EHS and airplanes

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SuperLaura

EHS and airplanes

Hi everyone, I have never been on an airplane since I became EHS.

My husband wants to take me on vacation somewhere really nice but I am very apprehensive about getting on an airplane knowing that the EMF exposure is high. But I don't really want to drive for 16 hours along cell tower laden highways either. I'm not sure which option is the better one. But the thing about an airplane is you are stuck, it's not like you can just pull over and get out lol. And I'm honestly terrified because I don't really know what I should expect... And I don't want to take an airplane and then be sick for the entire vacation and then have to get on ANOTHER plane just to get home and get more sick!

Has anyone here tried taking an airplane while being EHS? I would like to know your experience. And also is there anything one can do that might help if an airplane is unavoidable???

Marc Martin

Re: EHS and airplanes

Administrator

This post was updated on .

Yes, I've been on an airplane several times since being ES... and some of those trips were pretty miserable. It can be just fine if you take the trip when the airport isn't crowded (or you stay away from the crowds), and the airplane is mostly empty (or at least, next to your seat). My main problems have been the electronics of the people sitting around you. One time I was really clever and got a seat in the back of business class (work trip), which was both an aisle seat, and window seat, and also nobody sitting in back of me. That was a 10+ hour flight, and it was perfectly fine. On the other hand, I've sat next to someone who simultaneously had out his smart phone, tablet, laptop, wireless headphones, and was charging a couple of them too. That flight was pretty miserable.

Also, avoid the body scanners if you can... the metal detectors are fine, as are the patdowns... :-)

Marc

Fog Top

Re: EHS and airplanes

In reply to this post by SuperLaura

I took a short 1-hour flight on Allegiant which doesn't have Wifi. The airport felt worse than the plane. I "opted out" of the x-ray machine for the TSA gate-rape. When the stewardess came by with adult beverages I quickly ordered one because my anxiety was sky high. The next day I developed an annoying tic in my leg which took several weeks to resolve.

From: SuperLaura [via ES] <ml-node+[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2016 2:15 PM
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Subject: [ES] EHS and airplanes

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EHS and airplanes. Hi everyone, I have never been on an airplane since I became EHS. My husband wants to take me on vacation somewhere really nice but I am very apprehensive about getting on an...

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SuperLaura

Re: EHS and airplanes

Oh man, I didn't even think of all the people crammed in there and probably traveling with TONS of devices..not just phones but laptops and iPads etc :/ I forget that I haven't been on a plane since 2010, I'm sure the number of gadgets people take has increased exponentially. And then the airport as well... Thanks guys for the responses!

Marc Martin

Re: EHS and airplanes

Administrator

Yes, I was on a flight in Europe recently and they crammed us all in a bus to get to our airplane on the field. I must have had a dozen smart phones within 3 feet of my head, all of them in use. It was not pleasant.

roma247

Re: EHS and airplanes

In reply to this post by SuperLaura

Yes, the proliferation of devices on planes nowadays is downright disgusting. No one reads things on paper anymore I guess. And "airplane mode" doesn't help me...plus, they used to have you keep these things in "airplane mode" the whole time, but now they only make you do it during takeoff and landing.

That being said, I had to travel quite a bit last year...flew at least 4 or 5 times. It was not pleasant, but especially if it's only a few hours...I got through it OK.

I'm rather dreading it this year, because my sensitivities have been much worse than they were last year, and I have a trip to the UK coming up next week. Last time I sprang for Economy Plus (so worth it) but this time my two eldest daughters are coming and we couldn't afford anything more than the cattle class.

So yeah, traveling by air is less than ideal, but as long as it's not a 10 hour flight...it will probably beat a 16-hour drive.

I'm one of the most ridiculously sensitive people I know (I'm the one that can't handle idiot chip cards) but I've survived well enough.

So far... ;)

Good luck!

Lisa

Fog Top

Re: EHS and airplanes

I wish I had saved the Youtube video which showed a passenger using an HF35C high frequency analyzer during a Southwest Airlines flight with Wifi because I can no longer locate it. The instrument was averaging around 1200 uw/m2. I used to be so ES that I could feel .5 uw/m2. I can tolerate more now, however my ears develop a high pitched scream when in the presence of most Wifi. I can't imagine being stuck in a metal tube (airplane) where the signals cannot get out. Almost all flights have Wifi now unless they are short-hop carriers, and many have charging docks in the arm rests. I have instruments which show the EMF stew coming from the recharging of my tiny iPod. It's amazing, and a person should never be close to that.

A recent 1500 mile trip by car was enjoyable - if I don't have to drive much. Hotels are a problem as they all have Wifi and massive dirty electricity. I setup a Aaronia Shield canopy with a take-apart homemade PVC pipe frame and an under-mattress foil mat. It mostly works well if you can get a room where signals are not coming from below so floor level rooms are usually best.

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Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2016 2:03 PM
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Subject: [ES] Re: EHS and airplanes

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SuperLaura

Re: EHS and airplanes

In reply to this post by roma247

Thanks Lisa! I am glad to have someone who wants to take me to cool places, it's just hard when you are sensitive. I am thinking that maybe flying first class might make a big difference? And maybe making sure it's one straight flight... Get in and get out of the airport fast. I mean would you do it for a nice 4-5 day vacation for a 3-4 hour flight there and back? Or would it be worth flying to Europe and staying for a week and having to endure a 10+ hour flight there and back? I am thinking maybe waiting a year to heal better for the Euro trip because I only found out I was EHS about 9 months ago. And I am still debating on the 3-4 hour flight for this year, probably won't even go.

Planning vacations is so hard, because of the traveling and where you stay and what you eat. It makes it so much harder to plan anything. Tried to plan a vacation last time and I couldn't find any hotels to stay at because there were cell towers like .1 miles away from every single hotel on the island.

Karl

Re: EHS and airplanes

In reply to this post by SuperLaura

If you can put up with Spirit, they don't have WiFi. Their customers are also more price sensitive and probably carry fewer iPhones and tablets.

Marc is right, though: Airports are horrible.

SuperLaura

Re: EHS and airplanes

In reply to this post by Fog Top

I would be very happy on a plane if the readings were only 1200 at peak (not average!!!)... Of course I have that meter and it's only directional so the readings are probably much higher. Standing next to a wifi router I get readings of about 66,000 uW/m2... If the plane has wifi it might make a world of difference WHERE the wifi is coming from and where you sit on the plane. Also I would expect VERY HIGH magnetic fields from an airplane engine. Is that right?? I am HIGHLY sensitive to magnetic fields, can't even cook at my stove burners without getting severe chest pains so I have no idea what a plane might do to me especially if I am anywhere near the engine if it gives off magnetic fields like my home appliances do. Another reason why I don't think I would be able to tolerate a long car drive either. I can really feel it after an hour of driving even as a passenger.

Alex V

Re: EHS and airplanes

Radar could very well be another issue for you to consider. Some frequencies of radar are out of the detection range of most common meters.

Karl

Re: EHS and airplanes

Not just ground radar, but radar altimeters. I live near an airport, and planes going over used to wake me until I put a wire mesh over my bed.

Laura, the engines probably have generators of some sort, but I'm not 100% sure. A lot of planes have a generator that powers them while they're on the ground (sometimes in the very back) so they could use that in the air instead of an alternator.

There's a good chance that the turbine blades (the ones on hot end of the engine) are non-magnetic. They use nickel alloys like Inconel, and at least some of the grades are non-magnetic. I don't know about the compressor blades (the ones on the cool end of the engine). Some newer engines use carbon fiber, which should be OK. The bearings are often made of a ceramic called silicon-nitride, which is also OK.

SuperLaura

Re: EHS and airplanes

Thanks for the info Karl and Alex, that's a lot to consider :/

Karl

Re: EHS and airplanes

In reply to this post by Karl

I just flew on an Airbus A319 and sat in a window seat next to the engine. The Cornet ED88T went off-range ("O.L." or overload) when I set it to the LF 30 mode (to measure low frequency magnetic fields) and pointed the directional sensor at the engine. It was much lower (IIRC, 0.5-0.8 mG) when I rotated the meter 90 degrees to point it at the LCD entertainment system in the seat in front of me.

So there is probably a big alternator in the engine.

Karl

Re: EHS and airplanes

I flew in a front row seat on an Airbus A320-200 and found that the fields were too high for my ED88T to measure when it was set to the LF 30 mode. That was true in all orientations that I tried.

kara

Re: EHS and airplanes

In reply to this post by Karl

If I have a choice, for a longer distance travel, I'll take the plane and avoid trains and buses. These are the worst for me. Well at least the misery takes shorter time on a plane.
Used to travel quite a lot by bus/train in around early 2000 in Asia, as a traveller. Felt ok, was quite relaxing actually. Nowadays I feel restless and stressed and start counting the hours, get headaches etc... awful, especially in Europe, but I really remember how travelling on an overnight local bus in Asia was something I actually looked forward to... Nowadays is smartphones everywhere, etc...
I cannot sleep anymore on long distance flights, lots of things have changed since the 80's. But I still don't see flying as the worst experience.
Also sitting in a car with all the latest electronics, and people talking on the phones, feels not good at all.
I remember the 70's cars my family had in my childhood... Sitting in a car as real fun... not anymore.

Karl

Re: EHS and airplanes

I think that Marc has said similar things (at least that the airplanes aren't much worse than the airports).

The last time I took a long train ride was in 2008 and I didn't sleep the whole time. It was the Amtrak Empire Builder from Seattle to Minneapolis.

Karl

Re: EHS and airplanes

In reply to this post by SuperLaura

SuperLaura wrote

If the plane has wifi it might make a world of difference WHERE the wifi is coming from and where you sit on the plane.

I know that this is an old post, but a few days ago I got a look at some recently-updated planes. I think that they've added a satellite internet receiver on the top of the fuselage just a little behind the midsection. At least there is a long, wide hump in that location on some of the Airbus 320s that Spirit flies. They're in the process of adding WiFi to all if their planes, and that location makes sense for an antenna, so I'm pretty sure it's for internet.