. puk In a message dated 23/03/2011 10:40:23 GMT Standard Time, [hidden email] writes: Hi, Marc! Well, regarding wooden shields, I had made some years ago (myself! :-)) a totally wooden house (hut) of some 6 square meters only, walls 2 inches wood, and it did give somewhat different feeling inside but I am not positive on the final conclusion... Than last year I made a bigger hut, of twice thinner wood, and the feeling was similar... I was not very happy with it (keep old stuff and garden tools now there)... But... Maybe it was worth more trials because it does make some difference... What I found the most pronounced was some dizziness after prolonged stay, like lack of mental brightness, but I dare to say that such dizziness is sometimes for me associated with places in wilderness where there is null radiation... Drasko [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
Re: Why has shielding made things worse?
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In reply to this post by cris_aov
Cris, That with adsorption is something I was also thinking about!! I am now too busy, but hope to get in touch with you more soon! Meanwhile, yes, you are right - there is a difference between conductive and non-conductive shields, in sense that micro currents induced in conductive ones would necessarily have micro magnetic fields around them!! Still, such magnetic fields are extremely low, and also unable to propagate as a wave further, they propagate as static magnetic field which diminishes fast with distance, but there is some food for thoughts in it, maybe... Per your question, I have underground room with meter thick concrete walls, and feel more or less ok there... But it not as good as one should think according to the meter... Anyway, such adsorbing shields I consider much better... Drasko --- In [hidden email], "cris_aov" <cris_aov@...> wrote: > > Just want to add one more question. > > My understanding is that when an absorber absorbs an rf signal it converts it into current which then gets converted to heat, is it possible that this current that is produced could somehow be causing the problems were experiencing with shielding? Is the current maybe creating some type of magnetic field? > |
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Shielding may cause what I call *dirty air* measurable at 1 meter distance.
Especially carbon. Be also aware that the steel reinforcement bars in concrete do work like a secundary antenna , and do transmit elektrosmog. Greetings, Charles Claessens member Verband Baubiologie www.milieuziektes.nl www.milieuziektes.be www.hetbitje.nl checked by Norton ----- Original Message ----- From: Drasko To: [hidden email] Sent: Wednesday, March 23, 2011 12:03 PM Subject: [eSens] Re: Why has shielding made things worse? Cris, That with adsorption is something I was also thinking about!! I am now too busy, but hope to get in touch with you more soon! Meanwhile, yes, you are right - there is a difference between conductive and non-conductive shields, in sense that micro currents induced in conductive ones would necessarily have micro magnetic fields around them!! Still, such magnetic fields are extremely low, and also unable to propagate as a wave further, they propagate as static magnetic field which diminishes fast with distance, but there is some food for thoughts in it, maybe... Per your question, I have underground room with meter thick concrete walls, and feel more or less ok there... But it not as good as one should think according to the meter... Anyway, such adsorbing shields I consider much better... Drasko --- In [hidden email], "cris_aov" <cris_aov@...> wrote: > > Just want to add one more question. > > My understanding is that when an absorber absorbs an rf signal it converts it into current which then gets converted to heat, is it possible that this current that is produced could somehow be causing the problems were experiencing with shielding? Is the current maybe creating some type of magnetic field? > ------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
Re: Why has shielding made things worse?
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In reply to this post by cris_aov
What kind of material would you suggest for a radio tower? I have a tower that looks like a radio tower probably a mile away.
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