[esens] High frequency sounds from vacuum penetrate body causing ES symptoms

Hi Cara,

I just made what I think is a great discovery about high frequency sounds as
it relates to ES. Or at least it is a discovery for me.

After getting my new Miele canister vacuum, I noticed that although the
vacuum is very quiet, the high frequency of the motor still creates
irritation that feel like ES symptoms. As mentioned before it is much
better than any other vacuum I have used.

I realized that if buddhist bells cause a high frequency sound that can
penetrate my body and cause "good", that a high frequency sound from a
vacuum cleaner could also penetrate my body but cause 'bad".

That would also explain why your husband feels sick even when sitting in
another room when you are vacuuming since these high frequency sounds can
penetrate through an entire house. I regularly listen to my "Om" CD to
clear the energy in my house, and I can feel it penetrating through the
walls, causing me to feel good even when I'm in another room. It vibrates
in my body giving relief.

I'm so excited to make this discovery, so I can now watchout for other high
frequency sounds that may be causing irritation. Now the challenge is to
figure out how to cancel out those bad frequencies.

I know from my earlier days discovering how to build sound rooms that the
types of furniture, carpet, pictures, can all contribute to the quality of
sound in a room. So maybe placing a certain type of wallpaper or other
things in a room my create a protected zone from the sounds. Or using
egg-carton style deflectors like they use in professional sound rooms or in
theatres. Or maybe even create a meditation box that is sound-proof, as a
safe place to get relief.

Glenn

Hello Glenn,

you may look at http://www.milieuziektes.nl/Pagina161.html
as well as http://www.milieuziektes.nl/Pagina113b.html

I have found, that frequencies in the range of 5 kHz to 150 kHz can have an
enormous impact on electrosensibles.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
www.hetbitje.nl
checked by Norton Antivirus



----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn Coleman" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2005 22:23
Subject: [esens] High frequency sounds from vacuum penetrate body causing ES
symptoms


>
> Hi Cara,
>
> I just made what I think is a great discovery about high frequency sounds
as high
> frequency sounds that may be causing irritation. Now the challenge is to
> figure out how to cancel out those bad frequencies.
>
> I know from my earlier days discovering how to build sound rooms that the
> types of furniture, carpet, pictures, can all contribute to the quality of
> sound in a room. So maybe placing a certain type of wallpaper or other
> things in a room my create a protected zone from the sounds. Or using
> egg-carton style deflectors like they use in professional sound rooms or
in on
> >you -- I'd be very interested to hear that. As you know, our current
vacuum
> >(very loud, powerful-sounding Hoover) has a disastrous effect on my
husband high dirt
> >from carpet. The technician told me that most people notice that the
> >vacuum files up very quickly with dirt for the first few months, picking
up
> >dirt that their old vacuum didn't have the power to get. After that
there
> >is barely any dust in the house - this seems good with potential
allergies

Thanks Charles. Those are good articles on bioresonance. Do you know of
any way to protect against those sound frequencies? Does EMF clothing
protect from this?

Glenn

Hello Glenn,

as I have written, bioresonance frequencies can be given by light, by hand-
and foot electrodes, and by sound.
(even by intention).
So you cannot shield yourself from them.
The body just picks them up and absorb them.

The only way of *shielding* against sound waves are in my opinion with
contra sound, as they apply sometimes with f.i. heavy lorries.
A complicated computersystem detects the sinus form of the sound wave, and
produces a contra sinus wave.
The sound is then eliminated.
(as I have seen on television)

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
www.hetbitje.nl
checked by Norton Antivirus


----- Original Message -----
From: "Glenn Coleman" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Saturday, February 12, 2005 22:57
Subject: Re: [esens] High frequency sounds from vacuum penetrate body
causing ES symptoms

an the
> > > vacuum is very quiet, the high frequency of the motor still creates
> > > irritation that feel like ES symptoms. As mentioned before it is much
> > > better than any other vacuum I have used.
> > >
> > > I realized that if buddhist bells cause a high frequency sound that
can
> > > penetrate my body and cause "good", that a high frequency sound from a
> > > vacuum cleaner could also penetrate my body but cause 'bad".
> > >
> > > That would also explain why your husband feels sick even when sitting
in
> > > another room when you are vacuuming since these high frequency sounds
> >can
> > > penetrate through an entire house. I regularly listen to my "Om" CD
to
> > > clear the energy in my house, and I can feel it penetrating through
the quality
> >of
> > > sound in a room. So maybe placing a certain type of wallpaper or
other
> > > things in a room my create a protected zone from the sounds. Or using
> > > egg-carton style deflectors like they use in professional sound rooms
or
> >in
> > > theatres. Or maybe even create a meditation box that is sound-proof,
as a
> > > >while before we can prioritize spending the $$ for a Miele, but at
> >least
> > > >I'll know which one to buy.
> > > >
> > > >If you ever have an opportunity to test what it's like for you to
have
> > > >*someone else in the house* vacuum with the Miele -- what the effect
is bit
> > > >overwhelmed with ES symptoms. It is far better than all my old
> >vacuums,
> > > >which I could only handle for about 5 minutes, but still not EMF
free.
> > > >
> > > >I think any device with a high frequency motor automatically will
have
> >high
> > > >EMF levels. That is unless it is the frequency of the noise that is
> > > >rattling my nerves.
> > > >
> > > >It is wonderful to have such a quiet yet powerful vacuum, but still
not
> >a
> > > >perfect solution for an ES sufferer.
> > > >
> > > >I don't think there is a vacuum on the market that has less EMF than
> >the
> > > >Miele, so still seems like the best bet. It is also extremely well
> > > >engineered in all areas. One problem with many vacuums is they blow
> >out
> > > >exhaust air down towards the floor, with blows around dust before it
is
> > > >vacuumed. The Miele only blows air upwards, so doesn't stir up dust.
> >It
> > > >also has higher capacity hoses so much larger volume of air sucking
up

Hi Glenn,

Since you've brought up how sounds can be either "bad" or
"good" for ES, here' s a story that's weird even by our standards.
Last night my husband shared with me that the sound of me
CRUNCHING on junky snacks can trigger his ES symptoms. It
doesn't happen EVERY time I snack on, say, potato chips. If I'm
having a great old time, for example, playing a computer game
and eating chips -- the sound of me eating chips won't have any
irritating effect at all. BUT, if I come home stressed from work,
sack out on the couch and watch TV while eating the same chips
-- making the identical crunching sounds --- for some reason
THOSE crunching sounds trigger his ES symptoms. He ends up
having to retreat to another room and lie down to recover.

Weird? It's as if the stress I feel gets transmitted to my husband
through the sound I make with those dang chips, and that
triggers ES... Now I know chip-crunching probably doesn't qualify
as "high-frequency" sound, but your comment about the vacuum
cleaner reminded me of this story because my husband
*specifically* compared the crunching to the vacuum cleaner in
terms of its effect on him. Anyway, it goes back to our previous
discussion of how physical contact with a person can trigger ES.
Apparently physical contact isn't even necessary in our case;
SOUND can do the damage just as well. BTW, those times
when the crunching sounds caused the trouble -- I never said a
word to my husband about stress at work. As far as I know, he
wasn't aware that I was particularly stressed out. The
communication/transmission of stress was completely via
sound and ES.

The silver lining here is maybe I'll finally stop snacking on junk.
I'm sure there are better ways of dealing with stress anyway. :-)

Cara

--- In [hidden email], "Glenn Coleman"
<glennhcoleman@h...> wrote:

> I realized that if buddhist bells cause a high frequency sound
that can penetrate my body and cause "good", that a high
frequency sound from a vacuum cleaner could also penetrate my
body but cause 'bad".

At one point I was also this sensitive to any annoying sounds. It is almost
the same effect as when somebody has a migrane headache, and any sound in
the room triggers pain. I wonder if it may be more just hypersensitivity to
sound in general when his body is overloaded? For me it was when my body
was at its limits with mercury and/or paxil messing with my nervous system,
that I had this hypersensitivity. It was almost like I had so much chaos
inside my body, that my only sanity was quiet time outside my body. So any
disruption took away my only sense of peace or grounding, and it triggered
anxiety and symptoms. Sometimes it would end up in rage because I was
almost going mad feeling this disoriented and irritated, not finding any
relief - my way of doing something about it since nothing else was working.

Now that I think of it, the nausea I get with ES symptoms is similar to what
I get if I get a migrane headache, so the two hypersensitivites may be more
similar than I realize - both acting on my nervous system.

Glenn

Hello Cara,

you also may have a look at:

http://www.milieuziektes.nl/Pagina161.html
and
http://www.milieuziektes.nl/Pagina162.html

Certain people with ES do have also something with their hearing.
Mostly they get irritated with higher tones (like ventilators from
computers, etc. but others hear very low frequencies like passing cars or
airplanes; they *feel* them like *shadows*)

The first URL shows that our body can adopt frequencies by light, contact,
sound or intention.

The second URL shows that we have certain frequency fields around our body.
Within 5 cm they are related to our health state, and from 5 to 30 cm they
are related to our state of mind.
This RFI system determines an aura to each frequency field (40 altogether)

People can feel auras.
People can see auras.

People with ES are generally more sensible than others.

So, if you are agitated from your work, it can be detected from your aura.
And your very sensible husband can pick up this change in your frequency
field.
This special frequency is different from your normal frequency, and that can
be annoying for him.

Be aware, that ES people are not normal people, but are very sensitive in
perception in many other fields, we not know much about.

So, your crispering crunching sounds from your chips may go together with
the frequency of an aura frequency.
(like the pulsed low frequency information added to a high frequency carrier
frequency, as is used with mobile phones).

When another person is angry, one may *feel* that also.
It is in the same region.

I do hope that it is a bit more understandable for you now.
It is not weird, just a matter of higher sensitivity and perception.

This is a great newsgroup!

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
www.hetbitje.nl
checked by Norton Antivirus



----- Original Message -----
From: "Cara" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sunday, February 13, 2005 08:04
Subject: [eSens] Re: High frequency sounds from vacuum penetrate body
causing ES symptoms

I'm afraid I find this a bit hard to accept. I don't see how it is
possible to link ES symtoms to the sound of someone eating.

Your husband's symptoms are more likely to be caused because he finds
your eating noises irritating but doesn't want to say anything, or
because he he is absorbing your stress, or both. If a person is
seriously low in B vitamins, this would possible be an explanantion as
to the physical symptoms.

Sarah

-----Original Message-----
From: Cara [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Sunday, 13 February 2005 6:05 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [eSens] Re: High frequency sounds from vacuum penetrate body
causing ES symptoms




Hi Glenn,

Since you've brought up how sounds can be either "bad" or
"good" for ES, here' s a story that's weird even by our standards.
Last night my husband shared with me that the sound of me
CRUNCHING on junky snacks can trigger his ES symptoms. It
doesn't happen EVERY time I snack on, say, potato chips. If I'm
having a great old time, for example, playing a computer game
and eating chips -- the sound of me eating chips won't have any
irritating effect at all. BUT, if I come home stressed from work,
sack out on the couch and watch TV while eating the same chips
-- making the identical crunching sounds --- for some reason
THOSE crunching sounds trigger his ES symptoms. He ends up
having to retreat to another room and lie down to recover.

Weird? It's as if the stress I feel gets transmitted to my husband
through the sound I make with those dang chips, and that
triggers ES... Now I know chip-crunching probably doesn't qualify
as "high-frequency" sound, but your comment about the vacuum
cleaner reminded me of this story because my husband
*specifically* compared the crunching to the vacuum cleaner in
terms of its effect on him. Anyway, it goes back to our previous
discussion of how physical contact with a person can trigger ES.
Apparently physical contact isn't even necessary in our case;
SOUND can do the damage just as well. BTW, those times
when the crunching sounds caused the trouble -- I never said a
word to my husband about stress at work. As far as I know, he
wasn't aware that I was particularly stressed out. The
communication/transmission of stress was completely via
sound and ES.

The silver lining here is maybe I'll finally stop snacking on junk.
I'm sure there are better ways of dealing with stress anyway. :-)

Cara

--- In [hidden email], "Glenn Coleman"
<glennhcoleman@h...> wrote:

> I realized that if buddhist bells cause a high frequency sound
that can penetrate my body and cause "good", that a high
frequency sound from a vacuum cleaner could also penetrate my
body but cause 'bad".








 
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Hi Sarah, I understand your skepticism completely. I am
reporting what my husband shared with me because I have
made the mistake in the past of discounting his experience
simply because I did not understand how it could be true. How
could his computer be hurting him? It wasn't hurting me, so it
couldn't possibly be hurting him; he was just making up
far-fetched complaints about his computer to be difficult. Or so I
thought. I've sinced learned with absolute certainty that my
husband doesn't make up stories. If anything, he plays down his
symptoms because he knows how crazy they sound. I take his
reports at face value now even if I don't understand them
because I know him so well. I realize that you don't, but I do.

My husband didn't say he could sense my stress because I was
chewing my food harder than usual -- that he was picking up
auditory cues and absorbing my stress that way -- he told me the
crunching sound was actually triggering ES the way the vacuum
cleaner does. We didn't spend a lot of time trying to understand
how this was possible (we've got other problems). So I have no
explanation to offer for the crunching sounds triggering his ES. I
knew sharing the story here would make me sound like a
complete nut job. My hope is that someone on this list will one
day connect the dots between all the disparate bits of
information we all share...and find answers that will help us all.
If I have to sound like a crackpot in the meantime, I guess I can
live with that. :-)

Cara

--- In [hidden email], "Benson, Sarah \(Sen L.
Allison\)" <Sarah.Benson@a...> wrote:
> I'm afraid I find this a bit hard to accept. I don't see how it is
> possible to link ES symtoms to the sound of someone eating.
>
> Your husband's symptoms are more likely to be caused
because he finds
> your eating noises irritating but doesn't want to say anything, or
> because he he is absorbing your stress, or both. If a person is
> seriously low in B vitamins, this would possible be an
explanantion as
> to the physical symptoms.
>
> Sarah
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Cara [mailto:cara_evangelista@h...]
> Sent: Sunday, 13 February 2005 6:05 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [eSens] Re: High frequency sounds from vacuum
penetrate body
> causing ES symptoms
>
>
>
>
> Hi Glenn,
>
> Since you've brought up how sounds can be either "bad" or
> "good" for ES, here' s a story that's weird even by our
standards.
> Last night my husband shared with me that the sound of me
> CRUNCHING on junky snacks can trigger his ES symptoms. It
> doesn't happen EVERY time I snack on, say, potato chips. If I'm
> having a great old time, for example, playing a computer game
> and eating chips -- the sound of me eating chips won't have
any
> irritating effect at all. BUT, if I come home stressed from work,
> sack out on the couch and watch TV while eating the same
chips
> -- making the identical crunching sounds --- for some reason
> THOSE crunching sounds trigger his ES symptoms. He ends
up
> having to retreat to another room and lie down to recover.
>
> Weird? It's as if the stress I feel gets transmitted to my
husband
> through the sound I make with those dang chips, and that
> triggers ES... Now I know chip-crunching probably doesn't
qualify
> as "high-frequency" sound, but your comment about the
vacuum
> cleaner reminded me of this story because my husband
> *specifically* compared the crunching to the vacuum cleaner in
> terms of its effect on him. Anyway, it goes back to our previous
> discussion of how physical contact with a person can trigger
ES.
> Apparently physical contact isn't even necessary in our case;
> SOUND can do the damage just as well. BTW, those times
> when the crunching sounds caused the trouble -- I never said
a
> word to my husband about stress at work. As far as I know, he
> wasn't aware that I was particularly stressed out. The
> communication/transmission of stress was completely via
> sound and ES.
>
> The silver lining here is maybe I'll finally stop snacking on junk.
> I'm sure there are better ways of dealing with stress anyway.
:-)
>
> Cara
>
> --- In [hidden email], "Glenn Coleman"
> <glennhcoleman@h...> wrote:
>
> > I realized that if buddhist bells cause a high frequency sound
> that can penetrate my body and cause "good", that a high
> frequency sound from a vacuum cleaner could also penetrate
my

Its amazingly difficult, isnt it, trying to make sense of the things that are happening when you or your loved one get ES. All our "life experience" and "common sense" dont seem to work when trying to assess whats happening.

For the record, Sue has found that she feels sensitive to noise as well (she had a really uncomfortable time when she went to the cinema with friends a few months back) and has told me that she feels that eating (crunching) celery can make her feel worse!

A friends son who had ME developed extreme noise sensitivity, such that he couldnt eat with the family because the clink of knives and forks on the plates was torture to him. Happily, he gradually recovered and is now completely OK again. The sensitivity disappeared with the ME.

(Please forgive lack of apostrophes, I split some tea down my keyboard when I felt stressed and they have stopped working!)

Ian
----- Original Message -----
From: Cara
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 6:32 AM
Subject: [eSens] Re: High frequency sounds from vacuum penetrate body causing ES symptoms



Hi Sarah, I understand your skepticism completely. I am
reporting what my husband shared with me because I have
made the mistake in the past of discounting his experience
simply because I did not understand how it could be true. How
could his computer be hurting him? It wasn't hurting me, so it
couldn't possibly be hurting him; he was just making up
far-fetched complaints about his computer to be difficult. Or so I
thought. I've sinced learned with absolute certainty that my
husband doesn't make up stories. If anything, he plays down his
symptoms because he knows how crazy they sound. I take his
reports at face value now even if I don't understand them
because I know him so well. I realize that you don't, but I do.

My husband didn't say he could sense my stress because I was
chewing my food harder than usual -- that he was picking up
auditory cues and absorbing my stress that way -- he told me the
crunching sound was actually triggering ES the way the vacuum
cleaner does. We didn't spend a lot of time trying to understand
how this was possible (we've got other problems). So I have no
explanation to offer for the crunching sounds triggering his ES. I
knew sharing the story here would make me sound like a
complete nut job. My hope is that someone on this list will one
day connect the dots between all the disparate bits of
information we all share...and find answers that will help us all.
If I have to sound like a crackpot in the meantime, I guess I can
live with that. :-)

Cara

--- In [hidden email], "Benson, Sarah \(Sen L.
Allison\)" <Sarah.Benson@a...> wrote:
> I'm afraid I find this a bit hard to accept. I don't see how it is
> possible to link ES symtoms to the sound of someone eating.
>
> Your husband's symptoms are more likely to be caused
because he finds
> your eating noises irritating but doesn't want to say anything, or
> because he he is absorbing your stress, or both. If a person is
> seriously low in B vitamins, this would possible be an
explanantion as
> to the physical symptoms.
>
> Sarah
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Cara [mailto:cara_evangelista@h...]
> Sent: Sunday, 13 February 2005 6:05 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [eSens] Re: High frequency sounds from vacuum
penetrate body
> causing ES symptoms
>
>
>
>
> Hi Glenn,
>
> Since you've brought up how sounds can be either "bad" or
> "good" for ES, here' s a story that's weird even by our
standards.
> Last night my husband shared with me that the sound of me
> CRUNCHING on junky snacks can trigger his ES symptoms. It
> doesn't happen EVERY time I snack on, say, potato chips. If I'm
> having a great old time, for example, playing a computer game
> and eating chips -- the sound of me eating chips won't have
any
> irritating effect at all. BUT, if I come home stressed from work,
> sack out on the couch and watch TV while eating the same
chips
> -- making the identical crunching sounds --- for some reason
> THOSE crunching sounds trigger his ES symptoms. He ends
up
> having to retreat to another room and lie down to recover.
>
> Weird? It's as if the stress I feel gets transmitted to my
husband
> through the sound I make with those dang chips, and that
> triggers ES... Now I know chip-crunching probably doesn't
qualify
> as "high-frequency" sound, but your comment about the
vacuum
> cleaner reminded me of this story because my husband
> *specifically* compared the crunching to the vacuum cleaner in
> terms of its effect on him. Anyway, it goes back to our previous
> discussion of how physical contact with a person can trigger
ES.
> Apparently physical contact isn't even necessary in our case;
> SOUND can do the damage just as well. BTW, those times
> when the crunching sounds caused the trouble -- I never said
a
> word to my husband about stress at work. As far as I know, he
> wasn't aware that I was particularly stressed out. The
> communication/transmission of stress was completely via
> sound and ES.
>
> The silver lining here is maybe I'll finally stop snacking on junk.
> I'm sure there are better ways of dealing with stress anyway.
:-)
>
> Cara
>
> --- In [hidden email], "Glenn Coleman"
> <glennhcoleman@h...> wrote:
>
> > I realized that if buddhist bells cause a high frequency sound
> that can penetrate my body and cause "good", that a high
> frequency sound from a vacuum cleaner could also penetrate
my



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

... and the other thing I forgot to mention is that Sue has to go to the other end of the house when Im using my electric shaver - I have to warn her "Im going to buzz"......Again not e-fields, just the noise.
.Ian
----- Original Message -----
From: Sue and Ian Kemp
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Tuesday, February 15, 2005 12:26 AM
Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: High frequency sounds from vacuum penetrate body causing ES symptoms


Its amazingly difficult, isnt it, trying to make sense of the things that are happening when you or your loved one get ES. All our "life experience" and "common sense" dont seem to work when trying to assess whats happening.

For the record, Sue has found that she feels sensitive to noise as well (she had a really uncomfortable time when she went to the cinema with friends a few months back) and has told me that she feels that eating (crunching) celery can make her feel worse!

A friends son who had ME developed extreme noise sensitivity, such that he couldnt eat with the family because the clink of knives and forks on the plates was torture to him. Happily, he gradually recovered and is now completely OK again. The sensitivity disappeared with the ME.

(Please forgive lack of apostrophes, I split some tea down my keyboard when I felt stressed and they have stopped working!)

Ian
----- Original Message -----
From: Cara
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Monday, February 14, 2005 6:32 AM
Subject: [eSens] Re: High frequency sounds from vacuum penetrate body causing ES symptoms



Hi Sarah, I understand your skepticism completely. I am
reporting what my husband shared with me because I have
made the mistake in the past of discounting his experience
simply because I did not understand how it could be true. How
could his computer be hurting him? It wasn't hurting me, so it
couldn't possibly be hurting him; he was just making up
far-fetched complaints about his computer to be difficult. Or so I
thought. I've sinced learned with absolute certainty that my
husband doesn't make up stories. If anything, he plays down his
symptoms because he knows how crazy they sound. I take his
reports at face value now even if I don't understand them
because I know him so well. I realize that you don't, but I do.

My husband didn't say he could sense my stress because I was
chewing my food harder than usual -- that he was picking up
auditory cues and absorbing my stress that way -- he told me the
crunching sound was actually triggering ES the way the vacuum
cleaner does. We didn't spend a lot of time trying to understand
how this was possible (we've got other problems). So I have no
explanation to offer for the crunching sounds triggering his ES. I
knew sharing the story here would make me sound like a
complete nut job. My hope is that someone on this list will one
day connect the dots between all the disparate bits of
information we all share...and find answers that will help us all.
If I have to sound like a crackpot in the meantime, I guess I can
live with that. :-)

Cara

--- In [hidden email], "Benson, Sarah \(Sen L.
Allison\)" <Sarah.Benson@a...> wrote:
> I'm afraid I find this a bit hard to accept. I don't see how it is
> possible to link ES symtoms to the sound of someone eating.
>
> Your husband's symptoms are more likely to be caused
because he finds
> your eating noises irritating but doesn't want to say anything, or
> because he he is absorbing your stress, or both. If a person is
> seriously low in B vitamins, this would possible be an
explanantion as
> to the physical symptoms.
>
> Sarah
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Cara [mailto:cara_evangelista@h...]
> Sent: Sunday, 13 February 2005 6:05 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [eSens] Re: High frequency sounds from vacuum
penetrate body
> causing ES symptoms
>
>
>
>
> Hi Glenn,
>
> Since you've brought up how sounds can be either "bad" or
> "good" for ES, here' s a story that's weird even by our
standards.
> Last night my husband shared with me that the sound of me
> CRUNCHING on junky snacks can trigger his ES symptoms. It
> doesn't happen EVERY time I snack on, say, potato chips. If I'm
> having a great old time, for example, playing a computer game
> and eating chips -- the sound of me eating chips won't have
any
> irritating effect at all. BUT, if I come home stressed from work,
> sack out on the couch and watch TV while eating the same
chips
> -- making the identical crunching sounds --- for some reason
> THOSE crunching sounds trigger his ES symptoms. He ends
up
> having to retreat to another room and lie down to recover.
>
> Weird? It's as if the stress I feel gets transmitted to my
husband
> through the sound I make with those dang chips, and that
> triggers ES... Now I know chip-crunching probably doesn't
qualify
> as "high-frequency" sound, but your comment about the
vacuum
> cleaner reminded me of this story because my husband
> *specifically* compared the crunching to the vacuum cleaner in
> terms of its effect on him. Anyway, it goes back to our previous
> discussion of how physical contact with a person can trigger
ES.
> Apparently physical contact isn't even necessary in our case;
> SOUND can do the damage just as well. BTW, those times
> when the crunching sounds caused the trouble -- I never said
a
> word to my husband about stress at work. As far as I know, he
> wasn't aware that I was particularly stressed out. The
> communication/transmission of stress was completely via
> sound and ES.
>
> The silver lining here is maybe I'll finally stop snacking on junk.
> I'm sure there are better ways of dealing with stress anyway.
:-)
>
> Cara
>
> --- In [hidden email], "Glenn Coleman"
> <glennhcoleman@h...> wrote:
>
> > I realized that if buddhist bells cause a high frequency sound
> that can penetrate my body and cause "good", that a high
> frequency sound from a vacuum cleaner could also penetrate
my



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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Thanks, Ian. I'm glad there are two other people in the world,
anyway, who know we're not crazy.

If I were inclined to test the noise/ES connection, I might try an
experiment: pick a high stress day (for me), come home, then
crunch away, and make my husband sit on the couch next to me
wearing earplugs. See if the stress is communicated to him and
translated into ES symptoms if he can't hear the sound of the
crunching. But then I guess someone could argue that an
increase in ES symptoms wouldn't prove anything, that my
husband could be psychosomatic and the simple fact of the
experiment might be enough to set him off.

Regardless, I wish I had the luxury to run that experiment. In a
different world it might even be fun. My husband and I used to
enjoy silly experiments like that. I know there are some folks
here who have recovered enough to be having a certain amount
of fun with this illness, taking a playful attitude towards learning
about the condition and how to manage it. I know a sense of
humor helps. But some days it's harder to keep a smile on than
others.

Cara

--- In [hidden email], "Sue and Ian Kemp"
<ianandsue.kemp@u...> wrote:
> ... and the other thing I forgot to mention is that Sue has to go to
the other end of the house when Im using my electric shaver - I
have to warn her "Im going to buzz"......Again not e-fields, just the
noise.
> .Ian
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Sue and Ian Kemp
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Tuesday, February 15, 2005 12:26 AM
> Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: High frequency sounds from vacuum
penetrate body causing ES symptoms
>
>
> Its amazingly difficult, isnt it, trying to make sense of the things
that are happening when you or your loved one get ES. All our
"life experience" and "common sense" dont seem to work when
trying to assess whats happening.
>
> For the record, Sue has found that she feels sensitive to
noise as well (she had a really uncomfortable time when she
went to the cinema with friends a few months back) and has told
me that she feels that eating (crunching) celery can make her
feel worse!
>
> A friends son who had ME developed extreme noise
sensitivity, such that he couldnt eat with the family because the
clink of knives and forks on the plates was torture to him.
Happily, he gradually recovered and is now completely OK again.
The sensitivity disappeared with the ME.
>
> (Please forgive lack of apostrophes, I split some tea down my
keyboard when I felt stressed and they have stopped working!)
>
> Ian

>
>

One of the great things about this group is that you realise "I am not alone" whether youre a sufferer or a carer - thanks everyone.
.
Ian
----- Original Message -----
From: Cara
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Tuesday, February 15, 2005 1:31 AM
Subject: [eSens] Re: High frequency sounds from vacuum penetrate body causing ES symptoms



Thanks, Ian. I'm glad there are two other people in the world,
anyway, who know we're not crazy.

If I were inclined to test the noise/ES connection, I might try an
experiment: pick a high stress day (for me), come home, then
crunch away, and make my husband sit on the couch next to me
wearing earplugs. See if the stress is communicated to him and
translated into ES symptoms if he can't hear the sound of the
crunching. But then I guess someone could argue that an
increase in ES symptoms wouldn't prove anything, that my
husband could be psychosomatic and the simple fact of the
experiment might be enough to set him off.

Regardless, I wish I had the luxury to run that experiment. In a
different world it might even be fun. My husband and I used to
enjoy silly experiments like that. I know there are some folks
here who have recovered enough to be having a certain amount
of fun with this illness, taking a playful attitude towards learning
about the condition and how to manage it. I know a sense of
humor helps. But some days it's harder to keep a smile on than
others.

Cara

--- In [hidden email], "Sue and Ian Kemp"
<ianandsue.kemp@u...> wrote:
> ... and the other thing I forgot to mention is that Sue has to go to
the other end of the house when Im using my electric shaver - I
have to warn her "Im going to buzz"......Again not e-fields, just the
noise.
> .Ian
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Sue and Ian Kemp
> To: [hidden email]
> Sent: Tuesday, February 15, 2005 12:26 AM
> Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: High frequency sounds from vacuum
penetrate body causing ES symptoms
>
>
> Its amazingly difficult, isnt it, trying to make sense of the things
that are happening when you or your loved one get ES. All our
"life experience" and "common sense" dont seem to work when
trying to assess whats happening.
>
> For the record, Sue has found that she feels sensitive to
noise as well (she had a really uncomfortable time when she
went to the cinema with friends a few months back) and has told
me that she feels that eating (crunching) celery can make her
feel worse!
>
> A friends son who had ME developed extreme noise
sensitivity, such that he couldnt eat with the family because the
clink of knives and forks on the plates was torture to him.
Happily, he gradually recovered and is now completely OK again.
The sensitivity disappeared with the ME.
>
> (Please forgive lack of apostrophes, I split some tea down my
keyboard when I felt stressed and they have stopped working!)
>
> Ian

>
>




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------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yahoo! Groups Links

a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
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b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[hidden email]

c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I think you have misunderstood me. I wasn't for a moment suggesting
that your husband was making his symptoms up or not being truthful, only
that those symptoms were not connected to exposure to EMR. He is
obviously extremely sensitive - as we all are - on this list, but the
problem with extreme sensitivity is that one can react to all sorts of
stressors and stimulii in the environmwent, and these stressors may be
something quite other than EMR or ELFs. They may, however, produce the
same nervous system symptoms. I hope this clarifies what I am trying to
say.

Sarah

-----Original Message-----
From: Cara [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Monday, 14 February 2005 5:32 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [eSens] Re: High frequency sounds from vacuum penetrate body
causing ES symptoms




Hi Sarah, I understand your skepticism completely. I am
reporting what my husband shared with me because I have
made the mistake in the past of discounting his experience
simply because I did not understand how it could be true. How
could his computer be hurting him? It wasn't hurting me, so it
couldn't possibly be hurting him; he was just making up
far-fetched complaints about his computer to be difficult. Or so I
thought. I've sinced learned with absolute certainty that my
husband doesn't make up stories. If anything, he plays down his
symptoms because he knows how crazy they sound. I take his
reports at face value now even if I don't understand them
because I know him so well. I realize that you don't, but I do.

My husband didn't say he could sense my stress because I was
chewing my food harder than usual -- that he was picking up
auditory cues and absorbing my stress that way -- he told me the
crunching sound was actually triggering ES the way the vacuum
cleaner does. We didn't spend a lot of time trying to understand
how this was possible (we've got other problems). So I have no
explanation to offer for the crunching sounds triggering his ES. I
knew sharing the story here would make me sound like a
complete nut job. My hope is that someone on this list will one
day connect the dots between all the disparate bits of
information we all share...and find answers that will help us all.  
If I have to sound like a crackpot in the meantime, I guess I can
live with that. :-)

Cara

--- In [hidden email], "Benson, Sarah \(Sen L.
Allison\)" <Sarah.Benson@a...> wrote:
> I'm afraid I find this a bit hard to accept. I don't see how it is
> possible to link ES symtoms to the sound of someone eating.
>
> Your husband's symptoms are more likely to be caused
because he finds
> your eating noises irritating but doesn't want to say anything, or
> because he he is absorbing your stress, or both. If a person is
> seriously low in B vitamins, this would possible be an
explanantion as
> to the physical symptoms.
>
> Sarah
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Cara [mailto:cara_evangelista@h...]
> Sent: Sunday, 13 February 2005 6:05 PM
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: [eSens] Re: High frequency sounds from vacuum
penetrate body
> causing ES symptoms
>
>
>
>
> Hi Glenn,
>
> Since you've brought up how sounds can be either "bad" or
> "good" for ES, here' s a story that's weird even by our
standards.
> Last night my husband shared with me that the sound of me
> CRUNCHING on junky snacks can trigger his ES symptoms. It
> doesn't happen EVERY time I snack on, say, potato chips. If I'm
> having a great old time, for example, playing a computer game
> and eating chips -- the sound of me eating chips won't have
any
> irritating effect at all. BUT, if I come home stressed from work,
> sack out on the couch and watch TV while eating the same
chips
> -- making the identical crunching sounds --- for some reason
> THOSE crunching sounds trigger his ES symptoms. He ends
up
> having to retreat to another room and lie down to recover.
>
> Weird? It's as if the stress I feel gets transmitted to my
husband
> through the sound I make with those dang chips, and that
> triggers ES... Now I know chip-crunching probably doesn't
qualify
> as "high-frequency" sound, but your comment about the
vacuum
> cleaner reminded me of this story because my husband
> *specifically* compared the crunching to the vacuum cleaner in
> terms of its effect on him. Anyway, it goes back to our previous
> discussion of how physical contact with a person can trigger
ES.
> Apparently physical contact isn't even necessary in our case;
> SOUND can do the damage just as well. BTW, those times
> when the crunching sounds caused the trouble -- I never said
a
> word to my husband about stress at work. As far as I know, he
> wasn't aware that I was particularly stressed out. The
> communication/transmission of stress was completely via
> sound and ES.
>
> The silver lining here is maybe I'll finally stop snacking on junk.
> I'm sure there are better ways of dealing with stress anyway.  
:-)
>
> Cara
>
> --- In [hidden email], "Glenn Coleman"
> <glennhcoleman@h...> wrote:
>
> > I realized that if buddhist bells cause a high frequency sound
> that can penetrate my body and cause "good", that a high
> frequency sound from a vacuum cleaner could also penetrate
my





 
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