Posted by
Ian Kemp on
URL: https://www.es-forum.com/Leaky-gut-and-celiac-disease-tp1541544p1541570.html
Thanks Diane. You've clarified the point I was trying to make. Leaky gut
and celiac disease are not the same. Either may cause immune system
problems. Therefore, testing for one will not rule out the other. Both are
potentially important.
In Sue's case, she has tested positive for leaky gut but not for celiac, and
cutting wheat and gluten out of her diet made only a marginal improvement
(and she showed a separate intolerance to these anyway, along with many
other foods). We are now convinced that the leaky gut has a major bearing
on her entire history of problems. The supporting evidence is that she was
100% healthy until a prolonged dose of antibiotics 7 years ago, got ME/CFS,
was cured of the physical exhaustion symptoms by an anti-candida diet, but
has gradually gone downhill since. It seems that some residual damage
and/or bacteria were left behind. After the diet worked, we did not follow
up with antifungals as recommended - possibly a mistake.
Ian
_____
From:
[hidden email] [mailto:
[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Evie
Sent: 16 May 2006 07:45
To:
[hidden email]
Subject: RE: [eSens] Leaky gut and celiac disease
Hi Ligure and Ian,
Sorry this info may not translate well. I am copying from a word document
and it is not spacing correctly for me. Celiac testing is different than
that for leaky gut. Because I belong to a large (3000+ people) celiac forum
and another celiac food forum, I am up on all the research, etc, for celiac
disease. There is a new home test for celiac disease, however, I regard it
too new to be accurate. (I also do not regard Enterolabs tests as
completely accurate, tho these can be a way to go if you are looking for
gluten intolerance rather than just celiac disease.) Again, I do not know
how they do this in Britain, but in the US, these are the tests for celiac
disease:
As a general note, these lab tests are looking for antibodies to gluten,
and therefore, may not be accurate for diagnosis if someone is already
maintaining a gluten free diet.
It is a battery of tests, including:
1. IgA antigliadin antibodies
2. IgG antigliadin antibodies
3. Anti-endomysial IgA
4. Tissue Transglutaminase IgA
5. Total Serum IgA (note.. many people forget to run this test,
so be sure to ask for it. It is important because a significant
percentage of people with celiac disease have selective IgA
deficiency and don't make enough IgA to make the test valid and
might conclude an incorrect diagnosis).
The Genetic tests look for DQ2 and DQ8 genes. It is now generally
accepted that all new adult celiacs had celiac disease as children
and underwent remission. Remission happens most often at the age
of 11yo.
Prometheus Labs--I have heard more than once that they are the most
effective and knowledgeable lab in this country (US) when it comes to blood
testing for
Celiac testing. They test for the entire celiac panel.
I was told that the serology is only $290 and the serology plus genetic
test is $730 (This includes the genetic testing). Prometheus will
submit to your insurance if you provide them with the information.
I was told that you need a doctor's written order to take to a lab.
The lab will draw the blood and send it to Prometheus for testing.
If your doctor is not familiar with sending testing to them, Prometheus
will ship you their specimen transport boxes at no charge. Their
website is www.prometheuslabs.com and has some detailed info
about the Celiac Disease Serology.
Hope this answers your questions about celiac testing. As I wrote in
another email, celiac tests are not always conclusive. There is a problem
with false negative results more than false positive ones. As a result,
some people prefer to go completely gluten-free (the treatment for celiac
disease) even without positive test results. In doing so, many find relief
of symptoms and then stay gf.
Diane
Ian Kemp <
[hidden email]> wrote:
The test is the "leaky gut" or "intestinal permeability" test. It's one
of
the most common "alternative medicine" tests, and a number of labs do it
both in the UK and the USA (and probably elsewhere). They should also
provide an interpretation of the results for you.
from what I've heard, it's common for people with MCS or other immune system
dysfunction to test positive, and this helps to explain why they are not
absorbing the nutrients that usually keep the immune system and liver detox
functions healthy. The problem then is what to do about it. The msot
common hypothesis is that it's caused by a bacterial or yeast problem, and
probiotics or an antifungal may help, depending on the person. (And also on
the practitioner - there doesn't seem to be a consensus on the best
treatment).
Ian
_____
From:
[hidden email] [mailto:
[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
Ligure
Sent: 15 May 2006 04:38
To:
[hidden email]
Subject: RE: [eSens] Leaky gut and celiac disease
You know, upon further reflection, it was two of my children that we
specifically tested for celiac disease. Neither had it. I think I will have
to look into that for myself. What is the name of the test so that I can
order it?
Thanks,
Ligure
_____
From: Ian Kemp [mailto:
[hidden email]]
Sent: Sunday, May 14, 2006 1:55 PM
To:
[hidden email]
Subject: [eSens] Leaky gut and celiac disease
Ligure,
You say you have tested negative for celiac disease but was it a specific
test for that? Feedback from this group seems to suggest that the majority
have some sort of immune system problem, which very often seems to be linked
to leaky gut. There is a general test for leaky gut (also known as
intestinal permeability) involving testing the absorption/permeation of a
solution of microparticles of various sizes which you drink. From our
experience we would say that anyone suffering chronic fatigue, ME, MCS or ES
symptoms would be well advised to do this test - we wish we had done it a
lot earlier than we did. Sue tested positive for leaky gut but negative for
the more specific celiac disease.
Ian
-----Original Message-----
From:
[hidden email] [mailto:
[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
Ligure
Sent: 13 May 2006 06:39
To:
[hidden email]
Subject: RE: [eSens] Re: Is ES an allergy? (Explanation part 2)
Diane,
I was trying to say the same thing you described here. Perhaps I came off
the wrong way. So I think we are in alignment on the celiac way of acquiring
an allergy. Basically the digestive system allows things (proteins) to pass
through the walls that it should have broken down further (i.e. to amino
acids). Celiac disease is one form of this problem. Generically this is
called "leaky gut" syndrome. Not to be confused with Montezuma's revenge.
;-) It is leaky in that the unbroken down substance leaks from the GI tract
to the bloodstream and thus is engaged by the immune system.
I had been tested for celiac (as I recall) and did not have the problem. I
suspected a calcium allergy and B12 allergy due to research and it was
confirmed through a NAET practitioner. They also cleared it up. However they
only cleared those up and not what I am leading to which is a possible
allergy to EMF or as I have found on this group electrosmog (sp?). I like
that term.
Ligure
_____
From: Evie [mailto:
[hidden email]]
Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 8:47 PM
To:
[hidden email]
Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: Is ES an allergy? (Explanation part 2)
Hi, Ligure,
My understanding of allergies is much different than yours. It was
explained to me that we aquire allergies when our bodies cannot break down
the components of a particular food or chemical, etc, into a usable unit.
Anything that is not usable AND gets into the blood stream is considered by
the body to be an antigen. Our immune systems are encoded to attack
antigens. Foreign substances get into our blood streams via tight junctions
(like bricks in a wall, which form the wall of the gut, for instance) which
are usually closed and are supposed to be closed, but react to glutens and a
few other things by opening. (I have read that EMFs cause tight junctions
to open.) As a celiac I am aware of this because celiacs have tight
junctions which stay open not only in the small intestine, but in the blood
brain barrier and lungs. (Some say also the heart.) This is why celiacs
have such a high incidence of auto-immune disease--the immune system is
always attacking something or other, usually undigested food particles.
Our bodies cannot use many nutrients without "carriers" which escort each
assigned nutrient across the intestinal wall at particular sites. B12, for
instance, which you mention having problems with, is assigned a particular
site where it crosses and this is also one of the first sites to be damaged
in celiac disease or from gluten intolerance. The site for calcium is also
one of the first to be damaged by gluten intolerance and cd. It sounds to
me like you do not have an allergy to either of these, but instead have
gluten intolerance or celiac disease. In celiac disease, you must not eat
any glutens which are contained in wheat, rye, barley, and oats (by
contamination). Nor can you eat any derivitives of these. In 6 months or
so of avoidance, your small intestine will begin to heal and this will cure
you of your "allergy" to B12 and calcium. I had problems with these
nutrients as well. When I was finally dxed with cd, I had osteoporosis from
calcium deficiency and a dexa scan of -3.50. Two years after going
glutenfree, my dexa score had improved to +1.75.
I am not saying that NAET or Bioset cannot work (I know nothing of either,
btw). But if they work they do it on a different principal than simply
"retraining". What exactly is NAET and Bioset? Have these worked, for
instance, for your allergies to B12 and calcium?
Diane
Ligure <
[hidden email]> wrote:
And now the different level.
Given that the body has a means of taking care of its allergen/toxic load
(part 1), why did it accumulate the load in the first place? Or more to the
point why do some folks have an allergy to some substance while others do
not? These questions have plagued me.
So, the body responds to an allergen because it was trained to do so. This
may seem strange (at least it did to me) considering that there are many
people's bodies which do not adversely respond to a given allergen (i.e.
wheat) while others have a problem with it. How did the body acquire such an
adverse response? Some might say genetics. I am going to lay that one aside
just because that is the typical catchall when the "expoerts" don't know the
answer.
It may be the "answer" in some cases, but there or other answers that can be
found before we throw in the genetic towel.
How else was the body trained? Simple explanations are in order.
Prolonged exposure, over exposure, or exposure at the wrong place It often
happens that where at one time one has no allergic response to something to
discover one day that they can no longer tolerate it. This occurs because
the immune system got engaged at a deeper level than it once needed to or
"decided" to engage the substance in an adversarial fashion. One example of
this is the "leaky gut" syndrome. If the digestive system does not
metabolize the bread and break its proteins down into amino acids, the
immune system will engage the proteins as if they were foreign substances
and develop an allergy.
I because allergic to calcium and B12 in this way. And both of these are
needed by the body.
Immune system is weak during exposure
This can happen by weakened associaiton. For instance if you are weakened by
exposure to some chemical and you are eating bread during that exposure,
your immune system may mistakenly react to the bread. The weakness may not
be physical even. It could be emotional,
I am sure there are other ways of training, but they are similar.
Now the question is how to "untrain" the response.
This is where the next level begins. Through energetic-type of medicine like
NAET and Bioset the body's immune system is retaught to no longer consider a
substance as an allergen. It sort of makes peace with the allergen and turns
it into a peacable neighbor. So instead of having an attacking type of
response which leads to histamine reactions and thus cascade into an
allergic response it allow the substance to coexist and even just pass on
through the body if the substance is of no use.
Now this energetic medicine goes to the level that your body's "field"
can tell
when it comes in proximity to a substances "field" what that substance it.
If
your body does not want that substance (i.e. allergic response), it will
begin to respond accordingly.
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