what is a denominator?

I have just tested a "neutralizer" from India (!) that allegedly neutralizes Emfs as well as "geopathic stress" etc... It does do - something... It is imprinted metal in form of a kind of "Mandala" (circle) shape, in printed circuit technology (can upload a scanned image would you wish)...

Also, I remembered to mention that real fire stoves and fireplaces have beneficial effect to me, a kind that could be compared to "anti-emf" magic devices...

What is the denominator for all that stuff? What is the clue to understanding?





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> Also, I remembered to mention that real fire stoves and fireplaces have
> beneficial effect to me, a kind that could be compared to "anti-emf"
> magic devices...
>
> What is the denominator for all that stuff?

Hmmm, that is interesting... aside from the warmth they generate,
are fire stoves and fireplaces *healthy* ? I would think they
increase the amount of positive ions and degrade the quality
of the air.... but I have never researched these.

Perhaps the common factor is that they are both bad for you?
Suppressing the immune system reduces your ES symptoms? Have
you tried smoking a cigarette or drinking some alchohol and
see what that does to your ES? :-)

Marc

Hi Drasko,

Is there a spiral on it and which way does it spiral?? (probably not like a 6, darn devil)

I know the spiral is important. Grounding is spiral ccwise looking up and again ccwise looking down. Phi has to do with the spiral. Sometimes i like to look in theory behind spirituality, then later i wished i had just done it before my mind has a sufficient explanation. We have to use the mind to get to the Heart, this means to beat the ego-part of it at the same time.

The fiery element helps me as well. Incense, open fire, candles, roots of plants, prayer.. some say narly entities cannot stand fire...( I intend to be the fiery element that chases all that crap)

Have been pretty much free of es now. Lately sometimes there is psychic attack and i feel that somehow my chakra s get to spiral the wrong way during it, maybe because the "person?" *doing it* is fearful or just plain spiralling in a direction that lowers consiousness.

Wish i could communicate clearer. Sometimes it just comes clear (think there were two messages i wrote here like that), a taste of the new mind perhaps??

Love and Light

To beat that snake we need to leave judgement (cough up that apple, knowledge of good and evil was not all that after all)
For some maybe better to say, each time you judge the Ph in your body gets messed up and you gotta alkalize again. So judge not.

Drasko Cvijovic <[hidden email]> wrote:

I have just tested a "neutralizer" from India (!) that allegedly neutralizes Emfs as well as "geopathic stress" etc... It does do - something... It is imprinted metal in form of a kind of "Mandala" (circle) shape, in printed circuit technology (can upload a scanned image would you wish)...

Also, I remembered to mention that real fire stoves and fireplaces have beneficial effect to me, a kind that could be compared to "anti-emf" magic devices...

What is the denominator for all that stuff? What is the clue to understanding?





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The following is and excerpt from HTTP://www.asc-alchemy.com from white powder gold. Interesting theory for the most part and may try some of their products one day.. For now the search for goldenseal continous and i'll get another pot of that carrot cream as well...


"Besides the pure powder what are other safe natural sources of monatomic elements? Certain plants can indeed contain high levels of monatomic elements; however once again the key is the soil in which they are grown. Some of the mucopolysaccharides from aloe vera may contain high amounts of monatomic elements, again the key is in the soil. Not only the fertility, but the geological history.
Along with the ingredients in our formulations, here are some other natural substances rich in monatomic elements
Burdock root
Blood Root
Bilberries
Carrots
Golden Seal
Grapes (some varieties very high)
Aloe leaf
Dioscorea
St. Johns Wort
Sheep Sorrel
Water Cress
The key here is always the abundance of monatomic elements in the soil in which these are grown. For example, carrots grown a matter of miles apart can vary widely in amounts of monatomic elements depending on the soil; the same holds true for the herbs.
There are some delightful folks doing work with herbal combinations rich in m-state that offer these for sale. Again, although we don't offer this approach we know folks who do and will be glad to recommend; another very valid approach. Good people doing good work." ////

Have also seen borage oil called "liquid gold"....


Anyone try any of these producs??



Love and Light


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Hi,

Flames make negative ions, so they're neutralizing all that positive
icky static around.

I've used wood heat for a number of years, and always it felt
beneficial. Same for candles, although I've noticed depending on the
wax they're made from seems to change the feel some. (I don't care
for the palm wax, haven't tried soy yet.)

There is something about wood fires more beneficial in this area than
just any flame, although I can't say what, because now I've been
using propane fireplace, and while it's nice, it doesn't have the
same soothing effect.

Wood heat doesn't have to be bad for your health, with a good stove,
and some knowledge, you're not going to have the smoke coming in, or
very little. It can still be bad, if you have asthma, although it
never seemed to bother mine or my daughter's, like the cigarette
smoke from visiting her Dad always did, and made her sick every time.

(Want to test for negative ions, just get a staticky charge on a
sock, or plastic baggie, or whatever and carefully hold it up close
to the flame, and you can watch it dissipate. Little styrofoam bits
in the bag is an easy one to watch.

While I'm talking about static. I don't that this would help anyone
or not. But for relieving achey cfs/fibro. type pain, using a +
static charge is helpful for some reason. Take a piece of pvc pipe,
or anything you can build static up on. Get that charged up, and
slowly wave it along a couple inches above the hurting areas. Brings
relief. Or- wearing synthetic, wool, or silk fabrics will bring a
static charge. I've found for when I hurt, using a 100% synthetic
blanket brings relief, vs. the usual cotton I like.

Natural plant fibers give negative charge (unless you've overdried
them in the drier, and are messing them up with things like fabric
softener.) Cotton, linen, ramie, all negative. Really good for
bringing relief to the achiness you get from the flu. Can bring more
restful sleep too.

(Why the other brings me relief from certain pain I don't know, but
it has to do with the charges, and everything that exists has some
kind of frequency to it.)

~Snoshoe



--- In [hidden email], "Marc Martin" <marc@u...> wrote:
>
> > Also, I remembered to mention that real fire stoves and
fireplaces have
> > beneficial effect to me, a kind that could be compared to "anti-
emf"

Marc, Snoshoe and "Perla1133", thank you for your replies!

Marc, does fire make negative or positive ions? Snoshoe says it's negative!?

But anyway your idea about attenuating of immune system could make some
sense! I have to think it further, as I noticed that some my breakdowns do
make some benefit, somehow!
By the way, the Indian neutralizer does have a spiral, as perla1133 says
(what was her name I forgot?). Also my appreciated Russian one has a spiral,
diffrent one indeed... But it is diffcult to say are they clockwise or
opposite as they have no 'bottom side" so one weay they are clockwise, the
other opposite!
Spiral has been suggested by some other sources as a shape of influence, so
i am seriously taking this suggestion into account, despites it has nothing
to do with measurable EMFs!
I highly appreciate all those suggestions, however weird they might be, as
the final clue about what we in fact sense is obviously beyond current
scientific deduction!

Drasko


----- Original Message -----
From: "Marc Martin" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Friday, October 07, 2005 9:12 PM
Subject: Re: [eSens] what is a denominator?

> Marc, does fire make negative or positive ions? Snoshoe says it's negative!?

It sounds like Snoshoe knows more about this subject than I do.
It would make sense that negative ions would reduce your ES
symptoms.

Have you ever tried the gemstone/mineral black tourmaline?
It is supposed to emit negative ions as well. This causes
unpleasant detox symptoms for me though, so it seems pretty
powerful for a little rock!

Marc

Hi, Marc,

I am brand new here--this is my first day. I am just curious about
your "rock"! :) How long did you use it and how did you use it?
Did you carry it around in a pocket or something? How large was it?  
Forgive me if I am naive, this is all very new to me. I have read that
negative ions detox your system of all sorts of things--viral,
bacterial, fungal, parasitic, as well as heavy metals. So, you think
your reaction is due to die-off?

I am here researching the affects/causal relationships of serotonin,
pH, +/- Hydrogen ions in water and air, and electrical currents (inside
the body), btw. I found this forum fascinating when I stumbled across
it while researching ionization. I have always "killed" every watch I
ever owned (mechanical and battery) if I wear it next to my skin. I am
wondering if ES is why! Do you know if people who have ES kill
mechanical watches, too? I "spark" quite alot, as well, though I do
not usually have problems with computer screens, etc, affecting me.  
(Sometimes I go thru periods where I affect electrical appliances or
cause my computer to crash because of zapping.)

While I am at it, I will introduce myself to the group a bit: I have
MCS and post-exertional fatigue which is somehow connected to
hyperactive serotonin. (I fit the subset of people with Chronic
Fatigue Syndrome who respond to Enada NADH therapy, which probably not
coincidently, makes extra H- ions in the body.) I mainly have celiac
disease which causes leaky gut/malabsorption, gut flora imbalances,
various auto-immune diseases, and blood-brain barrier breakdown, but is
treatable with a gluten-free diet. (Though the AI diseases you get
before being dxed are not cured with the diet and you have to kill off
the gut bugs through heroic other measures. ;) ) I identify very much
with "Sue" whose husband writes here so often about, tho I am no longer
that ill. I was home/bed-bound for most of my adult life till 5 years
ago when I was dxed with celiac disease.

Great forum, btw! Hi, everybody!
Diane aka Evie

--- In [hidden email], Marc Martin <marc@u...> wrote:

Hi Diane,

Welcome to the list!

When you ask about my "rock", I assume that you are referring to
the black tourmaline? This was a very small, and cost me about
US$5 from a local mineral/gem shop. I tried wearing it in my
pocket and placing it near my computer. I didn't try for this
for very long, because it made me feel bad. I don't think
it was die-off... I think it was instead heavy metals mobilized
into my bloodstream, and not being dealt with or eliminated
by my liver. I say this because of my symptoms, and having
similar symptoms from mercury chelators and other things
known to mobilize metals.

It's interesting that you are interested in Hydrogen ions --
one thing that I have found helpful to my "chronic fatigue"
and also my ES has been sources of H-. There are 2 supplements
in particular which provide these that I have obvious benefits
from -- one is called Megahydrin (aka "Active H-" aka "Microhydrin"),
and the other is called "Cellfood". In both cases, when used
in moderation (usually far less than the recommended dose)
I have improved tolerance to EMF and improved energy. However,
increasing the dose makes me feel bad -- in this case, it
may indeed be die-off or excess metal mobilization.

I personally don't seem to have adverse effects on electrical
devices. I used to "spark" a lot, but then got shoes with
anti-static soles and that fixed that.

Marc

Hi again, Marc,

Thanks for your (REALLY) fast reply! :)

> I think it was instead heavy metals mobilized
> into my bloodstream, and not being dealt with or eliminated
> by my liver. I say this because of my symptoms, and having
> similar symptoms from mercury chelators and other things
> known to mobilize metals.

What are the symptoms that you get from mobilizing metals? I was
wondering how they differ from die-off.

> It's interesting that you are interested in Hydrogen ions --
> one thing that I have found helpful to my "chronic fatigue"
> and also my ES has been sources of H-. There are 2 supplements
> in particular which provide these that I have obvious benefits
> from -- one is called Megahydrin (aka "Active H-"aka "Microhydrin"),
> and the other is called "Cellfood".  

Very interesting, indeed! I ran across the Megahydrin during my
research, but it was roughly the same cost as the Enada NADH. I will
look into the "Cellfood", as I am looking for a more cost efficient
way to deal with the H- problem. The H-, btw, is implicated with
serotonin blockage and usage, though I am not far enough along in the
research to elaborate in detail about this. pH is also involved and
all of this is a very deep subject! (Wish I had more neurons to deal
with all the deepness. haha) Do you consider yourself one who has
chronic fatigue syndrome or just one with periods of chronic fatigue?
Have you ever tried negative hydrogen water? I think I saw where you
have tried an ionizer? How did those/that work for you? I am very
interested in a negative hydrogen water generator, but want to make
sure they are not snake-oil in disguise first.

> I have improved tolerance to EMF and improved energy [from
megahydrin and Cellfood]. However,
> increasing the dose makes me feel bad -- in this case, it
> may indeed be die-off or excess metal mobilization.

Interesting, also about improved EMF with H- use--I am seeming to see
a trend that pH, serotonin, H- ions influence internal electrical
current. That is a subject I am REALLY in the dark about,
unfortunately.

> I personally don't seem to have adverse effects on electrical
> devices. I used to "spark" a lot, but then got shoes with
> anti-static soles and that fixed that.

Since this is all rather new to me (and I didn't do much walking at
all prior to 5 years ago), I had not even thought of anti-static
shoes till I read this site. I have a pair of plastic beach shoes I
wear around the house and, now that you mention it, I think they seem
to help.

Sorry to keep asking so many questions! I am really intrigued as to
how this all fits together.  

Thanks for your very speedy reply,
Diane aka Evie

> What are the symptoms that you get from mobilizing metals? I was
> wondering how they differ from die-off.

For me, I associate die-off with feelings of nausea, perhaps
diaharea, gas, and exhaustion. Mobilizing metals on the other
hand seems to be sharp pains in my head (or sometimes hands
and feet), agitation/panic attacks, sweaty-ness, strong
smelling urine, hyperactivity, etc.

I recall the tourmaline causing sweating and sharp pains
in my head.

> Very interesting, indeed! I ran across the Megahydrin during my
> research, but it was roughly the same cost as the Enada NADH. I will
> look into the "Cellfood", as I am looking for a more cost efficient
> way to deal with the H- problem.

Cellfood is really cheap compared to Megahydrin, although Cellfood
contains a lot of other stuff as well (O-, enzymes, amino acids,
minerals), so this may cause some tolerance problems for chronically
ill folk. When taking "too much" of these supplements, I get more of
the symptoms I call "die-off" from Megahydrin, and more of
the symptoms I call "metals mobilization" from Cellfood.

> Do you consider yourself one who has chronic fatigue syndrome

I consider myself someone who cured myself of chronic
fatigue syndrome. I may occasionally get fatigued from
time to time these days, but no worse than anyone else.
And I get by just fine with 7-8 hours of sleep a day,
compared to 16-20 in the old days.

> I think I saw where you have tried an ionizer?
> How did those/that work for you?

I did not like the ionizers I tried, because I didn't notice
much (if any) health benefits from them, and also they
blackened the furniture/walls/carpet, and they also didn't
help with odors. On the other hand, I've noticed
health benefits (less prone to illness, fewer allergies)
from Aranizers, and also get odor control from Aranizers
and Biozone Scientific models. These are generally
classified as ozone generators, although the manufacturers
of both will say that they are different and better
than ozone generators.

> Sorry to keep asking so many questions! I am really intrigued as to
> how this all fits together.

Aren't we all? :-)

Marc

> Very interesting, indeed! I ran across the Megahydrin during my
> research, but it was roughly the same cost as the Enada NADH.

Also, thanks for the reference to Enada NADH... I'm not sure
if I ever heard of this before, and it certainly seems to
be worth trying, just to compare how I react to it compared
to the Megahydrin and Cellfood...

Diane, what specific reaction do you get from taking it?
Any unpleasant reactions from taking too much?

Marc

Hi again, Marc,

I only had the reaction of being too cold and this could be helped by moving around. This went away after a month or two. That is a reaction that is tied to the serotonin issue, I am sure, as one of the functions of serotonin is to help regulate temperature. I am one of those people who are naturally too hot and then too cold, back and forth all the time. This summer was one of the hottest on record. I was so cool most of the time that my family loved to cuddle up to me to cool off! No kidding!

I started out with 2.5 mg and worked up. I take 20 mg/15 mg now on alternating days, but if you don't have the serotonin issue, you won't need more than 10 mg. The cheapest source of this supplement seems to be "Pro Health". Their number is 800-366-6056. Their site is www.ImmuneSupport.com They no longer carry the 2.5 mg NADH (you might do a search for Enada and still find it, if you think you need to work up slowly, like I did). I use the item # p290 which costs about 62 cents/5 mg pill--it is pricey, which is why I am looking for alternatives. You can also get a smaller amount which comes to 66 cents/5 mg pill (Item # 280.)

Good luck, hope it helps,
Diane

Marc Martin <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Very interesting, indeed! I ran across the Megahydrin during my
> research, but it was roughly the same cost as the Enada NADH.

Also, thanks for the reference to Enada NADH... I'm not sure
if I ever heard of this before, and it certainly seems to
be worth trying, just to compare how I react to it compared
to the Megahydrin and Cellfood...

Diane, what specific reaction do you get from taking it?
Any unpleasant reactions from taking too much?

Marc


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Just an afterthought on the Enada...

Though it DOES make negative H ions in MY system, if you do not have the serotonin issue, that does not stand that it will do the same for you. (It might.) I would look into that a bit further, though, as I do not take it for that purpose, personally. (Though I would think it would react the same.)

Diane

Marc Martin <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Very interesting, indeed! I ran across the Megahydrin during my
> research, but it was roughly the same cost as the Enada NADH.

Also, thanks for the reference to Enada NADH... I'm not sure
if I ever heard of this before, and it certainly seems to
be worth trying, just to compare how I react to it compared
to the Megahydrin and Cellfood...

Diane, what specific reaction do you get from taking it?
Any unpleasant reactions from taking too much?

Marc


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> The cheapest source of this supplement seems to be
> "Pro Health". Their number is 800-366-6056. Their site is
> www.ImmuneSupport.com They no longer carry the 2.5 mg NADH (you might do
> a search for Enada and still find it, if you think you need to work up
> slowly, like I did).

Thanks!

A quick search revealed that there are a lot options to choose
from with "Enada NADH". There are multiple brand names, multiple
dosages, and a choice between tablets and lozenges. A bit
complicated, since there is no way to know in advance if
one choice may work and another may not.

Marc

Hi again, Marc,

Not all NADH is the same. If it is Enada NADH, then it is the same, but Enada comes in several formulations. I take the 5 mg pills--the lozenges are for a needed "spurt" of energy, from what I understand. It is also my understanding that all Enada NADH is made by the company "Menuco", but is just distributed under different brands. At least that was how it was 5 years ago when I first researched it. (It obviously could have changed since then, but I can't imagine that there is such a huge market for this product that many companies are making it, especially since it is supposed to be rather difficult to produce--hence the price).

If you are happy with the price elsewhere, it is probably the same product.

Hope this helped,
Diane

Marc Martin <[hidden email]> wrote:
> The cheapest source of this supplement seems to be
> "Pro Health". Their number is 800-366-6056. Their site is
> www.ImmuneSupport.com They no longer carry the 2.5 mg NADH (you might do
> a search for Enada and still find it, if you think you need to work up
> slowly, like I did).

Thanks!

A quick search revealed that there are a lot options to choose
from with "Enada NADH". There are multiple brand names, multiple
dosages, and a choice between tablets and lozenges. A bit
complicated, since there is no way to know in advance if
one choice may work and another may not.

Marc


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