little pool

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little pool

Daniele
a little pool for everyone:

how much time you need to take to recover from EMF exposure?

Daniele

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RE: little pool

Glenn Coleman
[how much time you need to take to recover from EMF exposure?]

I have only discovered my ES 4 months ago, and have reduced my symptoms by
about 50%. If I went back to my old diet, and removed all my ES protection
devices I would likely be back at full symptoms.

I haven't heard of many who have ES becoming 100% free from ES, without
using some type of protection device or unique diet. It seems to be a long
process, and only recently becoming more common knowledge.

My naturopath seems to think I will be ES free after one year of herbs &
heavy metal detox, but I have heard many say it will take more like 3 to 5
years, and then still require protection devices. I guess it depends on
what was the major trigger of your ES to begin with. Some have linked
their ES to heavy metals, and depending on their levels of metals in their
body and how sensitive they are to the metals.

As long as I know that I am slowly becoming less sensitive, and continually
have new ways of battling the problem, I have hope to continually get
better. It gives me continuous hope which overcomes any of my challenges.
For me sitting still, experiencing ES without doing anything about it is
what causes me to feel the most ill. As long as I continue battling it, and
continue to try new things, I feel like I am ahead of the game, and my
symptoms seem less noticable.


Glenn

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RE: little pool

Marc Martin
Administrator
> [how much time you need to take to recover from EMF exposure?]
>
> I have only discovered my ES 4 months ago, and have reduced my symptoms
> by about 50%.

I interpreted the original question differently, in that I thought it
was being asked how long after being exposed to an EMF source does it
take you to feel better. For example, 3 years ago if I sat in front of
a
laptop computer for a few minutes, it could take me two days to feel
better. These days, if I get too much EMF exposure, I usually feel
better within minutes of getting away from the EMF source. But these
days, I'm "cheating", in that I know the right foods, supplements,
and devices to overcome such problems.

Marc

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Re: little pool - Glenn

Daniele
In reply to this post by Glenn Coleman
Thank you Glenn, this is an answer at my previous question about reversable of the Electrosensybility.

Daniele
----- Original Message -----
From: Glenn Coleman
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 9:17 PM
Subject: RE: [eSens] little pool


[how much time you need to take to recover from EMF exposure?]

I have only discovered my ES 4 months ago, and have reduced my symptoms by
about 50%. If I went back to my old diet, and removed all my ES protection
devices I would likely be back at full symptoms.

I haven't heard of many who have ES becoming 100% free from ES, without
using some type of protection device or unique diet. It seems to be a long
process, and only recently becoming more common knowledge.

My naturopath seems to think I will be ES free after one year of herbs &
heavy metal detox, but I have heard many say it will take more like 3 to 5
years, and then still require protection devices. I guess it depends on
what was the major trigger of your ES to begin with. Some have linked
their ES to heavy metals, and depending on their levels of metals in their
body and how sensitive they are to the metals.

As long as I know that I am slowly becoming less sensitive, and continually
have new ways of battling the problem, I have hope to continually get
better. It gives me continuous hope which overcomes any of my challenges.
For me sitting still, experiencing ES without doing anything about it is
what causes me to feel the most ill. As long as I continue battling it, and
continue to try new things, I feel like I am ahead of the game, and my
symptoms seem less noticable.


Glenn



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Re: little pool - Marc

Daniele
In reply to this post by Marc Martin
Marc,
2 days is also my time to recover from EMF exposure.
For example, I use external keyboard now when work on my laptop but I become very ill (tired and confused) driving my scooter. I checked it with the trifield meter and found up to 50-100 milligaus (5.10 tesla) when I push on the gas ...

P.S.
What is the right food and supplements?

Daniele
----- Original Message -----
From: Marc Martin
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 9:30 PM
Subject: RE: [eSens] little pool


> [how much time you need to take to recover from EMF exposure?]
>
> I have only discovered my ES 4 months ago, and have reduced my symptoms
> by about 50%.

I interpreted the original question differently, in that I thought it
was being asked how long after being exposed to an EMF source does it
take you to feel better. For example, 3 years ago if I sat in front of
a
laptop computer for a few minutes, it could take me two days to feel
better. These days, if I get too much EMF exposure, I usually feel
better within minutes of getting away from the EMF source. But these
days, I'm "cheating", in that I know the right foods, supplements,
and devices to overcome such problems.

Marc

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Power lines

Daniele
In reply to this post by Marc Martin
Anybody know if 'UNDER GROUND" power lines have less EMF then 'AIR' ones.


Daniele

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: Power lines

Charles-3
Yes.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
checked by Norton Antivirus


----- Original Message -----
From: "Daniele" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 22:36
Subject: [eSens] Power lines


> Anybody know if 'UNDER GROUND" power lines have less EMF then 'AIR' ones.
>
>
> Daniele
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Re: Power lines

Daniele
Charles,
why you respond Yes?

My doubt is :
Distance from cables should be the sole solution to avoid EMF and 'UNDER GROUND cable, I think, are putted some meters down, not more ?!?

Daniele
----- Original Message -----
From: Charles
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 10:39 PM
Subject: Re: [eSens] Power lines


Yes.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
checked by Norton Antivirus


----- Original Message -----
From: "Daniele" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 22:36
Subject: [eSens] Power lines


> Anybody know if 'UNDER GROUND" power lines have less EMF then 'AIR' ones.
>
>
> Daniele
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>


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Re: little pool - Marc

Marc Martin
Administrator
In reply to this post by Daniele
> P.S. What is the right food and supplements?

Well, I'm sure it varies by person, but for me I have a fairly regular
routine that I have used daily for years:

-- oats / oatcakes / oatmeal
-- avocado (1/day)
-- banana (1/day)
-- apples (2/day)
-- rice & beans
-- dates or prunes
-- juiced carrots and ginger root

I'd say at the very least, give oats, avocado, and rice & beans a try.

As for supplements, I've used a sea vegetable / aloe vera drink for
years -- first I was using something called Seasilver, but in the past
year I switched to Sea Energy. I also use a probiotic called "Primal
Defense" which helps. And also Evening Primrose Oil capsules is
helpful. Also, an antioxidant called "Active H-" I've taken on and off
for years.

Combine all of the above with my Springlife Polarizers and Quantum
Products, and I'm not really affected by EMF, despite my daily *huge*
exposure to computers and florescent lights.

Marc

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Re: Power lines

Charles-3
In reply to this post by Daniele
Daniele

In answer to your question:
*Anybody know if 'UNDER GROUND" power lines have less EMF then 'AIR' ones*
I answered with Yes.
I do know, and underground they emit less EMF.

I suppose you are a woman.
If I look at you lying in bath, I can see more, than when I see you walking
on the streets (normally I think.

The same goes for cable.
When they hang in the fresh air, they are naked. Stark naked.
But when they lie under the ground, they are insulated. Heavily.

When cables hang solo, they emit more radiation, then when they hang
together with for instance with three.
Look at http://www.milieuziektes.nl/Pagina112c.html

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
checked by Norton Antivirus


----- Original Message -----
From: "Daniele" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 22:47
Subject: Re: [eSens] Power lines


>
> Charles,
> why you respond Yes?
>
> My doubt is :
> Distance from cables should be the sole solution to avoid EMF and 'UNDER
GROUND cable, I think, are putted some meters down, not more ?!?

>
> Daniele
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Charles
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 10:39 PM
> Subject: Re: [eSens] Power lines
>
>
> Yes.
>
> Greetings,
> Charles Claessens
> member Verband Baubiologie
> www.milieuziektes.nl
> checked by Norton Antivirus
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Daniele" <[hidden email]>
> To: <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 22:36
> Subject: [eSens] Power lines
>
>
> > Anybody know if 'UNDER GROUND" power lines have less EMF then 'AIR'
ones.

> >
> >
> > Daniele
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
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>
> b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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Service.

>
>
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> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Re: little pool - Marc

Marc Martin
Administrator
In reply to this post by Marc Martin
> -- oats / oatcakes / oatmeal
> -- avocado (1/day)
> -- banana (1/day)
> -- apples (2/day)
> -- rice & beans
> -- dates or prunes
> -- juiced carrots and ginger root

Oh, I forgot -- I also eat quinoa (a grain that raises your pH,
has all the essential amino acids, contains no gluten, and
is high in minerals and vitamins) almost every day, and I get
quite a bit of cranberries. Whether or not these things
specifically help with EMF is difficult to confirm, although
my perception is that they do.

Marc

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RE: little pool - Marc

Lachlan Mudge
In reply to this post by Daniele
Are you sure your trifield meter is designed to measure the frequency of EMF
that is being generated by your scooter? It is easy to get false readings
using the wrong meter for the job and I think this is possibly true in this
situation.
Lachlan

-----Original Message-----
From: Daniele [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Wednesday, 25 August 2004 6:05 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [eSens] little pool - Marc

Marc,
2 days is also my time to recover from EMF exposure.
For example, I use external keyboard now when work on my laptop but I become
very ill (tired and confused) driving my scooter. I checked it with the
trifield meter and found up to 50-100 milligaus (5.10 tesla) when I push on the
gas ...

P.S.
What is the right food and supplements?

Daniele
----- Original Message -----
From: Marc Martin
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 9:30 PM
Subject: RE: [eSens] little pool


> [how much time you need to take to recover from EMF exposure?]
>
> I have only discovered my ES 4 months ago, and have reduced my symptoms
> by about 50%.

I interpreted the original question differently, in that I thought it
was being asked how long after being exposed to an EMF source does it
take you to feel better. For example, 3 years ago if I sat in front of
a
laptop computer for a few minutes, it could take me two days to feel
better. These days, if I get too much EMF exposure, I usually feel
better within minutes of getting away from the EMF source. But these
days, I'm "cheating", in that I know the right foods, supplements,
and devices to overcome such problems.

Marc

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RE: Power lines

Lachlan Mudge
In reply to this post by Daniele
I agree with Charles and would add as explanation that the EMF associated with
any current carrying conductor depends on the distance you are from the
conductor but is also heavily dependant on the magnetic permeability and
electrical conductivity of the substance (e.g. air or soil) that separates you
from the conductor. Soil has a higher magnetic permeability than air,
therefore more of the magnetic field is 'absorbed' by the soil, leaving less to
travel through your body. Soil is also a reasonably good electrical conductor,
especially if it is wet, and generally all of the electric field associated
with the wire will be 'absorbed' by the soil. Therefore, even though an
underground power line is likely to be closer to your body, the EM fields
associated with this wire are likely to be lower, in comparison to a similar
overhead wire. I would add though that the effect you experience also depend
heavily on which aspect of EMF affects you. It could be the electric field,
the magnetic field, a combination of both or even some other aspect of the
electromagnetic phenomena, though we were only speaking of those things we can
measure. I hope this helps

Lachlan

-----Original Message-----
From: Charles [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Wednesday, 25 August 2004 6:33 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [eSens] Power lines

Daniele

In answer to your question:
*Anybody know if 'UNDER GROUND" power lines have less EMF then 'AIR' ones*
I answered with Yes.
I do know, and underground they emit less EMF.

I suppose you are a woman.
If I look at you lying in bath, I can see more, than when I see you walking
on the streets (normally I think.

The same goes for cable.
When they hang in the fresh air, they are naked. Stark naked.
But when they lie under the ground, they are insulated. Heavily.

When cables hang solo, they emit more radiation, then when they hang
together with for instance with three.
Look at http://www.milieuziektes.nl/Pagina112c.html

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
checked by Norton Antivirus


----- Original Message -----
From: "Daniele" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 22:47
Subject: Re: [eSens] Power lines


>
> Charles,
> why you respond Yes?
>
> My doubt is :
> Distance from cables should be the sole solution to avoid EMF and 'UNDER
GROUND cable, I think, are putted some meters down, not more ?!?

>
> Daniele
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Charles
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 10:39 PM
> Subject: Re: [eSens] Power lines
>
>
> Yes.
>
> Greetings,
> Charles Claessens
> member Verband Baubiologie
> www.milieuziektes.nl
> checked by Norton Antivirus
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Daniele" <[hidden email]>
> To: <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 22:36
> Subject: [eSens] Power lines
>
>
> > Anybody know if 'UNDER GROUND" power lines have less EMF then 'AIR'
ones.

> >
> >
> > Daniele
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eSens/
>
> b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> [hidden email]
>
> c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.

>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
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>
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>






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Frequency meter - Lachlan

Daniele
In reply to this post by Lachlan Mudge
Hi Lachlan,

Why you're saying that?
My trifield meter is calibrated for 50 Hz sine waves. Here in Europe I suppose everything runs with this frequency ........ mumble mumble ..... I'm just thinking that EVERYTHING runs WITH HOME ELECTRIC POWER and my scooter has indipendent generator ...

However, after I use my scooter I'm very exausted (12 hours after).

Daniele
----- Original Message -----
From: Lachlan Mudge
To: '[hidden email]'
Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 2:48 AM
Subject: RE: [eSens] little pool - Marc


Are you sure your trifield meter is designed to measure the frequency of EMF
that is being generated by your scooter? It is easy to get false readings
using the wrong meter for the job and I think this is possibly true in this
situation.
Lachlan

-----Original Message-----
From: Daniele [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Wednesday, 25 August 2004 6:05 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [eSens] little pool - Marc

Marc,
2 days is also my time to recover from EMF exposure.
For example, I use external keyboard now when work on my laptop but I become
very ill (tired and confused) driving my scooter. I checked it with the
trifield meter and found up to 50-100 milligaus (5.10 tesla) when I push on the
gas ...

P.S.
What is the right food and supplements?

Daniele
----- Original Message -----
From: Marc Martin
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 9:30 PM
Subject: RE: [eSens] little pool


> [how much time you need to take to recover from EMF exposure?]
>
> I have only discovered my ES 4 months ago, and have reduced my symptoms
> by about 50%.

I interpreted the original question differently, in that I thought it
was being asked how long after being exposed to an EMF source does it
take you to feel better. For example, 3 years ago if I sat in front of
a
laptop computer for a few minutes, it could take me two days to feel
better. These days, if I get too much EMF exposure, I usually feel
better within minutes of getting away from the EMF source. But these
days, I'm "cheating", in that I know the right foods, supplements,
and devices to overcome such problems.

Marc

Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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RE: Frequency meter - Lachlan

Lachlan Mudge
Hi Daniele
I would suggest that your scooters electrical system would almost definitely
not operate at 50Hz, though I have no idea at what frequency it would operate.
I assume it is a DC based system but alternating current is likely to be
produced internally and the frequencies generated night also vary depending on
the speed of the motor (any electrical engineers out there?). There are very
few meters that will give you the full picture and are affordable, but maybe
one of the more alternative diagnostic treatments, such as electro-acupuncture
(EAV) might give you some answers by telling you which electrical frequencies
your body is picking up from the scooter. I know nothing about these though.
Not sure if this is any help at all but I wish you luck
Lachlan

-----Original Message-----
From: Daniele [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Wednesday, 25 August 2004 4:49 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [eSens] Frequency meter - Lachlan


Hi Lachlan,

Why you're saying that?
My trifield meter is calibrated for 50 Hz sine waves. Here in Europe I suppose
everything runs with this frequency ........ mumble mumble ..... I'm just
thinking that EVERYTHING runs WITH HOME ELECTRIC POWER and my scooter has
indipendent generator ...

However, after I use my scooter I'm very exausted (12 hours after).

Daniele
----- Original Message -----
From: Lachlan Mudge
To: '[hidden email]'
Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 2:48 AM
Subject: RE: [eSens] little pool - Marc


Are you sure your trifield meter is designed to measure the frequency of EMF
that is being generated by your scooter? It is easy to get false readings
using the wrong meter for the job and I think this is possibly true in this
situation.
Lachlan

-----Original Message-----
From: Daniele [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Wednesday, 25 August 2004 6:05 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [eSens] little pool - Marc

Marc,
2 days is also my time to recover from EMF exposure.
For example, I use external keyboard now when work on my laptop but I become
very ill (tired and confused) driving my scooter. I checked it with the
trifield meter and found up to 50-100 milligaus (5.10 tesla) when I push on
the
gas ...

P.S.
What is the right food and supplements?

Daniele
----- Original Message -----
From: Marc Martin
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 9:30 PM
Subject: RE: [eSens] little pool


> [how much time you need to take to recover from EMF exposure?]
>
> I have only discovered my ES 4 months ago, and have reduced my symptoms
> by about 50%.

I interpreted the original question differently, in that I thought it
was being asked how long after being exposed to an EMF source does it
take you to feel better. For example, 3 years ago if I sat in front of
a
laptop computer for a few minutes, it could take me two days to feel
better. These days, if I get too much EMF exposure, I usually feel
better within minutes of getting away from the EMF source. But these
days, I'm "cheating", in that I know the right foods, supplements,
and devices to overcome such problems.

Marc

Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
ADVERTISEMENT






------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Power lines

Daniele
In reply to this post by Lachlan Mudge
You say:

I would add though that the effect you experience also depend
heavily on which aspect of EMF affects you. It could be the electric field,
the magnetic field, a combination of both or even some other aspect of the
electromagnetic phenomena, though we were only speaking of those things we can
measure.

I lived 20 years under a 180 Kw power lines. In my room I measured 1-2 milligaus of MAGNETIC field and apparently no electrical field.

Daniele

----- Original Message -----
From: Lachlan Mudge
To: '[hidden email]'
Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 3:04 AM
Subject: RE: [eSens] Power lines


I agree with Charles and would add as explanation that the EMF associated with
any current carrying conductor depends on the distance you are from the
conductor but is also heavily dependant on the magnetic permeability and
electrical conductivity of the substance (e.g. air or soil) that separates you
from the conductor. Soil has a higher magnetic permeability than air,
therefore more of the magnetic field is 'absorbed' by the soil, leaving less to
travel through your body. Soil is also a reasonably good electrical conductor,
especially if it is wet, and generally all of the electric field associated
with the wire will be 'absorbed' by the soil. Therefore, even though an
underground power line is likely to be closer to your body, the EM fields
associated with this wire are likely to be lower, in comparison to a similar
overhead wire. I would add though that the effect you experience also depend
heavily on which aspect of EMF affects you. It could be the electric field,
the magnetic field, a combination of both or even some other aspect of the
electromagnetic phenomena, though we were only speaking of those things we can
measure. I hope this helps

Lachlan

-----Original Message-----
From: Charles [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Wednesday, 25 August 2004 6:33 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [eSens] Power lines

Daniele

In answer to your question:
*Anybody know if 'UNDER GROUND" power lines have less EMF then 'AIR' ones*
I answered with Yes.
I do know, and underground they emit less EMF.

I suppose you are a woman.
If I look at you lying in bath, I can see more, than when I see you walking
on the streets (normally I think.

The same goes for cable.
When they hang in the fresh air, they are naked. Stark naked.
But when they lie under the ground, they are insulated. Heavily.

When cables hang solo, they emit more radiation, then when they hang
together with for instance with three.
Look at http://www.milieuziektes.nl/Pagina112c.html

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
checked by Norton Antivirus


----- Original Message -----
From: "Daniele" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 22:47
Subject: Re: [eSens] Power lines


>
> Charles,
> why you respond Yes?
>
> My doubt is :
> Distance from cables should be the sole solution to avoid EMF and 'UNDER
GROUND cable, I think, are putted some meters down, not more ?!?

>
> Daniele
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Charles
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 10:39 PM
> Subject: Re: [eSens] Power lines
>
>
> Yes.
>
> Greetings,
> Charles Claessens
> member Verband Baubiologie
> www.milieuziektes.nl
> checked by Norton Antivirus
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Daniele" <[hidden email]>
> To: <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 22:36
> Subject: [eSens] Power lines
>
>
> > Anybody know if 'UNDER GROUND" power lines have less EMF then 'AIR'
ones.

> >
> >
> > Daniele
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
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Re: Frequency meter - Lachlan

Charles-3
In reply to this post by Lachlan Mudge
Hello,

personally, I do not like the TriField meter.
And I do not know if he is calibrated for 50 Hz. Why should it?

A good low frequency meter measures from 5Hz or from 16 Hz up to 100 kHz,
and some special ones up to 400 kHz (in order to comply with the TCO norm. I
are writing an article about that for the next *het bitje*) because there
are other complementary frequencies what the Germans call *Oberwellen*
involved.
Of course a scooter does not work with 50 Hz, because it has an accu or
battery with DC.
But you should measure the magnetic field.
You should measure it when the scooter is off.
And then when the motor is running.

The same goes for automobiles.
There, it is also important where the electrical parts (generator and
distributor) are placed according to the place of the driver.
When they are placed too close to the driver, enormous magnetic field may
occur.

And that is why electrosensibles go awol.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
www.hetbitje.nl
checked by Norton Antivirus


----- Original Message -----
From: "Lachlan Mudge" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 09:26
Subject: RE: [eSens] Frequency meter - Lachlan


> Hi Daniele
> I would suggest that your scooters electrical system would almost
definitely
> not operate at 50Hz, though I have no idea at what frequency it would
operate.
> I assume it is a DC based system but alternating current is likely to be
> produced internally and the frequencies generated night also vary
depending on
> the speed of the motor (any electrical engineers out there?). There are
very
> few meters that will give you the full picture and are affordable, but
maybe
> one of the more alternative diagnostic treatments, such as
electro-acupuncture
> (EAV) might give you some answers by telling you which electrical
frequencies
> your body is picking up from the scooter. I know nothing about these
though.

> Not sure if this is any help at all but I wish you luck
> Lachlan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Daniele [mailto:[hidden email]]
> Sent: Wednesday, 25 August 2004 4:49 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [eSens] Frequency meter - Lachlan
>
>
> Hi Lachlan,
>
> Why you're saying that?
> My trifield meter is calibrated for 50 Hz sine waves. Here in Europe I
suppose

> everything runs with this frequency ........ mumble mumble ..... I'm just
> thinking that EVERYTHING runs WITH HOME ELECTRIC POWER and my scooter has
> indipendent generator ...
>
> However, after I use my scooter I'm very exausted (12 hours after).
>
> Daniele
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Lachlan Mudge
> To: '[hidden email]'
> Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 2:48 AM
> Subject: RE: [eSens] little pool - Marc
>
>
> Are you sure your trifield meter is designed to measure the frequency of
EMF
> that is being generated by your scooter? It is easy to get false
readings
> using the wrong meter for the job and I think this is possibly true in
this

> situation.
> Lachlan
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Daniele [mailto:[hidden email]]
> Sent: Wednesday, 25 August 2004 6:05 AM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [eSens] little pool - Marc
>
> Marc,
> 2 days is also my time to recover from EMF exposure.
> For example, I use external keyboard now when work on my laptop but I
become
> very ill (tired and confused) driving my scooter. I checked it with the
> trifield meter and found up to 50-100 milligaus (5.10 tesla) when I push
on

> the
> gas ...
>
> P.S.
> What is the right food and supplements?
>
> Daniele
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Marc Martin
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 9:30 PM
> Subject: RE: [eSens] little pool
>
>
> > [how much time you need to take to recover from EMF exposure?]
> >
> > I have only discovered my ES 4 months ago, and have reduced my
symptoms
> > by about 50%.
>
> I interpreted the original question differently, in that I thought it
> was being asked how long after being exposed to an EMF source does it
> take you to feel better. For example, 3 years ago if I sat in front
of

> a
> laptop computer for a few minutes, it could take me two days to feel
> better. These days, if I get too much EMF exposure, I usually feel
> better within minutes of getting away from the EMF source. But these
> days, I'm "cheating", in that I know the right foods, supplements,
> and devices to overcome such problems.
>
> Marc
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
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Re: Frequency meter - Lachlan

bbin37
Hi Danielle,

Even though your TriField meter is calibrated to 50 Hz, it does
measure and include contributions from other frequencies in the
reading. Most TriField meters are frequency-weighted to indicate the
total current-producing effect inside a conductive mass (like our
bodies) of all the impinging frequencies within a meter's sensitivity
range. Since your meter is calibrated to 50 Hz, EM fields at 50 Hz
are shown at their actual strength. Other frequencies are weighted
with respect to 50 Hz.

To a good approximation, the current density produced at a location
within a conductive body is proportional to both the magnetic field's
frequency and flux density ("strength"), for frequencies below 10 MHz.
[See Foster, Kenneth R., (1999); "Setting Limits for Electromagnetic
Field Exposures: Scaling Considerations Based on Mechanisms"]. This
means that a 100 Hz component will cause twice the induced current
density of a 50 Hz component of the same strength.

For example, say you're in a magnetic field which is composed of two
frequencies, one component at 50 Hz with a strength of 1 mG and the
other component at 100 Hz also with a strength of 1 mG. The total
induced current density at some point within your body is the sum of
the effects of the two components. The 100 Hz component would cause
twice the current density of the 50 Hz component, making the total
current density the same as if you were exposed to a 50 Hz field of 3
mG (1 + 2). 3 mG is the reading you would get on your TriField meter.

That said, experiments done by Drs. Smith, Rea, Munro, et al., show ES
reactions are strongly frequency dependent. Which frequencies a
person is sensitive to also varies by individual. And the
reaction-causing frequencies tend to appear with logarithmic spacing,
with little or no reaction to frequencies in between them. I'm not
sure if experiments were done where people were exposed to multiple
frequencies at once so I can't say what is known about combinational
EM effects. So I question whether the summing of current density
effects done by the TriField gives an accurate assessment of an ES
person's response to an EM field. The TriField does give a good
measure of a bulk bioelectomagnetic effect, though, which is a good
starting point.

Beau

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RE: Power lines

Lachlan Mudge
In reply to this post by Daniele
Did you mean 180kiloVolt? Assuming your house had a metal roof, very low or
zero electric field would be expected, though what about the electric fields
from your household wiring (do you know why your meter didn't pick these up?).
As for the magnetic fields measures, I have also measured similar field
strengths underneath high voltage power lines. The field strength will be very
different depending on when you make your measurements, for example in
Australia, at about 6:00pm during the hottest time of year (when the highest
power consumption is recorded due to air-conditioners being switched on), the
field strength can be MANY times higher than it was during the middle of a day
with moderate weather (when fewer air-conditioners are being used). As you
probably know, magnetic field strength at a location is directly determined by
the amount of electrical current flowing through the power line. Also, some
power lines are arranged so that a large amount of the magnetic fields from
each wire is cancelled out by that from each other wire.
Lachlan

-----Original Message-----
From: Daniele [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Wednesday, 25 August 2004 5:02 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [eSens] Power lines

You say:

I would add though that the effect you experience also depend
heavily on which aspect of EMF affects you. It could be the electric field,
the magnetic field, a combination of both or even some other aspect of the
electromagnetic phenomena, though we were only speaking of those things we can
measure.

I lived 20 years under a 180 Kw power lines. In my room I measured 1-2
milligaus of MAGNETIC field and apparently no electrical field.

Daniele

----- Original Message -----
From: Lachlan Mudge
To: '[hidden email]'
Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 3:04 AM
Subject: RE: [eSens] Power lines


I agree with Charles and would add as explanation that the EMF associated
with
any current carrying conductor depends on the distance you are from the
conductor but is also heavily dependant on the magnetic permeability and
electrical conductivity of the substance (e.g. air or soil) that separates
you
from the conductor. Soil has a higher magnetic permeability than air,
therefore more of the magnetic field is 'absorbed' by the soil, leaving less
to
travel through your body. Soil is also a reasonably good electrical
conductor,
especially if it is wet, and generally all of the electric field associated
with the wire will be 'absorbed' by the soil. Therefore, even though an
underground power line is likely to be closer to your body, the EM fields
associated with this wire are likely to be lower, in comparison to a similar
overhead wire. I would add though that the effect you experience also depend
heavily on which aspect of EMF affects you. It could be the electric field,
the magnetic field, a combination of both or even some other aspect of the
electromagnetic phenomena, though we were only speaking of those things we
can
measure. I hope this helps

Lachlan

-----Original Message-----
From: Charles [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Wednesday, 25 August 2004 6:33 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [eSens] Power lines

Daniele

In answer to your question:
*Anybody know if 'UNDER GROUND" power lines have less EMF then 'AIR' ones*
I answered with Yes.
I do know, and underground they emit less EMF.

I suppose you are a woman.
If I look at you lying in bath, I can see more, than when I see you walking
on the streets (normally I think.

The same goes for cable.
When they hang in the fresh air, they are naked. Stark naked.
But when they lie under the ground, they are insulated. Heavily.

When cables hang solo, they emit more radiation, then when they hang
together with for instance with three.
Look at http://www.milieuziektes.nl/Pagina112c.html

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
checked by Norton Antivirus


----- Original Message -----
From: "Daniele" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 22:47
Subject: Re: [eSens] Power lines


>
> Charles,
> why you respond Yes?
>
> My doubt is :
> Distance from cables should be the sole solution to avoid EMF and 'UNDER
GROUND cable, I think, are putted some meters down, not more ?!?

>
> Daniele
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Charles
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 10:39 PM
> Subject: Re: [eSens] Power lines
>
>
> Yes.
>
> Greetings,
> Charles Claessens
> member Verband Baubiologie
> www.milieuziektes.nl
> checked by Norton Antivirus
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Daniele" <[hidden email]>
> To: <[hidden email]>
> Sent: Tuesday, August 24, 2004 22:36
> Subject: [eSens] Power lines
>
>
> > Anybody know if 'UNDER GROUND" power lines have less EMF then 'AIR'
ones.

> >
> >
> > Daniele
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
> ADVERTISEMENT
>
>
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
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>
> a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/eSens/
>
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> c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
Service.

>
>
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>
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Re: Frequency meter - Lachlan

Lachlan Mudge
This post was updated on .
In reply to this post by Daniele
Maureen
My answer to your question would be that the reading should be as low as you
can possibly get it within your means (e.g. financial, technical, etc.), and
the ways to achieve this are firstly to turn off all unnecessary electrical
appliances at the switch on the wall (not just with the remote) whenever
possible (using timer switches is a cheap and effective method for some
things), secondly replace electrical appliances with different types where
possible (e.g. gas space heating and gas water heating, instead of electric)
and finally, if once you've done this you feel the fields in your home are
still too high, then take the more expensive measures of shielding the
appliances in your home responsible for the highest contribution to your
readings (your meter will tell you this though it's best to take a reading for
one appliance with EVERYTHING else in the house switched off, including
electric water heaters and refrigerators or you may get a false reading). It's
also probably best to first take a reading at a number of points in your house
with your main electrical power switch (in the meter box) switched off, to tell
you exactly how much of the EMF in your home comes from external sources, such
as power lines. I hope this makes sense but let me know if not
Lachlan


----- Original Message -----
From: "Beau" <netfarer2@yahoo.com>
To: <eSens@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 7:45 PM
Subject: [eSens] Re: Frequency meter - Lachlan


> Hi Danielle,
>
> Even though your TriField meter is calibrated to 50 Hz, it does
> measure and include contributions from other frequencies in the
> reading. Most TriField meters are frequency-weighted to indicate the
> total current-producing effect inside a conductive mass (like our
> bodies) of all the impinging frequencies within a meter's sensitivity
> range. Since your meter is calibrated to 50 Hz, EM fields at 50 Hz
> are shown at their actual strength. Other frequencies are weighted
> with respect to 50 Hz.
>
> To a good approximation, the current density produced at a location
> within a conductive body is proportional to both the magnetic field's
> frequency and flux density ("strength"), for frequencies below 10 MHz.
> [See Foster, Kenneth R., (1999); "Setting Limits for Electromagnetic
> Field Exposures: Scaling Considerations Based on Mechanisms"]. This
> means that a 100 Hz component will cause twice the induced current
> density of a 50 Hz component of the same strength.
>
> For example, say you're in a magnetic field which is composed of two
> frequencies, one component at 50 Hz with a strength of 1 mG and the
> other component at 100 Hz also with a strength of 1 mG. The total
> induced current density at some point within your body is the sum of
> the effects of the two components. The 100 Hz component would cause
> twice the current density of the 50 Hz component, making the total
> current density the same as if you were exposed to a 50 Hz field of 3
> mG (1 + 2). 3 mG is the reading you would get on your TriField meter.
>
> That said, experiments done by Drs. Smith, Rea, Munro, et al., show ES
> reactions are strongly frequency dependent. Which frequencies a
> person is sensitive to also varies by individual. And the
> reaction-causing frequencies tend to appear with logarithmic spacing,
> with little or no reaction to frequencies in between them. I'm not
> sure if experiments were done where people were exposed to multiple
> frequencies at once so I can't say what is known about combinational
> EM effects. So I question whether the summing of current density
> effects done by the TriField gives an accurate assessment of an ES
> person's response to an EM field. The TriField does give a good
> measure of a bulk bioelectomagnetic effect, though, which is a good
> starting point.
>
> Beau
12