Intermodul., harmonics, mixing signals at GSM base stations (Aaronia Spectran)

Hello,

I have a portable spectrum analyzer from Aaronia (Spectran HF-6080).
The measurements in the GSM900 & 1800, and UMTS bands are (seem to
be) good and normal.

But at most GSM/UMTS base stations, I found that for example in the
5000-6000 MHz range and at 3000 MHz, there are several signals which
are higher in intensity than the actual GSM or UMTS frequency band
signals.
The signals are certainly coming from the base stations. The high
values between 2099 - 3011 Mhz (and further) are only detected at
base stations where GSM900/1800 and UMTS antennes are installed,
not at those without UMTS. The 3000 MHz frequency is normally
military. The high signals between 5000-6000 Mhz are almost always
found at all base stations, and seem not to be WLAN (also not the
typical sound from WLAN/WIFI).

There might be some (small) errors in the measurements of the
Spectran
in these higher bands (?), and some "mirror frequencies" (not real)
might exist in the range that I am measuring (at pulse mode), but
I measure several ranges separately (for example the 2099-3011 MHz,
5470-5725 MHz, 5725-5825MHz ranges) and found that the high signals
are very clear and also hearable (audio analysis), in many cases at
around 200 meters from the base ststions ca. 2-6 V/m, in contrast to
the for example 0,2 - 1,2 V/m values in the GSM / UMTS bands !

I think these high signals can be real, possibly 'intermodulation
interference signals' (and out of band). I read a lot on the
internet
about measured signals and that all spectrum analysers have the
problem
of second and third (...) "harmonic frequencies", "intermodulation
interference" from several different base station antennas, "mixing
products from harmonics", etc, and that the problem is becoming more
important, as more different antennas are being installed at each
base station.

See for example
http://www.tek.com/Measurement/App_Notes/2G_14758/eng/2GW_14758_0.pdf
and
http://www.summitekinstruments.com/oasis/documentation.asp
click on "White Paper".

The 900 (gsm) and 2100MHz (umts) signals from base stations could
indeed also mix and give something around 3000MHz, and the readings
between 5-6 GHz could also be explained by (third order) harmonics
and mixing ?
The not-real 'mirror' signals ("in" the measured range) are normally
weaker, but can the real (really in the air) signals
like "intermodulation/mixing/harmonics" signals be more stronger
than
the original signals separately ?

At 2400MHz, 3000MHz, 3500MHz, 5000-6000MHz, the sound (audio
analysis
of pulses/modulations) with Resolution Band Width (RBW) at 3 MHz and
1 MHz is a loud constant noice, almost the same (?) like at
GSM1800/UMTS
(base control carrier) but it seems a little different and in most
cases
more intense. At RBW 300 and 100 kHz, the sound is clearly with
small
hard pulses (around 10 Hz ?, like woodpecker). Can anyone explain
this ?

I also noticed that when I put my GSM on (in speaking mode), high
signals
in the 3000 MHz and 5000-6000 MHz range are also found (and in audio
analysis also clearly the sound of a GSM). This can also be
explainedby "intermodulation/harmonics/mixing" signals ?

Best regards,
Joris Everaert
Biologist
Belgium

The "woodpecker" is what they called the Russian EMF bombardment of the
Eastern Seaboard in the 60's-70's +
I would imagine that it could be any number of HAARP type signatures in
that realm used to create certain emotional states in the populace.
I can only speculate at this point.
I have heard a number of different repeating sounds at different
frequencies and wouldn't know what they all mean.
I'll leave this to the experts.
Andrew
On Feb 21, 2007, at 6:08 AM, Joris Everaert wrote:

> At RBW 300 and 100 kHz, the sound is clearly with
> small
> hard pulses (around 10 Hz ?, like woodpecker). Can anyone explain
> this ?

Hi Joris,

Nice to find another Spectran !

There is a changeover at 3100 MHz in the measuring/detecting that
prevents accurate scanning across this threshold.
I'll look up the exact wording the technical staff sent me last year.
The upper band can only be measured with a bandwidth of 3MHz.

Do you have the datalogging software? I would be excited to compare results.

Please look at my graphs at:
http://www.geocities.com/sandreas41/spectrumGraphs.html

I'll comment on the rest of your message later as time permits.
Stewart

Joris Everaert wrote:

See the following website (forum) for some answers.
http://www.ralf-woelfle.de/elektrosmog/redir.htm?http://www.ralf-
woelfle.de/elektrosmog/forum/forum.php


Best regards,
Joris Everaert

The following article appeared in the Health section of the "Daily Mail" on
Tuesday 20 February, covering Brian Stein, one of the UK's most high-profile
sufferers from the disease. The reporter has written in a balanced but
sympathetic way. I suggest this would be a good article to put before
anyone who is generally open-minded but suspicious of "health fads" and
"conspiracy theories", as it simply describes the evidence in a convincing
way and leaves the reader to make up their own mind.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/health/healthmain.html?in_art
icle_id=437302
<http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/health/healthmain.html?in_ar
ticle_id=437302&in_page_id=1774> &in_page_id=1774

Ian


<http://geo.yahoo.com/serv?s=97359714/grpId=11979304/grpspId=1705062215/msgI
d=7890/stime=1172098139/nc1=3848643/nc2=3848530/nc3=3848504>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Sorry, the link seems to have become corrupted during the posting to Yahoo
Groups.

If you paste the two halves of the address into your browser on the same
line, you should get the article.

Ian

_____

From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Ian
Kemp
Sent: 22 February 2007 01:21
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [eSens] Personal testimony of electrosensitivty in Daily Mail (UK)



The following article appeared in the Health section of the "Daily Mail" on
Tuesday 20 February, covering Brian Stein, one of the UK's most high-profile
sufferers from the disease. The reporter has written in a balanced but
sympathetic way. I suggest this would be a good article to put before
anyone who is generally open-minded but suspicious of "health fads" and
"conspiracy theories", as it simply describes the evidence in a convincing
way and leaves the reader to make up their own mind.

http://www.dailymai
<http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/health/healthmain.html?in_ar
t> l.co.uk/pages/live/articles/health/healthmain.html?in_art
icle_id=437302
<http://www.dailymai
<http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/health/healthmain.html?in_ar
> l.co.uk/pages/live/articles/health/healthmain.html?in_ar
ticle_id=437302&in_page_id=1774> &in_page_id=1774

Ian

<http://geo.yahoo.
<http://geo.yahoo.com/serv?s=97359714/grpId=11979304/grpspId=1705062215/msgI
> com/serv?s=97359714/grpId=11979304/grpspId=1705062215/msgI
d=7890/stime=1172098139/nc1=3848643/nc2=3848530/nc3=3848504>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Joris,

Here is the list of do's and do nots I did not get from the manual:

Use Only a 3MHz filter/bandwidth above 3GHz in combination with Peak or
Pulse mode.

You MUST use Pulse-mode to catch the higher digital bursts, like for WLan or mobiles. Celltowers are ok WITHOUT pulse-mode.


3.1GHz is the "switchpoint" between two generators on the Spectran, so a
false signal can show up at that point.


> I measure several ranges separately (for example the 2099-3011 MHz,
> 5470-5725 MHz, 5725-5825MHz ranges) and found that the high signals
> are very clear and also hearable (audio analysis), in many cases at
> around 200 meters from the base ststions ca. 2-6 V/m, in contrast to
> the for example 0,2 - 1,2 V/m values in the GSM / UMTS bands !
>
>

I have seen spikes in those areas too.
The 3GHz spike disappeared when I used correct settings.
The 5.8Ghz region is to be blamed on wireless internet and gadgets here.

The harmonics to be expected are mentioned in the manual.
However I also do find harmonics that are not in 20db reductions, and I
think are real in some cases, like with separate frequency channels
within a band.

> See for example
> http://www.tek.com/Measurement/App_Notes/2G_14758/eng/2GW_14758_0.pdf
>
>
Right. The signal to noise ratio is troublesome for those wanting the
signal to get through. But such interference should not be ssen as
Higher db readings.

> The 900 (gsm) and 2100MHz (umts) signals from base stations could
> indeed also mix and give something around 3000MHz, and the readings
> between 5-6 GHz could also be explained by (third order) harmonics
> and mixing ?
>

doubtful at that level.
Does the first recommendation above fix any of this?

> The not-real 'mirror' signals ("in" the measured range) are normally
> weaker, but can the real (really in the air) signals
> like "intermodulation/mixing/harmonics" signals be more stronger
> than
> the original signals separately ?
>
>
Good question. The manuals say no, but 2 light bulbs are brighter than
one. The issue seems to be regarding harmonics...


> I also noticed that when I put my GSM on (in speaking mode), high
> signals
> in the 3000 MHz and 5000-6000 MHz range are also found (and in audio
> analysis also clearly the sound of a GSM). This can also be
> explainedby "intermodulation/harmonics/mixing" signals ?
>
>

So with a known transmitter nearby at 900 or 1900MHz, and the Spectran
set at 5-6GHz with a bandwidth of 3MHz, you are hearing signals that can
be definitely linked to the GSM?
Is this in Peak/Pulse mode?

Stewart

--- In [hidden email], "S. Andreason" <sandreas41@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Joris,
>
> Nice to find another Spectran !
>
> There is a changeover at 3100 MHz in the measuring/detecting that
> prevents accurate scanning across this threshold.
> I'll look up the exact wording the technical staff sent me last
year.
> The upper band can only be measured with a bandwidth of 3MHz.
>
> Do you have the datalogging software? I would be excited to
compare results. 6080).
> > The measurements in the GSM900 & 1800, and UMTS bands are (seem
to
> > be) good and normal.
> >
> > But at most GSM/UMTS base stations, I found that for example in
the
> > 5000-6000 MHz range and at 3000 MHz, there are several signals
which
> > are higher in intensity than the actual GSM or UMTS frequency
band
> > signals.
> > The signals are certainly coming from the base stations. The
high
> > values between 2099 - 3011 Mhz (and further) are only detected
at
> > base stations where GSM900/1800 and UMTS antennes are installed,
> > not at those without UMTS. The 3000 MHz frequency is normally
> > military. The high signals between 5000-6000 Mhz are almost
always
> > found at all base stations, and seem not to be WLAN (also not
the
> > typical sound from WLAN/WIFI).
> >
> > There might be some (small) errors in the measurements of the
> > Spectran
> > in these higher bands (?), and some "mirror frequencies" (not
real)
> > might exist in the range that I am measuring (at pulse mode),
but
> > I measure several ranges separately (for example the 2099-3011
MHz,
> > 5470-5725 MHz, 5725-5825MHz ranges) and found that the high
signals
> > are very clear and also hearable (audio analysis), in many cases
at
> > around 200 meters from the base ststions ca. 2-6 V/m, in
contrast to
> > the for example 0,2 - 1,2 V/m values in the GSM / UMTS bands !
> >
> > I think these high signals can be real, possibly 'intermodulation
> > interference signals' (and out of band). I read a lot on the
> > internet
> > about measured signals and that all spectrum analysers have the
> > problem
> > of second and third (...) "harmonic
frequencies", "intermodulation
> > interference" from several different base station
antennas, "mixing
> > products from harmonics", etc, and that the problem is becoming
more
> > important, as more different antennas are being installed at
each
> > base station.
> >
> > See for example
> >
http://www.tek.com/Measurement/App_Notes/2G_14758/eng/2GW_14758_0.pdf
> > and
> > http://www.summitekinstruments.com/oasis/documentation.asp
> > click on "White Paper".
> >
> > The 900 (gsm) and 2100MHz (umts) signals from base stations
could
> > indeed also mix and give something around 3000MHz, and the
readings
> > between 5-6 GHz could also be explained by (third order)
harmonics
> > and mixing ?
> > The not-real 'mirror' signals ("in" the measured range) are
normally
> > weaker, but can the real (really in the air) signals
> > like "intermodulation/mixing/harmonics" signals be more stronger
> > than
> > the original signals separately ?
> >
> > At 2400MHz, 3000MHz, 3500MHz, 5000-6000MHz, the sound (audio
> > analysis
> > of pulses/modulations) with Resolution Band Width (RBW) at 3 MHz
and
> > 1 MHz is a loud constant noice, almost the same (?) like at
> > GSM1800/UMTS
> > (base control carrier) but it seems a little different and in
most
> > cases
> > more intense. At RBW 300 and 100 kHz, the sound is clearly with
> > small
> > hard pulses (around 10 Hz ?, like woodpecker). Can anyone
explain
> > this ?
> >
> > I also noticed that when I put my GSM on (in speaking mode),
high
> > signals
> > in the 3000 MHz and 5000-6000 MHz range are also found (and in
audio
> > analysis also clearly the sound of a GSM). This can also be
> > explainedby "intermodulation/harmonics/mixing" signals ?
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Joris Everaert
> > Biologist
> > Belgium
> >
>This is why I stay a member of this group. Even though I only
understand bits of this, I know that with work I will succeed and
apply it to my situation.
Joris, I have found that locally here in N. Central Texas, we have
some techies that have found a way to combine several signals, from
several sources and the sound of taps like a woodpecker are found
like you describe depending upon the indentifier signal of the
device used. By reading your information on mixing of signals I have
determined how they are doing it.
Cities or regions are assigned numbers and that is the number of the
taps/pecks issued when activated, and a small pause, then the number
of the officer/person assigned. 5/2 for Region 4 of Kaufman County
Texas and person 2 for the person it is charged out to. The city of
Kemp is the city in region 4, and the number 5 stands for that city
I believe, or so forth. These devices are charged out to
governmental entities. Hijacking of these signals occurs.
These techies I speak of are not above harrassing others with the em
spectrum, and that is happening here, so any alleviation of RF
signals and info is welcome. Thanks again for the enlightening
information that I can understand and use.

Hello Stewart and others,

Thank you for your last message.

Yes, with a known transmitter nearby at 900 or 180O MHz, and the
Spectran set at 5-6GHz with a bandwidth of 3MHz, I am hearing
signals that can be definitely linked to the GSM. This is in
peak/pulse mode.

Here below is another test that I did (see also the messages in the
forum http://www.ralf-woelfle.de/elektrosmog/redir.htm?
http://www.ralf-woelfle.de/elektrosmog/forum/forum.php )

I checked this weekend for the "intermodulation" signals near base
stations with my Spectran HF-6080.
Oliver Bartels told me in a forum that the high signals can come from
both "real intermodulation" signals (several GSM bands, etc) and
spurious intermodulation products from "inside" the Spectran.
One way to know the difference (real/ not real) is to change the
attenuator. If the display changes by appx. 10dB with an attenuator
change of 10dB, then we talk about intermodulation products inside
the receiver, if they stay constant, then they are probably true.

Here first the results from the low (ground) signals that I have
everywhere, also without the antenna, in dBm (all with RBW 3 MHz).
All signals shown below are getting stronger with higher attenuator
setting (but not the same change), so they could be intermodulation
products created inside the Spectran (but shouldn't the signals
become less with higher attenuator then ??).

2400-2484MHz (WLAN band), peak hold.
0dB atten: -78
10dB atten: -69
20dB atten: -59
30dB atten: -57

3000MHz, 10MHz span, peak hold.
0dB atten: -32
10dB atten: -22
20dB atten: -12
30dB atten: -8

3410-3594MHz (WIMAX band), peak hold.
0dB atten: -
10dB atten: -
20dB atten: -
30dB atten: -

5150-5350MHz (WLAN band), peak hold.
0dB atten: -49
10dB atten: -46
20dB atten: -37
30dB atten: -35

5470-5725MHz (WLAN band), peak hold.
0dB atten: -43
10dB atten: -39
20dB atten: -29
30dB atten: -28

5725-5825MHz (WLAN band), peak hold.
0dB atten: -41
10dB atten: -38
20dB atten: -28
30dB atten: -26

And here below the results from near (ca. 150m) a GSM base station,
with the unexpected high signals (see previous posts).
You can see that the signals in the GSM and WLAN bands do not
change with changing attenuator, so also the high signals in the WLAN
bands could be real (not created inside the Spectran), probably
intermodulation products from the base stations signals .... because
I also hear the more typical GSM base control carrier signals and
some GSM (217Hz) pulses in these WLAN bands... Strange.
Moreover, in the GSM downlink band, the noice is much less than
in the "WLAN" bands ! In the WLAN bands I can better hear the
GSM base control carrier (or something that seems the same) and
GSM signals, than in the actual GSM bands...Hmm.
So I guess intermodulation products from the GSM base station
antennas. I will try to check that with another meter from an
official service in Belgium.
The 3000Mhz signals get stronger with higher attenuator,
so they could be intermodulation products created inside the Spectran
(but shouldn't the signals become less with higher attenuator
then ??).

So here are these results from near that base station.

GSM900 band (seem to be OK for real signals)
0dB atten: -28
10dB atten: -28
20dB atten: -28
30dB atten: -40 (?)

GSM1800 band (seem to be OK for real signals)
0dB atten: -51
10dB atten: -52
20dB atten: -51
30dB atten: -52

2400-2484MHz (WLAN band), peak hold.
0dB atten: -37
10dB atten: -42
20dB atten: - (no detection)
30dB atten: -

3000MHz, 10MHz span, peak hold.
0dB atten: -28
10dB atten: -21
20dB atten: -10
30dB atten: -7

3410-3594MHz (WIMAX band), peak hold.
0dB atten: -38
10dB atten: -39
20dB atten: - (no detection)
30dB atten: -

5150-5350MHz (WLAN band), peak hold.
0dB atten: -29
10dB atten: -29
20dB atten: -30
30dB atten: -31 (less detection)

5470-5725MHz (WLAN band), peak hold.
0dB atten: -17
10dB atten: -16
20dB atten: -18
30dB atten: -19 (less detection)

5725-5825MHz (WLAN band), peak hold.
0dB atten: -21
10dB atten: -19
20dB atten: -21
30dB atten: -23 (less detection)

That was it for now.

Best regards,
Joris Everaert

Joris Everaert wrote:
> Yes, with a known transmitter nearby at 900 or 180O MHz, and the
> Spectran set at 5-6GHz with a bandwidth of 3MHz, I am hearing
> signals that can be definitely linked to the GSM. This is in
> peak/pulse mode.
>
>
But not in normal mode?

Peak/pulse mode does turn off all filters, like the ones that remove
harmonics within the Spectran.

> http://www.ralf-woelfle.de/elektrosmog/forum/forum.php )
>
>
Unfortunately, I can't read german.

Stewart

Andrew: How can I research the HAARP information. I am researching for a book and need this soon.Thanks. Peg
 
-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Wed, 21 Feb 2007 5:40 AM
Subject: Re: [eSens] Intermodul., harmonics, mixing signals at GSM base stations (Aaronia Spectran)


The "woodpecker" is what they called the Russian EMF bombardment of the
Eastern Seaboard in the 60's-70's +
I would imagine that it could be any number of HAARP type signatures in
that realm used to create certain emotional states in the populace.
I can only speculate at this point.
I have heard a number of different repeating sounds at different
frequencies and wouldn't know what they all mean.
I'll leave this to the experts.
Andrew
On Feb 21, 2007, at 6:08 AM, Joris Everaert wrote:

> At RBW 300 and 100 kHz, the sound is clearly with
> small
> hard pulses (around 10 Hz ?, like woodpecker). Can anyone explain
> this ?


 
________________________________________________________________________
AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Look for the title "Angels Don't Play This HAARP" by Nick Begich

According to the library catalog, there are 2 other books about HAARP,
slightly newer, that I have not read.

Stewart

[hidden email] wrote:

Start here:
http://www.haarp.net/

On Mar 12, 2007, at 11:05 AM, [hidden email] wrote: