Change in wiring creates magnetic fields?

Last Friday we had an electrician install outlets near our circuit box so we could plug in
Stetzer filters (the idea being they'd work more efficiently closer to the main box). The
plan worked great as far as that went -- our Stetzer readings are now down to 15, from
about 25 before. But now we have a new, serious problem.

1. Strong headaches for me, general very high pain for my husband, since Friday. Note
that we had 28 Stetzer filters plugged in before the electrical work was done at the circuit
box, and I was feeling noticeably better (no headaches except sometimes from working at
my old computer). And my husband was reporting surprisingly low pain levelsalso. So, we
do not think the new pain since Friday is caused by instaling Stetzer filters, near the circuit
box or elsewhere. We feel the filters were helping, and that is the reason we wanted to get
our Stetzer readings even lower by putting them nearer the main box.

2. Tonight I took out my old trifield meter and checked magnetic readings around the
apartment. We'd done this several times before and our magnetic readings used to be very
low throughout, except near fridge and furnace. (This is one of the reasonswe're still here
in spite of the other EMF problems.) Our magnetic readings are now VERY high (over 3
milligauss) especially near the circuit box.

I should add that headaches and pain are how my husband and I typically react to strong
magnetic fields. This probably is no surprise to anyone here.

My question is: Did the re-wiring done to install the new outlets somehow create these
strong, new magnetic fields? And if so, how can they be fixed? The electrician who did the
work was our landlord's "official" electrician - the only one they will allow us to use. I am
at my wit's end. I am prepared to sneak some other electrician in here, butI'm not sure
how to frame the problem. Obviously the electrician who created this problem didn't do it
on purpose, and if I brought him back in here he probably wouldn't know howto UNDO
the damage. Any suggestions?

Thanks,
Cara

I think you might start by turning off the circuit (at the circuit
breaker) that the new outlets are on. Then check if the magnetic fields
(and symptoms) are reduced. Hopefully, there is nothing else on those
circuits.

Emil



Emil DeToffol
Less EMF Inc.
tel: +1-518-432-1550
fax: +1-309-422-4355

Hi Emil. We do turn off those circuits at night, but of course they are theones we need
most (lights, home office). We added the new outlets on these circuits deliberately in the
hope the Stetzer filters would have greater benefit regarding high frequencies. (Sigh.) As it
happens, you're right--the magnetic fields go back to their old, low levelswhen these
circuits are turned off. It's just that we can't leave them off during the day.

~ Cara

--- In [hidden email], "Emil DeToffol" <lessemf@l...> wrote:

> As it
> happens, you're right--the magnetic fields go back to their old, low
> levels when these circuits are turned off. It's just that we can't
> leave them off during the day.

I don't suppose you can have those newly installed circuits removed,
and try to lower your Stetzerizer meter readings using existing
outlets?

Oh -- on the list of symptoms & side effects from all this new
supplement experimentation, I also have noticed an improved sense
of smell. I had noticed this in the past with sea vegetables, but
I also notice it with this round of omega-3/choline experimentation.

Marc

Very interesting. I got my trifield out and took some readings and I
find that on my little tree where I have three stetzer filters hooked
up on an outlet next to the breaker box I also get some high
readings. One thing I did to solve the problem of my breaker box
being inside my home was to put some metallic cloth on that wall and
ground it to a ground rod outside. It brought a very high magnetic
reading down to around 1 and a half with the trifield very close to
the cloth. I also took a reading on an outlet both with the stetzer
filter plugged in and with it taken out. I get a higher magnetic
reading with it unplugged. It must have something to do with the
location of those filters being so close to the breaker box. Several
feet away and they fall back down to safe levels. You may wish to do
what I have done with all my grounding if that is possible. Also I've
been getting good results with velostat on the ceiling. I could say
that it makes me feel better but the best way to describe the way it
makes me feel is to say that it makes me feel the way I used to feel.  
It's about 125 bucks for a 150 foot roll that is 36 inches wide. It
gives me that woodsy feeling or that underground feeling.  


--- In [hidden email], "Marc Martin" <marc@u...> wrote:
>
> > As it
> > happens, you're right--the magnetic fields go back to their old,
low

I would do that if I could, Marc, but I don't think it will be that easy. As a test I removed
the Stetzer filters from the new outlets to see if that would make a difference in the
magnetic readings. No difference. If taking out the filters doesn't help, I'm not sure
"removing" the outlets would solve the problem. I have a feeling the damagewas done
when the electrician changed the wiring in the circuit box to create the new outlets. My
wild-ass guess is that he crossed the wires in some way. I took some magnetic readings
this morning with ALL the circuits off, with only circuit #1 on, with only circuit #2 on, and
then with only circuits 1 and 2 on. The new, high magnetic readings show upONLY when
both circuits #1 and #2 are on.

Was hoping some of the electrical types in the group could correct/clarify/confirm my
WAG. I want to get this fixed but don't even know how to explain the problem to someone
who doesn't understand or acknowledge ES. Our landlords already think we'renuts.

Cara

--- In [hidden email], "Marc Martin" <marc@u...> wrote:

> I don't suppose you can have those newly installed circuits removed,
> and try to lower your Stetzerizer meter readings using existing
> outlets?
>

Thanks for the suggestions. Ideally I'd like to eliminate these new magnetic fields by
reversing whatever was done last week. I think this can be fixed if I can just figure out how
it happened so I can explain the fix to an electrician. But I'll explore shielding options too.

Cara

--- In [hidden email], "quaixemen" <straitguy@s...> wrote:

Yes, he most likely connected the neutrals from both circuits. He should be
able to undo anything that he did.

Get the book "Tracing EMFs in Building Wiring and Grounding"
http://www.lessemf.com/book8.html for an excellent description of this
problem and how to fix/avoid it.


Emil


----- Original Message -----
From: "Cara" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2005 5:42 PM
Subject: [eSens] Re: Change in wiring creates magnetic fields?


> I would do that if I could, Marc, but I don't think it will be that easy.
As a test I removed
> the Stetzer filters from the new outlets to see if that would make a
difference in the
> magnetic readings. No difference. If taking out the filters doesn't help,
I'm not sure
> "removing" the outlets would solve the problem. I have a feeling the
damage was done
> when the electrician changed the wiring in the circuit box to create the
new outlets. My
> wild-ass guess is that he crossed the wires in some way. I took some
magnetic readings
> this morning with ALL the circuits off, with only circuit #1 on, with only
circuit #2 on, and
> then with only circuits 1 and 2 on. The new, high magnetic readings show
up ONLY when
> both circuits #1 and #2 are on.
>
> Was hoping some of the electrical types in the group could
correct/clarify/confirm my
> WAG. I want to get this fixed but don't even know how to explain the
problem to someone
> who doesn't understand or acknowledge ES. Our landlords already think
we're nuts.

Quaixemen wrote:

home was to put some metallic cloth on that wall and
> ground it to a ground rod outside. It brought a very high magnetic
> reading down to around 1 and a half with the trifield very close to
> the cloth.
=====================

Metalic cloth can't put magnetic readings down!

By the way, Cara has a fortune that her magnetic field problem IS fixable
(unlikely when you have the whole neighbourhood polluted by major leaks in
other houses), so she can easily explain to an electrician that her
instrument monitors some current leakage and that she wants that fixed... Or
read herself what Emil proposed.

Drasko

At one time we'd put in an outlet with a ground fault interrupter
that was defective out of the box. It had a low hum to it always, we
replaced that and whatever other problems we had on that line also
ceased. Are any on that circuit?

Maybe he didn't ground the new line, or not tightly. Even
electricians can make errors. Basic wiring really isn't difficult,
if you know any do it yourselfers that could check the outlets and
breaker box and see if they can find anything. If you have to use
that guy for him to be paid for, then yeah, I'd do out of my pocket
and call someone else in on my own.

Something I wanted to ask you all... I've been playing with this for
about two weeks, and there's just no question. (The refrigerator is
one of my big problems, and I can only get my bed so far from it.  
I've tried turning off the breaker at night, which helps. (Have
filled water bottles in fridge and freezer to help keep it cold for a
number of hours.)  

I discovered breaker on or off, I get a lot better relief by actually
unplugging it. I would think with the breaker off, that would do
it. It does go into a ground fault outlet, maybe they hold a charge,
I don't know?

The hours I have it unplugged, -sometimes I do it in the early
morning, I sleep so much better, I'm relaxed, I dream, maybe more, I
remember my dreams---- that says something to me, because for years I
haven't been able to recall my dreams, and is something I have always
liked to do.

Anyway, I don't have all the testing equipment you all do, so I can't
measure the fields and such, but if anyone else tries it let me know
your results, or just why it might be unplugged is better than just
off???

Gotta go, it's starting to snow heavy, and I have to drive to town.

~ Snoshoe




--- In [hidden email], "Cara" <cara_evangelista@h...> wrote:
>
> Last Friday we had an electrician install outlets near our circuit
box so we could plug in
> Stetzer filters (the idea being they'd work more efficiently closer
to the main box). The
> plan worked great as far as that went -- our Stetzer readings are
now down to 15, from
> about 25 before. But now we have a new, serious problem.
>
> 1. Strong headaches for me, general very high pain for my husband,
since Friday. Note
> that we had 28 Stetzer filters plugged in before the electrical
work was done at the circuit
> box, and I was feeling noticeably better (no headaches except
sometimes from working at
> my old computer). And my husband was reporting surprisingly low
pain levels also. So, we
> do not think the new pain since Friday is caused by instaling
Stetzer filters, near the circuit
> box or elsewhere. We feel the filters were helping, and that is the
reason we wanted to get
> our Stetzer readings even lower by putting them nearer the main box.
>
> 2. Tonight I took out my old trifield meter and checked magnetic
readings around the
> apartment. We'd done this several times before and our magnetic
readings used to be very
> low throughout, except near fridge and furnace. (This is one of the
reasons we're still here
> in spite of the other EMF problems.) Our magnetic readings are now
VERY high (over 3
> milligauss) especially near the circuit box.
>
> I should add that headaches and pain are how my husband and I
typically react to strong
> magnetic fields. This probably is no surprise to anyone here.
>
> My question is: Did the re-wiring done to install the new outlets
somehow create these
> strong, new magnetic fields? And if so, how can they be fixed? The
electrician who did the
> work was our landlord's "official" electrician - the only one they
will allow us to use. I am
> at my wit's end. I am prepared to sneak some other electrician in
here, but I'm not sure
> how to frame the problem. Obviously the electrician who created
this problem didn't do it
> on purpose, and if I brought him back in here he probably wouldn't
know how to UNDO
> the damage. Any suggestions?
>
> Thanks,
> Cara
>

--- In [hidden email], "Drasko Cvijovic" <pecina@c...> wrote:
>
> Quaixemen wrote:
>
> home was to put some metallic cloth on that wall and
> > ground it to a ground rod outside. It brought a very high
magnetic
> > reading down to around 1 and a half with the trifield very close
to
> > the cloth.
> =====================
>
> Metalic cloth can't put magnetic readings down!
>
> By the way, Cara has a fortune that her magnetic field problem IS
fixable
> (unlikely when you have the whole neighbourhood polluted by major
leaks in
> other houses), so she can easily explain to an electrician that her
> instrument monitors some current leakage and that she wants that
fixed... Or
> read herself what Emil proposed.
>
> Drasko
>

Yes, I knew that I had mispoken the next day when my meter again gave
me a higher reading than the 1 and a 1/2 that I got the day before.  
I still get a reading of about 10 with my meter when an appliance
such as an electric heat fan is turned on within the house. It goes
back down to 1 and a half when turned off. The cloth covers the wall
that the breaker box is in. I am not knowledgable enough to try to
think about why something works. Which is why I come here to listen
to other people's logic. Some I agree with and some I do not.  
Interesting nonetheless. I am a very sensitive person with very
sensitive feelings. I don't know why something works. I can not
explain the science or the logic. But I will believe my own feelings
before I will believe someones else's reasoning who tries to tell me
that something can not work. I have a room where I not only have it
enclosed with velostat that works to block microwaves but I have it
also enclosed with this metallic cloth which once again gives the
room an acceptable appearance with respect to the walls. The cloth
is nice looking. I can not explain it but in this room I
experienced nightmeres until I grounded the cloth and I have been
sleeping very deeply ever since with no nightmeres. Grounding the
cloth is pulling some energy out of the room. I have experienced
good effects with this cloth before. If you put the cloth next to a
negative ion generator and touch it you will get quite a shock. It
seems to absorb the static electricity. I'll let someone else who is
up on the sciences and knowledgeable try to explain it all. I can
not. I was once very sick and now am quite well. And I healed
myself by using this method of using things that made me "feel" well
and getting rid of things that made me "feel" bad. If I had the
health insurance and had gone to doctors I'm sure I'd still be sick
today.

Bit of a late reply, but you may have a 'ground loop'. Stray current
can run around in circles on some circuits where the earths and
neutrals are not connected probably. There might be ringing or
something induced permanently in the filters that you detect with the
gauss meter and feel.

If so, an expert power quality electrician understanding ground loops
may be able to detect it and fix it in 2 hours. Odd though given that
all filters on same circuit.

Somewhere I saw someone complaining about a UPS giving symptoms. Both
a UPS and a breaker I think give off noise; the electromagnet gives
off fields electrosensitives may detect.

Also, off topic, someone here said that a group of computers, Pentium
3 800MHz or so gave less symptoms, celerons of higher freqs gave more.
This computer of mine now happened to be one P3 750 MHz by accident. I
notice that the chips referred to as good are all low voltage mobile
chips, and I am sure I have noticed a difference with mine.

Rowan C



--- In [hidden email], "Cara" <cara_evangelista@h...> wrote:
>
> I would do that if I could, Marc, but I don't think it will be that
easy. As a test I removed
> the Stetzer filters from the new outlets to see if that would make a
difference in the
> magnetic readings. No difference. If taking out the filters doesn't
help, I'm not sure
> "removing" the outlets would solve the problem. I have a feeling the
damage was done
> when the electrician changed the wiring in the circuit box to create
the new outlets. My
> wild-ass guess is that he crossed the wires in some way. I took some
magnetic readings
> this morning with ALL the circuits off, with only circuit #1 on,
with only circuit #2 on, and
> then with only circuits 1 and 2 on. The new, high magnetic readings
show up ONLY when
> both circuits #1 and #2 are on.
>
> Was hoping some of the electrical types in the group could correct/
clarify/confirm my
> WAG. I want to get this fixed but don't even know how to explain the
problem to someone
> who doesn't understand or acknowledge ES. Our landlords already
think we're nuts.
>
> Cara
>
> --- In [hidden email], "Marc Martin" <marc@u...> wrote:
>
> > I don't suppose you can have those newly installed circuits
removed,
> > and try to lower your Stetzerizer meter readings using existing
> > outlets?
> >
>