when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities...
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Many people who have one of these two conditions, ES or MCS, also have the other. Some might have real bad electrical sensitivity but only minor chemical sensitivity or vice versa. Some may have really bad sensitivities to both. My question is, for those of us who have pretty bad sensitivities to both, do you think that one of the two sensitivities is more of the root cause and more of the driver of the illness with the other sensitivity being more of a side effect?
In other words, do you think that one of the sensitivities is more important to address? I think addressing either one will ultimately help reduce the other as well...if you reduce EMF exposure your body will calm down and start functioning more normally and be less hypersensitive in general including to chemicals. I'm sure it works the other way around to. But does it work in one direction more than the other? If someone was equally sensitive to both, which would you advice them to focus on first? Thanks! Russ |
Re: when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities...
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On August 1, russel395 <[hidden email]> wrote:
> My question is, for those of us who have pretty bad sensitivities to both, > do you think that one of the two sensitivities is more of the root cause and > more of the driver of the illness with the other sensitivity being more of a side effect? Well, neither of these are a root cause. They are instead both a symptom of the root cause. With the root cause probably some kind of liver problem. But I'd certainly focus on the one that's causing you the most problems at the moment, which depends on how severe each one is and your typical daily environment. Marc |
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Thanks Marc. I agree that they are both symptoms and neither is a root cause. Basically wondering whether there is evidence of people who primarily focused on addressing exposure to one of them and then as a bonus noticed that this also reduced their sensitivity to the other. I imagine it can happen both ways, as one calms an over excited system, but I wonder if it is more likely to happen in one direction rather than the other. To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other.
--- In [hidden email], Marc Martin <marc@...> wrote: > > On August 1, russel395 <russturk@...> wrote: > > My question is, for those of us who have pretty bad sensitivities to both, > > do you think that one of the two sensitivities is more of the root cause and > > more of the driver of the illness with the other sensitivity being more of a side effect? > > Well, neither of these are a root cause. They are instead both a symptom of the root > cause. With the root cause probably some kind of liver problem. > > But I'd certainly focus on the one that's causing you the most problems at the moment, > which depends on how severe each one is and your typical daily environment. > > Marc > |
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I believe in a couple of approaches. One is AVOIDANCE. The other is SUPPORT. If you know something is a toxin or poison or damaging to you... Avoid it! Remediate it when you have it figured out.
I believe in the concept of "lightening the (toxic) load." Reduce exposure to EMFs, chemicals, pesticides, whatever bothers you. Correct what you can, and support your body systems and functioning. There are many ways to support our health. Nutrition, various modalities such as acupuncture, body or energy work, emotional support, earthing, correcting pH (important!). I used to not be sensitive to EMFs, chemicals, foods, etc. Now I react to each of these. I have to keep exposure to EMFs and chemicals as low as possible. I developed incredible food sensitivities. I have to be very careful about what I eat. I avoid GMOs, pesticides (biggie), aspartame, MSG, soy, corn, additives, preservatives. I wish someone would compare people who are not EMF or other sensitive to those who are. What's different? One other interesting bit is the infection connection. In some cases, people receive antibiotics, and the sensitivities go away. I also suspect that people who spend more time out of doors are less likely to have EMF sensitivity - providing they also avoid chemicals. ('More earthing normalizes pH). Judy --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@...> wrote: > > Thanks Marc. I agree that they are both symptoms and neither is a root cause. Basically wondering whether there is evidence of people who primarily focused on addressing exposure to one of them and then as a bonus noticed that this also reduced their sensitivity to the other. I imagine it can happen both ways, as one calms an over excited system, but I wonder if it is more likely to happen in one direction rather than the other. To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. > > --- In [hidden email], Marc Martin <marc@> wrote: > > > > On August 1, russel395 <russturk@> wrote: > > > My question is, for those of us who have pretty bad sensitivities to both, > > > do you think that one of the two sensitivities is more of the root cause and > > > more of the driver of the illness with the other sensitivity being more of a side effect? > > > > Well, neither of these are a root cause. They are instead both a symptom of the root > > cause. With the root cause probably some kind of liver problem. > > > > But I'd certainly focus on the one that's causing you the most problems at the moment, > > which depends on how severe each one is and your typical daily environment. > > > > Marc > > > |
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Also, I mentioned in another post about Sharon Heller, pHD. She has another excellent book about Anxiety and its Hidden Causes. She writes about how digestive enzymes or not enough of the right ones affect us. She says re maltose (digests maltase - starch sugars): "intolerance creates environmental hypersensitivity."
She explains about methylation and over and under methylators and histamine... and how this affects neurotransmitters and melatonin and serotonin. Also methylation turns on detox. If you are under or over methylator - it changes the picture. If you're an overmethylator (me), "you need folic acid, B12, B3 to decrease methylation and turn off reactions that need to be off... and you may also have elevated copper." Under methylators have high histamine (mine's normal) improve on GABA and SAMe. Those supplements do nothing for me. My GABA is high, even tho' I'm a nervous, over-reactive wreck. Keep learning... This reminds me of alcohol.... some people can hold their liquor... that, actually isn't good. It bites on the other side, and there's a danger of addiction? Those of us who can't tolerate much alcohol, get overdosed quickly, don't have addictive personalities. I think this again has to do with how the liver processes things through? Related? I'm very alcohol sensitive. I watched Matthew Perry talk about addiction the other day. Judy |
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In reply to this post by Russ
--- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@...> wrote:
> > To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. > In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. |
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Very very difficult to find a house or apt. that is completely mcs safe but at least you can get an air cleaner or make some changes.
EMF is harder to fix, I agree. Steve --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@...> wrote: > > --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: > > > > To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. > > > > In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. > |
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Thanks Steve. I think you may have misread my previous post though. I said that I was thinking the MCS issues were harder to fix so I think you are disagreeing rather than agreeing. I don't think air filters are able to filter some things that bother people with MCS due to the particle size being too small. If there is recent paint on the walls or formaldehyde offgassing from particle board cabinets or low levels of combustion products entering the living area from an oil boiler or gas furnace I don't know if an air filter can make that environment safe. I guess the same thing can be said for EMF issues though...that there are some problems that shielding or protection devices or whatever won't resolve.
--- In [hidden email], "torch369" <torch369@...> wrote: > > Very very difficult to find a house or apt. that is completely mcs safe but at least you can get an air cleaner or make some changes. > EMF is harder to fix, I agree. > Steve > > --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: > > > > --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: > > > > > > To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. > > > > > > > In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. > > > |
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oh, guys!
i hope this will not offend you if i add my two cents to this conversation. they have air filters here where i live - they also have dehumidifiers - yuck! - and they give off a tremendous amount of emf. i would never recommend them to anyone who is sensitive to either emf or is mcs. i can easily erase the chemical odors in my space, but i can't erase the emf/emr. i use negative ion generators that drop particles out of the air, and NIGs have no emf unless they are attached to a fan... in which case it is the fan that makes the emf, not the generator. negative ion generators will zap the odors of carpet chemicals, paints, smoke, mold, dust, animal hair and dander - everything and anything in the air. i have been using them for over 30 years. they work. and they last for a very long time. i got my favorite one at www.negativeiongenerators.com - no fan = no emf and it covers 1400 sq'. i use mine in the house and also when i go to a hotel room. it cleans the air very quickly and i can sleep. some use them in their automobiles. i do not sit too close to them and i have one in my bedroom that i can turn up during the day and down at night so i can sleep. the electricity in my bedroom was turned off for two nights and i really noticed the difference in odor - this is a very humid area of the country. love, patricia On Aug 4, 2013, at 1:54 PM, russel395 wrote: > Thanks Steve. I think you may have misread my previous post though. I said that I was thinking the MCS issues were harder to fix so I think you are disagreeing rather than agreeing. I don't think air filters are able to filter some things that bother people with MCS due to the particle size being too small. If there is recent paint on the walls or formaldehyde offgassing from particle board cabinets or low levels of combustion products entering the living area from an oil boiler or gas furnace I don't know if an air filter can make that environment safe. I guess the same thing can be said for EMF issues though...that there are some problems that shielding or protection devices or whatever won't resolve. > > > --- In [hidden email], "torch369" <torch369@...> wrote: >> >> Very very difficult to find a house or apt. that is completely mcs safe but at least you can get an air cleaner or make some changes. >> EMF is harder to fix, I agree. >> Steve >> >> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: >>> >>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: >>>> >>>> To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. >>>> >>> >>> In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. >>> >> |
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I am soorry to disappoint you here.
All negative ion generators do emit EMF. They produce what I call *dirty air*. These are frequencies from 5kHz up to 20MHz. Most meters cannot measure these frequencies, because these frequencies fall out of their range. Greetings, Charles Claessens www.milieuziektes.nl www.milieuziektes.be www.minderstraling.nl www.hetbitje.nl checked by Emsisoft ----- Original Message ----- From: Patricia Robinett To: [hidden email] Sent: Sunday, August 04, 2013 10:58 PM Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities... oh, guys! i hope this will not offend you if i add my two cents to this conversation. they have air filters here where i live - they also have dehumidifiers - yuck! - and they give off a tremendous amount of emf. i would never recommend them to anyone who is sensitive to either emf or is mcs. i can easily erase the chemical odors in my space, but i can't erase the emf/emr. i use negative ion generators that drop particles out of the air, and NIGs have no emf unless they are attached to a fan... in which case it is the fan that makes the emf, not the generator. negative ion generators will zap the odors of carpet chemicals, paints, smoke, mold, dust, animal hair and dander - everything and anything in the air. i have been using them for over 30 years. they work. and they last for a very long time. i got my favorite one at www.negativeiongenerators.com - no fan = no emf and it covers 1400 sq'. i use mine in the house and also when i go to a hotel room. it cleans the air very quickly and i can sleep. some use them in their automobiles. i do not sit too close to them and i have one in my bedroom that i can turn up during the day and down at night so i can sleep. the electricity in my bedroom was turned off for two nights and i really noticed the difference in odor - this is a very humid area of the country. love, patricia On Aug 4, 2013, at 1:54 PM, russel395 wrote: > Thanks Steve. I think you may have misread my previous post though. I said that I was thinking the MCS issues were harder to fix so I think you are disagreeing rather than agreeing. I don't think air filters are able to filter some things that bother people with MCS due to the particle size being too small. If there is recent paint on the walls or formaldehyde offgassing from particle board cabinets or low levels of combustion products entering the living area from an oil boiler or gas furnace I don't know if an air filter can make that environment safe. I guess the same thing can be said for EMF issues though...that there are some problems that shielding or protection devices or whatever won't resolve. > > > --- In [hidden email], "torch369" <torch369@...> wrote: >> >> Very very difficult to find a house or apt. that is completely mcs safe but at least you can get an air cleaner or make some changes. >> EMF is harder to fix, I agree. >> Steve >> >> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: >>> >>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: >>>> >>>> To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. >>>> >>> >>> In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. >>> >> ------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
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how much, charles?
and is it 'dirty air' or is it just 'charged air' that zaps particles out of the atmosphere? thanks. patricia On Aug 4, 2013, at 4:13 PM, charles wrote: > I am soorry to disappoint you here. > > All negative ion generators do emit EMF. > They produce what I call *dirty air*. > These are frequencies from 5kHz up to 20MHz. > > Most meters cannot measure these frequencies, because these frequencies fall out of their range. > > Greetings, > Charles Claessens > www.milieuziektes.nl > www.milieuziektes.be > www.minderstraling.nl > www.hetbitje.nl > checked by Emsisoft > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Patricia Robinett > To: [hidden email] > Sent: Sunday, August 04, 2013 10:58 PM > Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities... > > > oh, guys! > i hope this will not offend you if i add > my two cents to this conversation. > > they have air filters here where i live - > they also have dehumidifiers - yuck! - > and they give off a tremendous amount > of emf. i would never recommend them > to anyone who is sensitive to either emf > or is mcs. > > i can easily erase the chemical odors in my > space, but i can't erase the emf/emr. > > i use negative ion generators that drop > particles out of the air, and NIGs have > no emf unless they are attached to a > fan... in which case it is the fan that > makes the emf, not the generator. > > negative ion generators will zap the > odors of carpet chemicals, paints, smoke, > mold, dust, animal hair and dander - > everything and anything in the air. > > i have been using them for over 30 > years. they work. and they last for a > very long time. i got my favorite one > at www.negativeiongenerators.com - > no fan = no emf and it covers 1400 sq'. > > i use mine in the house and also when > i go to a hotel room. it cleans the air > very quickly and i can sleep. some use > them in their automobiles. i do not sit > too close to them and i have one in my > bedroom that i can turn up during the > day and down at night so i can sleep. > the electricity in my bedroom was > turned off for two nights and i really > noticed the difference in odor - this is > a very humid area of the country. > > love, patricia > > > On Aug 4, 2013, at 1:54 PM, russel395 wrote: > >> Thanks Steve. I think you may have misread my previous post though. I said that I was thinking the MCS issues were harder to fix so I think you are disagreeing rather than agreeing. I don't think air filters are able to filter some things that bother people with MCS due to the particle size being too small. If there is recent paint on the walls or formaldehyde offgassing from particle board cabinets or low levels of combustion products entering the living area from an oil boiler or gas furnace I don't know if an air filter can make that environment safe. I guess the same thing can be said for EMF issues though...that there are some problems that shielding or protection devices or whatever won't resolve. >> >> >> --- In [hidden email], "torch369" <torch369@...> wrote: >>> >>> Very very difficult to find a house or apt. that is completely mcs safe but at least you can get an air cleaner or make some changes. >>> EMF is harder to fix, I agree. >>> Steve >>> >>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: >>>> >>>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. >>>>> >>>> >>>> In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. >>>> >>> > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > |
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*Dirty air* is dangerous elektrosmog, for which electrosensitives may react heavily.
It goes through walls, etc. Like with certain TV's. Greetings, Charles Claessens www.milieuziektes.nl www.milieuziektes.be www.minderstraling.nl www.hetbitje.nl checked by Emsisoft ----- Original Message ----- From: Patricia Robinett To: [hidden email] Sent: Monday, August 05, 2013 12:02 AM Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities... how much, charles? and is it 'dirty air' or is it just 'charged air' that zaps particles out of the atmosphere? thanks. patricia On Aug 4, 2013, at 4:13 PM, charles wrote: > I am soorry to disappoint you here. > > All negative ion generators do emit EMF. > They produce what I call *dirty air*. > These are frequencies from 5kHz up to 20MHz. > > Most meters cannot measure these frequencies, because these frequencies fall out of their range. > > Greetings, > Charles Claessens > www.milieuziektes.nl > www.milieuziektes.be > www.minderstraling.nl > www.hetbitje.nl > checked by Emsisoft > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Patricia Robinett > To: [hidden email] > Sent: Sunday, August 04, 2013 10:58 PM > Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities... > > > oh, guys! > i hope this will not offend you if i add > my two cents to this conversation. > > they have air filters here where i live - > they also have dehumidifiers - yuck! - > and they give off a tremendous amount > of emf. i would never recommend them > to anyone who is sensitive to either emf > or is mcs. > > i can easily erase the chemical odors in my > space, but i can't erase the emf/emr. > > i use negative ion generators that drop > particles out of the air, and NIGs have > no emf unless they are attached to a > fan... in which case it is the fan that > makes the emf, not the generator. > > negative ion generators will zap the > odors of carpet chemicals, paints, smoke, > mold, dust, animal hair and dander - > everything and anything in the air. > > i have been using them for over 30 > years. they work. and they last for a > very long time. i got my favorite one > at www.negativeiongenerators.com - > no fan = no emf and it covers 1400 sq'. > > i use mine in the house and also when > i go to a hotel room. it cleans the air > very quickly and i can sleep. some use > them in their automobiles. i do not sit > too close to them and i have one in my > bedroom that i can turn up during the > day and down at night so i can sleep. > the electricity in my bedroom was > turned off for two nights and i really > noticed the difference in odor - this is > a very humid area of the country. > > love, patricia > > > On Aug 4, 2013, at 1:54 PM, russel395 wrote: > >> Thanks Steve. I think you may have misread my previous post though. I said that I was thinking the MCS issues were harder to fix so I think you are disagreeing rather than agreeing. I don't think air filters are able to filter some things that bother people with MCS due to the particle size being too small. If there is recent paint on the walls or formaldehyde offgassing from particle board cabinets or low levels of combustion products entering the living area from an oil boiler or gas furnace I don't know if an air filter can make that environment safe. I guess the same thing can be said for EMF issues though...that there are some problems that shielding or protection devices or whatever won't resolve. >> >> >> --- In [hidden email], "torch369" <torch369@...> wrote: >>> >>> Very very difficult to find a house or apt. that is completely mcs safe but at least you can get an air cleaner or make some changes. >>> EMF is harder to fix, I agree. >>> Steve >>> >>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: >>>> >>>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. >>>>> >>>> >>>> In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. >>>> >>> > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > ------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
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In reply to this post by Patricia
Thanks Patricia. Do you know if that model emits ozone? I tried a negative ion generator a while back and it really irritated my nose and throat.
--- In [hidden email], Patricia Robinett <patricia@...> wrote: > > oh, guys! > i hope this will not offend you if i add > my two cents to this conversation. > > they have air filters here where i live - > they also have dehumidifiers - yuck! - > and they give off a tremendous amount > of emf. i would never recommend them > to anyone who is sensitive to either emf > or is mcs. > > i can easily erase the chemical odors in my > space, but i can't erase the emf/emr. > > i use negative ion generators that drop > particles out of the air, and NIGs have > no emf unless they are attached to a > fan... in which case it is the fan that > makes the emf, not the generator. > > negative ion generators will zap the > odors of carpet chemicals, paints, smoke, > mold, dust, animal hair and dander - > everything and anything in the air. > > i have been using them for over 30 > years. they work. and they last for a > very long time. i got my favorite one > at www.negativeiongenerators.com - > no fan = no emf and it covers 1400 sq'. > > i use mine in the house and also when > i go to a hotel room. it cleans the air > very quickly and i can sleep. some use > them in their automobiles. i do not sit > too close to them and i have one in my > bedroom that i can turn up during the > day and down at night so i can sleep. > the electricity in my bedroom was > turned off for two nights and i really > noticed the difference in odor - this is > a very humid area of the country. > > love, patricia > > > On Aug 4, 2013, at 1:54 PM, russel395 wrote: > > > Thanks Steve. I think you may have misread my previous post though. I said that I was thinking the MCS issues were harder to fix so I think you are disagreeing rather than agreeing. I don't think air filters are able to filter some things that bother people with MCS due to the particle size being too small. If there is recent paint on the walls or formaldehyde offgassing from particle board cabinets or low levels of combustion products entering the living area from an oil boiler or gas furnace I don't know if an air filter can make that environment safe. I guess the same thing can be said for EMF issues though...that there are some problems that shielding or protection devices or whatever won't resolve. > > > > > > --- In [hidden email], "torch369" <torch369@> wrote: > >> > >> Very very difficult to find a house or apt. that is completely mcs safe but at least you can get an air cleaner or make some changes. > >> EMF is harder to fix, I agree. > >> Steve > >> > >> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: > >>> > >>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: > >>>> > >>>> To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. > >>>> > >>> > >>> In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. > >>> > >> > |
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In reply to this post by charles-4
how do you measure that?
what kinds of negative ion generators have you actually measured? what do you use to measure and how do you determine the numbers? thanks patricia On Aug 4, 2013, at 5:08 PM, charles wrote: > *Dirty air* is dangerous elektrosmog, for which electrosensitives may react heavily. > > It goes through walls, etc. > Like with certain TV's. > > Greetings, > Charles Claessens > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Patricia Robinett > To: [hidden email] > Sent: Monday, August 05, 2013 12:02 AM > Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities... > > > how much, charles? > and is it 'dirty air' or is it just 'charged air' > that zaps particles out of the atmosphere? > thanks. > patricia > > On Aug 4, 2013, at 4:13 PM, charles wrote: > >> I am soorry to disappoint you here. >> >> All negative ion generators do emit EMF. >> They produce what I call *dirty air*. >> These are frequencies from 5kHz up to 20MHz. >> >> Most meters cannot measure these frequencies, because these frequencies fall out of their range. >> >> Greetings, >> Charles Claessens >> www.milieuziektes.nl >> www.milieuziektes.be >> www.minderstraling.nl >> www.hetbitje.nl >> checked by Emsisoft >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Patricia Robinett >> To: [hidden email] >> Sent: Sunday, August 04, 2013 10:58 PM >> Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities... >> >> >> oh, guys! >> i hope this will not offend you if i add >> my two cents to this conversation. >> >> they have air filters here where i live - >> they also have dehumidifiers - yuck! - >> and they give off a tremendous amount >> of emf. i would never recommend them >> to anyone who is sensitive to either emf >> or is mcs. >> >> i can easily erase the chemical odors in my >> space, but i can't erase the emf/emr. >> >> i use negative ion generators that drop >> particles out of the air, and NIGs have >> no emf unless they are attached to a >> fan... in which case it is the fan that >> makes the emf, not the generator. >> >> negative ion generators will zap the >> odors of carpet chemicals, paints, smoke, >> mold, dust, animal hair and dander - >> everything and anything in the air. >> >> i have been using them for over 30 >> years. they work. and they last for a >> very long time. i got my favorite one >> at www.negativeiongenerators.com - >> no fan = no emf and it covers 1400 sq'. >> >> i use mine in the house and also when >> i go to a hotel room. it cleans the air >> very quickly and i can sleep. some use >> them in their automobiles. i do not sit >> too close to them and i have one in my >> bedroom that i can turn up during the >> day and down at night so i can sleep. >> the electricity in my bedroom was >> turned off for two nights and i really >> noticed the difference in odor - this is >> a very humid area of the country. >> >> love, patricia >> >> >> On Aug 4, 2013, at 1:54 PM, russel395 wrote: >> >>> Thanks Steve. I think you may have misread my previous post though. I said that I was thinking the MCS issues were harder to fix so I think you are disagreeing rather than agreeing. I don't think air filters are able to filter some things that bother people with MCS due to the particle size being too small. If there is recent paint on the walls or formaldehyde offgassing from particle board cabinets or low levels of combustion products entering the living area from an oil boiler or gas furnace I don't know if an air filter can make that environment safe. I guess the same thing can be said for EMF issues though...that there are some problems that shielding or protection devices or whatever won't resolve. >>> >>> >>> --- In [hidden email], "torch369" <torch369@...> wrote: >>>> >>>> Very very difficult to find a house or apt. that is completely mcs safe but at least you can get an air cleaner or make some changes. >>>> EMF is harder to fix, I agree. >>>> Steve >>>> >>>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. >>>>> >>>> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------ >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> >> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------ >> >> Yahoo! Groups Links >> >> >> >> > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > |
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In reply to this post by charles-4
Charles, do pretty much all appliances that plug into the wall emit "dirty air" or only some of them?
--- In [hidden email], "charles" <charles@...> wrote: > > *Dirty air* is dangerous elektrosmog, for which electrosensitives may react heavily. > > It goes through walls, etc. > Like with certain TV's. > > Greetings, > Charles Claessens > www.milieuziektes.nl > www.milieuziektes.be > www.minderstraling.nl > www.hetbitje.nl > checked by Emsisoft > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Patricia Robinett > To: [hidden email] > Sent: Monday, August 05, 2013 12:02 AM > Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities... > > > how much, charles? > and is it 'dirty air' or is it just 'charged air' > that zaps particles out of the atmosphere? > thanks. > patricia > > On Aug 4, 2013, at 4:13 PM, charles wrote: > > > I am soorry to disappoint you here. > > > > All negative ion generators do emit EMF. > > They produce what I call *dirty air*. > > These are frequencies from 5kHz up to 20MHz. > > > > Most meters cannot measure these frequencies, because these frequencies fall out of their range. > > > > Greetings, > > Charles Claessens > > www.milieuziektes.nl > > www.milieuziektes.be > > www.minderstraling.nl > > www.hetbitje.nl > > checked by Emsisoft > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Patricia Robinett > > To: [hidden email] > > Sent: Sunday, August 04, 2013 10:58 PM > > Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities... > > > > > > oh, guys! > > i hope this will not offend you if i add > > my two cents to this conversation. > > > > they have air filters here where i live - > > they also have dehumidifiers - yuck! - > > and they give off a tremendous amount > > of emf. i would never recommend them > > to anyone who is sensitive to either emf > > or is mcs. > > > > i can easily erase the chemical odors in my > > space, but i can't erase the emf/emr. > > > > i use negative ion generators that drop > > particles out of the air, and NIGs have > > no emf unless they are attached to a > > fan... in which case it is the fan that > > makes the emf, not the generator. > > > > negative ion generators will zap the > > odors of carpet chemicals, paints, smoke, > > mold, dust, animal hair and dander - > > everything and anything in the air. > > > > i have been using them for over 30 > > years. they work. and they last for a > > very long time. i got my favorite one > > at www.negativeiongenerators.com - > > no fan = no emf and it covers 1400 sq'. > > > > i use mine in the house and also when > > i go to a hotel room. it cleans the air > > very quickly and i can sleep. some use > > them in their automobiles. i do not sit > > too close to them and i have one in my > > bedroom that i can turn up during the > > day and down at night so i can sleep. > > the electricity in my bedroom was > > turned off for two nights and i really > > noticed the difference in odor - this is > > a very humid area of the country. > > > > love, patricia > > > > > > On Aug 4, 2013, at 1:54 PM, russel395 wrote: > > > >> Thanks Steve. I think you may have misread my previous post though. I said that I was thinking the MCS issues were harder to fix so I think you are disagreeing rather than agreeing. I don't think air filters are able to filter some things that bother people with MCS due to the particle size being too small. If there is recent paint on the walls or formaldehyde offgassing from particle board cabinets or low levels of combustion products entering the living area from an oil boiler or gas furnace I don't know if an air filter can make that environment safe. I guess the same thing can be said for EMF issues though...that there are some problems that shielding or protection devices or whatever won't resolve. > >> > >> > >> --- In [hidden email], "torch369" <torch369@> wrote: > >>> > >>> Very very difficult to find a house or apt. that is completely mcs safe but at least you can get an air cleaner or make some changes. > >>> EMF is harder to fix, I agree. > >>> Steve > >>> > >>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: > >>>> > >>>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. > >>>>> > >>>> > >>>> In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. > >>>> > >>> > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > |
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In reply to this post by Russ
can you show me the model, on the web, russel?
i've had numerous versions. love, patricia On Aug 4, 2013, at 5:17 PM, russel395 wrote: > Thanks Patricia. Do you know if that model emits ozone? I tried a negative ion generator a while back and it really irritated my nose and throat. > > --- In [hidden email], Patricia Robinett <patricia@...> wrote: >> >> oh, guys! >> i hope this will not offend you if i add >> my two cents to this conversation. >> >> they have air filters here where i live - >> they also have dehumidifiers - yuck! - >> and they give off a tremendous amount >> of emf. i would never recommend them >> to anyone who is sensitive to either emf >> or is mcs. >> >> i can easily erase the chemical odors in my >> space, but i can't erase the emf/emr. >> >> i use negative ion generators that drop >> particles out of the air, and NIGs have >> no emf unless they are attached to a >> fan... in which case it is the fan that >> makes the emf, not the generator. >> >> negative ion generators will zap the >> odors of carpet chemicals, paints, smoke, >> mold, dust, animal hair and dander - >> everything and anything in the air. >> >> i have been using them for over 30 >> years. they work. and they last for a >> very long time. i got my favorite one >> at www.negativeiongenerators.com - >> no fan = no emf and it covers 1400 sq'. >> >> i use mine in the house and also when >> i go to a hotel room. it cleans the air >> very quickly and i can sleep. some use >> them in their automobiles. i do not sit >> too close to them and i have one in my >> bedroom that i can turn up during the >> day and down at night so i can sleep. >> the electricity in my bedroom was >> turned off for two nights and i really >> noticed the difference in odor - this is >> a very humid area of the country. >> >> love, patricia >> >> >> On Aug 4, 2013, at 1:54 PM, russel395 wrote: >> >>> Thanks Steve. I think you may have misread my previous post though. I said that I was thinking the MCS issues were harder to fix so I think you are disagreeing rather than agreeing. I don't think air filters are able to filter some things that bother people with MCS due to the particle size being too small. If there is recent paint on the walls or formaldehyde offgassing from particle board cabinets or low levels of combustion products entering the living area from an oil boiler or gas furnace I don't know if an air filter can make that environment safe. I guess the same thing can be said for EMF issues though...that there are some problems that shielding or protection devices or whatever won't resolve. >>> >>> >>> --- In [hidden email], "torch369" <torch369@> wrote: >>>> >>>> Very very difficult to find a house or apt. that is completely mcs safe but at least you can get an air cleaner or make some changes. >>>> EMF is harder to fix, I agree. >>>> Steve >>>> >>>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. >>>>> >>>> >> > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > |
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I was just looking at the website you provided, the first model listed, "The Happy Machine". You can click on the pictures for more details. I didn't see any mention of ozone. It does say no EMFs.
http://www.negativeiongenerators.com/ --- In [hidden email], Patricia Robinett <patricia@...> wrote: > > can you show me the model, on the web, russel? > i've had numerous versions. > love, patricia > > > On Aug 4, 2013, at 5:17 PM, russel395 wrote: > > > Thanks Patricia. Do you know if that model emits ozone? I tried a negative ion generator a while back and it really irritated my nose and throat. > > > > --- In [hidden email], Patricia Robinett <patricia@> wrote: > >> > >> oh, guys! > >> i hope this will not offend you if i add > >> my two cents to this conversation. > >> > >> they have air filters here where i live - > >> they also have dehumidifiers - yuck! - > >> and they give off a tremendous amount > >> of emf. i would never recommend them > >> to anyone who is sensitive to either emf > >> or is mcs. > >> > >> i can easily erase the chemical odors in my > >> space, but i can't erase the emf/emr. > >> > >> i use negative ion generators that drop > >> particles out of the air, and NIGs have > >> no emf unless they are attached to a > >> fan... in which case it is the fan that > >> makes the emf, not the generator. > >> > >> negative ion generators will zap the > >> odors of carpet chemicals, paints, smoke, > >> mold, dust, animal hair and dander - > >> everything and anything in the air. > >> > >> i have been using them for over 30 > >> years. they work. and they last for a > >> very long time. i got my favorite one > >> at www.negativeiongenerators.com - > >> no fan = no emf and it covers 1400 sq'. > >> > >> i use mine in the house and also when > >> i go to a hotel room. it cleans the air > >> very quickly and i can sleep. some use > >> them in their automobiles. i do not sit > >> too close to them and i have one in my > >> bedroom that i can turn up during the > >> day and down at night so i can sleep. > >> the electricity in my bedroom was > >> turned off for two nights and i really > >> noticed the difference in odor - this is > >> a very humid area of the country. > >> > >> love, patricia > >> > >> > >> On Aug 4, 2013, at 1:54 PM, russel395 wrote: > >> > >>> Thanks Steve. I think you may have misread my previous post though. I said that I was thinking the MCS issues were harder to fix so I think you are disagreeing rather than agreeing. I don't think air filters are able to filter some things that bother people with MCS due to the particle size being too small. If there is recent paint on the walls or formaldehyde offgassing from particle board cabinets or low levels of combustion products entering the living area from an oil boiler or gas furnace I don't know if an air filter can make that environment safe. I guess the same thing can be said for EMF issues though...that there are some problems that shielding or protection devices or whatever won't resolve. > >>> > >>> > >>> --- In [hidden email], "torch369" <torch369@> wrote: > >>>> > >>>> Very very difficult to find a house or apt. that is completely mcs safe but at least you can get an air cleaner or make some changes. > >>>> EMF is harder to fix, I agree. > >>>> Steve > >>>> > >>>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. > >>>>> > >>>> > >> > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > |
Re: when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities...
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On August 4, russel395 <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I was just looking at the website you provided, the first model listed, "The Happy Machine". > You can click on the pictures for more details. I didn't see any mention of ozone. It does say no EMFs. Yes, but what does "no EMFs" mean, exactly? If it's plugged into an outlet, it must have *some* EMFs. Usually "no EMFs" means that it won't register on your typical meter that only measures 60hz. Marc |
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In reply to this post by Russ
That is very different.
It depends on the used electronic parts, the manufacturers are using. I measured on flat TV's of a certain type very little, but the next week the type was changed form an *H* into a *V*, and is was horrendous. For measuring I use special equipment. Have a look at http://www.minderstraling.nl/Pagina050.html Greetings, Charles Claessens www.milieuziektes.nl www.milieuziektes.be www.minderstraling.nl www.hetbitje.nl checked by Emsisoft ----- Original Message ----- From: russel395 To: [hidden email] Sent: Monday, August 05, 2013 12:21 AM Subject: [eSens] Re: when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities... Charles, do pretty much all appliances that plug into the wall emit "dirty air" or only some of them? --- In [hidden email], "charles" <charles@...> wrote: > > *Dirty air* is dangerous elektrosmog, for which electrosensitives may react heavily. > > It goes through walls, etc. > Like with certain TV's. > > Greetings, > Charles Claessens > www.milieuziektes.nl > www.milieuziektes.be > www.minderstraling.nl > www.hetbitje.nl > checked by Emsisoft > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Patricia Robinett > To: [hidden email] > Sent: Monday, August 05, 2013 12:02 AM > Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities... > > > how much, charles? > and is it 'dirty air' or is it just 'charged air' > that zaps particles out of the atmosphere? > thanks. > patricia > > On Aug 4, 2013, at 4:13 PM, charles wrote: > > > I am soorry to disappoint you here. > > > > All negative ion generators do emit EMF. > > They produce what I call *dirty air*. > > These are frequencies from 5kHz up to 20MHz. > > > > Most meters cannot measure these frequencies, because these frequencies fall out of their range. > > > > Greetings, > > Charles Claessens > > www.milieuziektes.nl > > www.milieuziektes.be > > www.minderstraling.nl > > www.hetbitje.nl > > checked by Emsisoft > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Patricia Robinett > > To: [hidden email] > > Sent: Sunday, August 04, 2013 10:58 PM > > Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: when you have both electrical and chemical sensitivities... > > > > > > oh, guys! > > i hope this will not offend you if i add > > my two cents to this conversation. > > > > they have air filters here where i live - > > they also have dehumidifiers - yuck! - > > and they give off a tremendous amount > > of emf. i would never recommend them > > to anyone who is sensitive to either emf > > or is mcs. > > > > i can easily erase the chemical odors in my > > space, but i can't erase the emf/emr. > > > > i use negative ion generators that drop > > particles out of the air, and NIGs have > > no emf unless they are attached to a > > fan... in which case it is the fan that > > makes the emf, not the generator. > > > > negative ion generators will zap the > > odors of carpet chemicals, paints, smoke, > > mold, dust, animal hair and dander - > > everything and anything in the air. > > > > i have been using them for over 30 > > years. they work. and they last for a > > very long time. i got my favorite one > > at www.negativeiongenerators.com - > > no fan = no emf and it covers 1400 sq'. > > > > i use mine in the house and also when > > i go to a hotel room. it cleans the air > > very quickly and i can sleep. some use > > them in their automobiles. i do not sit > > too close to them and i have one in my > > bedroom that i can turn up during the > > day and down at night so i can sleep. > > the electricity in my bedroom was > > turned off for two nights and i really > > noticed the difference in odor - this is > > a very humid area of the country. > > > > love, patricia > > > > > > On Aug 4, 2013, at 1:54 PM, russel395 wrote: > > > >> Thanks Steve. I think you may have misread my previous post though. I said that I was thinking the MCS issues were harder to fix so I think you are disagreeing rather than agreeing. I don't think air filters are able to filter some things that bother people with MCS due to the particle size being too small. If there is recent paint on the walls or formaldehyde offgassing from particle board cabinets or low levels of combustion products entering the living area from an oil boiler or gas furnace I don't know if an air filter can make that environment safe. I guess the same thing can be said for EMF issues though...that there are some problems that shielding or protection devices or whatever won't resolve. > >> > >> > >> --- In [hidden email], "torch369" <torch369@> wrote: > >>> > >>> Very very difficult to find a house or apt. that is completely mcs safe but at least you can get an air cleaner or make some changes. > >>> EMF is harder to fix, I agree. > >>> Steve > >>> > >>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: > >>>> > >>>> --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. > >>>>> > >>>> > >>>> In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. > >>>> > >>> > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > ------------------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Links [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] |
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In reply to this post by Russ
Yes, I misread that part. There are air filters that can get rid of VOC's, they just tend to be a little noisy. Getting rid of EMFs is much harder because whatever is out there really hasn't been proven and doesn't help everyone.
Steve --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@...> wrote: > > Thanks Steve. I think you may have misread my previous post though. I said that I was thinking the MCS issues were harder to fix so I think you are disagreeing rather than agreeing. I don't think air filters are able to filter some things that bother people with MCS due to the particle size being too small. If there is recent paint on the walls or formaldehyde offgassing from particle board cabinets or low levels of combustion products entering the living area from an oil boiler or gas furnace I don't know if an air filter can make that environment safe. I guess the same thing can be said for EMF issues though...that there are some problems that shielding or protection devices or whatever won't resolve. > > > --- In [hidden email], "torch369" <torch369@> wrote: > > > > Very very difficult to find a house or apt. that is completely mcs safe but at least you can get an air cleaner or make some changes. > > EMF is harder to fix, I agree. > > Steve > > > > --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: > > > > > > --- In [hidden email], "russel395" <russturk@> wrote: > > > > > > > > To tie it in with the housing thread, it is impossible to find the perfect house so is there any indication that someone severely sensitive to both chemicals and EMFs should primarily focus on one over the other. > > > > > > > > > > In answer to my own question, as far as housing options, the more I think about this the more I think that if you have MCS it is probably most important that any apartment or house you rent or buy is MCS-safe. I think that EMF issues are probably easier to address or fix. Don't know if others agree. > > > > > > |
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