New TV Advice?!

 
We bought a Samsung LCD/LED and the thing is frying me. I turned the backlight down from 14 to 3 but don't notice much of a difference.
 
Any ideas on what else I might try?
 
Loni

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Does it has a blue light in front?

Type, dimension?

It cannot be both.
Either it is a LCD or a LED.

We now have a Samsung LED 46" and my son has a Samsung LED 50".
Both are fine.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
www.milieuziektes.be
www.hetbitje.nl
checked by Norton

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Loni
  To: [hidden email]
  Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 11:20 PM
  Subject: [eSens] New TV Advice?!



  We bought a Samsung LCD/LED and the thing is frying me. I turned the backlight down from 14 to 3 but don't notice much of a difference.

  Any ideas on what else I might try?

  Loni

  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



  ------------------------------------

  Yahoo! Groups Links





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Charles, for your LED TV, is it edge-lit or full array?  My hunch is that edge-lit would be lower in EMF than full-array.

--- In [hidden email], "charles" <charles@...> wrote:

I guess it is LED/LCD. New technology I guess. Makes a really clear pic! It is 60 inch.
  It does not have a blue light.

Loni
 

--- On Wed, 6/29/11, charles <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: charles <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] New TV Advice?!
To: [hidden email]
Date: Wednesday, June 29, 2011, 2:25 PM


 



Does it has a blue light in front?

Type, dimension?

It cannot be both.
Either it is a LCD or a LED.

We now have a Samsung LED 46" and my son has a Samsung LED 50".
Both are fine.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
www.milieuziektes.be
www.hetbitje.nl
checked by Norton

----- Original Message -----
From: Loni
To: [hidden email]
Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 11:20 PM
Subject: [eSens] New TV Advice?!

We bought a Samsung LCD/LED and the thing is frying me. I turned the backlight down from 14 to 3 but don't notice much of a difference.

Any ideas on what else I might try?

Loni

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]








[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On 6/29/2011 6:06 PM, Loni wrote:
> I guess it is LED/LCD. New technology I guess. Makes a really clear pic! It is 60 inch.

I'm not sure why people (including Charles) distinguish between LCD
and LED, because they *both* contain LCD panels.

These *should* classified like this:

  LCD panel with a florescent backlight
  LCD panel with an LED backlight

Loni, does your set have one of those absurdly high refresh rates?
(e.g. 120 hz, 240 hz).  I think that might contribute to a set's
"tolerability".  The set I have at home (a Panasonic) is just a
plain old 60 hz refresh.  And it only gave me problems during
the first week.  Also, I have more trouble when the inputs
going into the set are 1080p than if they are 1080i or 720p.

Marc

I don't know what a refresh rate is. How would I check that out?  Loni

--- On Wed, 6/29/11, Marc Martin <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: Marc Martin <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] New TV Advice?!
To: [hidden email]
Date: Wednesday, June 29, 2011, 8:10 PM


 



On 6/29/2011 6:06 PM, Loni wrote:
> I guess it is LED/LCD. New technology I guess. Makes a really clear pic! It is 60 inch.

I'm not sure why people (including Charles) distinguish between LCD
and LED, because they *both* contain LCD panels.

These *should* classified like this:

LCD panel with a florescent backlight
LCD panel with an LED backlight

Loni, does your set have one of those absurdly high refresh rates?
(e.g. 120 hz, 240 hz). I think that might contribute to a set's
"tolerability". The set I have at home (a Panasonic) is just a
plain old 60 hz refresh. And it only gave me problems during
the first week. Also, I have more trouble when the inputs
going into the set are 1080p than if they are 1080i or 720p.

Marc







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

LCD TV: the background light consists of two to four CCFL lamps, which can be compared to fluorescent lamps.
LED TV: here the fluorescent lamps have been replaced with LED's.

LED TV's are much thinner, consume less energy, have a better way of dispersing light and produce less heat.
The contrast at the edges is better. And because the LED's in the background can be manipulated individually, it is possible to have optimal black tints, so the black on a LED is much blacker than on a LCD TV.

Btw. I don't know the difference between 1080 p and 1080 i.

The difference between 1080i and 720i is the technique.
I think that 1080i is digital, and 720i is analog.
(Anyway, other image control frequencies)
We have satellite.
For using Teletext, we have to switch from 1080i to 720i.
I don't know why.



Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
www.milieuziektes.be
www.hetbitje.nl
checked by Norton

  ----- Original Message -----
  From: Marc Martin
  To: [hidden email]
  Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2011 5:10 AM
  Subject: Re: [eSens] New TV Advice?!


  On 6/29/2011 6:06 PM, Loni wrote:
  > I guess it is LED/LCD. New technology I guess. Makes a really clear pic! It is 60 inch.

  I'm not sure why people (including Charles) distinguish between LCD
  and LED, because they *both* contain LCD panels.

  These *should* classified like this:

    LCD panel with a florescent backlight
    LCD panel with an LED backlight

  Loni, does your set have one of those absurdly high refresh rates?
  (e.g. 120 hz, 240 hz).  I think that might contribute to a set's
  "tolerability".  The set I have at home (a Panasonic) is just a
  plain old 60 hz refresh.  And it only gave me problems during
  the first week.  Also, I have more trouble when the inputs
  going into the set are 1080p than if they are 1080i or 720p.

  Marc


  ------------------------------------

  Yahoo! Groups Links





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On 6/29/2011 9:05 PM, Loni wrote:
> I don't know what a refresh rate is. How would I check that out?
> Loni

It'd probably be mentioned in the advertising for the TV set, or also
possibly the users manual.  They also might call it "motion
enhancement" or something like that, since they do this to eliminate
blurring during fast motion scenes (even though I can't really tell
much difference).  Sometimes you can even turn off these features,
which is what I did on my Panasonic TV.

Marc

I looked up on the internet & said to go to info button so when I pushed the info button it said:
 
1280X720 @ 60 Hz
 
I assume 60 Hz is refresh rate? 
 
Loni


--- On Thu, 6/30/11, Marc Martin <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: Marc Martin <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] New TV Advice?!
To: [hidden email]
Date: Thursday, June 30, 2011, 4:31 AM


 



On 6/29/2011 9:05 PM, Loni wrote:
> I don't know what a refresh rate is. How would I check that out?
> Loni

It'd probably be mentioned in the advertising for the TV set, or also
possibly the users manual. They also might call it "motion
enhancement" or something like that, since they do this to eliminate
blurring during fast motion scenes (even though I can't really tell
much difference). Sometimes you can even turn off these features,
which is what I did on my Panasonic TV.

Marc







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

On 6/30/2011 9:00 AM, Loni wrote:
> I looked up on the internet & said to go to info button so when I pushed the info button it said:
>  
> 1280X720 @ 60 Hz
>  
> I assume 60 Hz is refresh rate?  

Yes, that is a bit odd for a TV set to report the signal as 1280x720
(I would expect a computer monitor to do this, but not a TV).

But yes, the 60hz would be the refresh rate.  What's not clear
to me is whether that refers to the incoming signal, or what
the TV is displaying (as they can be different).

Marc

Well I don't understand any of it. But that is what it said. If I could just cut all the electric out here again like yesterday I wouldn't need help with the tv. ha     (or computer that is even worse)  Loni

--- On Fri, 7/1/11, Marc Martin <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: Marc Martin <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] New TV Advice?!
To: [hidden email]
Date: Friday, July 1, 2011, 8:18 AM


 



On 6/30/2011 9:00 AM, Loni wrote:
> I looked up on the internet & said to go to info button so when I pushed the info button it said:
>
> 1280X720 @ 60 Hz
>
> I assume 60 Hz is refresh rate?

Yes, that is a bit odd for a TV set to report the signal as 1280x720
(I would expect a computer monitor to do this, but not a TV).

But yes, the 60hz would be the refresh rate. What's not clear
to me is whether that refers to the incoming signal, or what
the TV is displaying (as they can be different).

Marc







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Hi Loni,

I know that people's e.s. responses may vary - but in my experience, turning the backlight down on a LCD (or LED) makes things worse.  To make the picture less bright, it's better (at least for me) to use the "brightness" control - while keeping the "backlight" at maximum.  Because when you dim the backlight - even just a little - it's sort-of like using a "dimmer switch" on an overhead fluorescent light - it introduces a "chopping" or "dimming" mechanism that generates more emf.

And I've heard that lowering the backlight on a LED TV may lead to additional problems with a "subliminal flicker" response, depending on how much you're flicker-sensitive.  (I'm distinguishing between LED TVs and "regular" LCD TVs here - supposedly regular LCD TVs generally aren't as bad in this regard.)

Do you think that part of your sensitivity may be because your eyes are sensitive to the intensity of the light and/or the "type" of light that the TV is putting out?  If so, making the picture as dark as you can stand it (while keeping the "backlight" at maximum) can make a difference.  You can try lowering the "brightness" to as low as possible.  Just don't overdo it - because if it's too dark, your eyes can start straining to see the picture.

Often, LCDs/LEDs have this setting activated that automatically adjusts the backlight from scene to scene - to "optimize" picture quality.  So for every scene in which the LCD dims the backlight, it could be generating emf.  You may want to make sure that this setting is set to "off".  What this setting is called varies from brand to brand - on our Sharp LCD TV, it's called the "OPC" (Optimal Picture Control?).  You can try looking in your manual to see what this setting is called, and making sure it's "off".

Furthermore, you can try to "simplify" the settings as much as possible.  Anything that seems "fancy schmancy", that you can do without - try turning it off (if you can) - or adjusting to a setting that you think may lead to some relief.  In a TV that large, it may have some extra settings that I'm not familiar with - I only have experience working with TVs 32" and below. (I think I did see where you mentioned that it was a 60" - pardon me if I'm wrong, I often don't remember what I've just read!)

But getting back to the light-sensitivity issue - if you're anything like me, you could be responding to not only the intensity of the backlight, but also the amount of light in a certain spectrum it puts out.  This is one of the reasons why I found my Toshiba 26" LCD TV (that I only had for 2 weeks) bothersome.  Even with the "brightness" turned very low, something about the light seemed way more intense than the CRT ("tube") TV it replaced.  I think it was putting out way more "blue light" than my CRT - indeed, the overall picture quality had a more "bluish" tint/tone to it than my CRT.  I find a more reddish/yellowish/"amber" tone to be much easier on my eyes/brain.  I tried to find each and every setting that would affect how much "blue light" reached my eyes - and adjusting those settings to "filter" out as much of the blue as possible.  One thing to do is to adjust the color temperature to "warm".  Actually, different TVs call this setting different things - on some TVs the desired setting is called "cool".  It can be a bit confusing. But what you want to do is to adjust things so that the white light has more of a "reddish" tone, instead of a "blueish" tone.  Let your eyes be your guide.  

Another thing to do to cut down on the blue-light effect is to adjust the "Tint" so that there is more red in the picture - let your eyes tell you when enough red is enough.

And from my experience with the more "entry level" Samsungs - Samsung has some advanced picture settings that you can tweak to further cut down on the blue light.  Try to find the setting that lets you adjust the intensity of the "blue" color to a minimum - it may be called the "Gamma" setting or something like that.  You might want to try to keep the "red Gamma" relatively high.  

Adjusting the "Black Tone" or "Black Level" (if this is an option) so that the black will be as dark as you can stand it can be a way to further cut down on the brightness and/or blue light.

For some reason, lowering the contrast has generally led to less TV stress for me - maybe because it has an overall brightness-lowering effect, I'm not sure.

If nothing works well enough - maybe it would help to go with a smaller TV?  There have been times here recently when I sort-of wished our 32" Sharp LCD TV that we have in our den was a 37" or 40" - but I try to bring myself back to reality, and remind myself that bigger TVs can lead to more problems with emf and other sensitivities.  Also, I suspect that a bigger TV can lead to more of the "zombie" effect - where you get too entranced by the screen, and you end up just sitting there being sucked in by the movie-like screen in front of you.  I don't know about you, but it seems like I'd be "fried" by a huge LCD TV for that reason alone!

If you think that a much smaller TV might work for you, you might want to look at the Samsung UN32D4000.  It's a 32" LED TV.  When I was "testing" it in a store a couple of months back, it seemed like it would be OK (as long as the backlight is kept at maximum).  If you need something bigger, maybe something that is as close to this model number as possible would work.

Hope it works out for you,

~Svetaswan








--- In [hidden email], Loni <loni326@...> wrote:

Thank you for this thorough recommendation Svetaswan. I turned the backlight up. 
 
I adjusted the brightness down but not sure how far down. I'll try to find the OPC as well.
 
I don't think I am having issues with light sensitivities regarding the tv.
 
Any other ideas that have worked for others?
 
Loni
 


--- On Sat, 7/2/11, svetaswan <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: svetaswan <[hidden email]>
Subject: [eSens] Re: New TV Advice?!
To: [hidden email]
Date: Saturday, July 2, 2011, 5:09 AM


 





Hi Loni,

I know that people's e.s. responses may vary - but in my experience, turning the backlight down on a LCD (or LED) makes things worse. To make the picture less bright, it's better (at least for me) to use the "brightness" control - while keeping the "backlight" at maximum. Because when you dim the backlight - even just a little - it's sort-of like using a "dimmer switch" on an overhead fluorescent light - it introduces a "chopping" or "dimming" mechanism that generates more emf.

And I've heard that lowering the backlight on a LED TV may lead to additional problems with a "subliminal flicker" response, depending on how much you're flicker-sensitive. (I'm distinguishing between LED TVs and "regular" LCD TVs here - supposedly regular LCD TVs generally aren't as bad in this regard.)

Do you think that part of your sensitivity may be because your eyes are sensitive to the intensity of the light and/or the "type" of light that the TV is putting out? If so, making the picture as dark as you can stand it (while keeping the "backlight" at maximum) can make a difference. You can try lowering the "brightness" to as low as possible. Just don't overdo it - because if it's too dark, your eyes can start straining to see the picture.

Often, LCDs/LEDs have this setting activated that automatically adjusts the backlight from scene to scene - to "optimize" picture quality. So for every scene in which the LCD dims the backlight, it could be generating emf. You may want to make sure that this setting is set to "off". What this setting is called varies from brand to brand - on our Sharp LCD TV, it's called the "OPC" (Optimal Picture Control?). You can try looking in your manual to see what this setting is called, and making sure it's "off".

Furthermore, you can try to "simplify" the settings as much as possible. Anything that seems "fancy schmancy", that you can do without - try turning it off (if you can) - or adjusting to a setting that you think may lead to some relief. In a TV that large, it may have some extra settings that I'm not familiar with - I only have experience working with TVs 32" and below. (I think I did see where you mentioned that it was a 60" - pardon me if I'm wrong, I often don't remember what I've just read!)

But getting back to the light-sensitivity issue - if you're anything like me, you could be responding to not only the intensity of the backlight, but also the amount of light in a certain spectrum it puts out. This is one of the reasons why I found my Toshiba 26" LCD TV (that I only had for 2 weeks) bothersome. Even with the "brightness" turned very low, something about the light seemed way more intense than the CRT ("tube") TV it replaced. I think it was putting out way more "blue light" than my CRT - indeed, the overall picture quality had a more "bluish" tint/tone to it than my CRT. I find a more reddish/yellowish/"amber" tone to be much easier on my eyes/brain. I tried to find each and every setting that would affect how much "blue light" reached my eyes - and adjusting those settings to "filter" out as much of the blue as possible. One thing to do is to adjust the color temperature to "warm". Actually, different TVs call this setting different
 things - on some TVs the desired setting is called "cool". It can be a bit confusing. But what you want to do is to adjust things so that the white light has more of a "reddish" tone, instead of a "blueish" tone. Let your eyes be your guide.

Another thing to do to cut down on the blue-light effect is to adjust the "Tint" so that there is more red in the picture - let your eyes tell you when enough red is enough.

And from my experience with the more "entry level" Samsungs - Samsung has some advanced picture settings that you can tweak to further cut down on the blue light. Try to find the setting that lets you adjust the intensity of the "blue" color to a minimum - it may be called the "Gamma" setting or something like that. You might want to try to keep the "red Gamma" relatively high.

Adjusting the "Black Tone" or "Black Level" (if this is an option) so that the black will be as dark as you can stand it can be a way to further cut down on the brightness and/or blue light.

For some reason, lowering the contrast has generally led to less TV stress for me - maybe because it has an overall brightness-lowering effect, I'm not sure.

If nothing works well enough - maybe it would help to go with a smaller TV? There have been times here recently when I sort-of wished our 32" Sharp LCD TV that we have in our den was a 37" or 40" - but I try to bring myself back to reality, and remind myself that bigger TVs can lead to more problems with emf and other sensitivities. Also, I suspect that a bigger TV can lead to more of the "zombie" effect - where you get too entranced by the screen, and you end up just sitting there being sucked in by the movie-like screen in front of you. I don't know about you, but it seems like I'd be "fried" by a huge LCD TV for that reason alone!

If you think that a much smaller TV might work for you, you might want to look at the Samsung UN32D4000. It's a 32" LED TV. When I was "testing" it in a store a couple of months back, it seemed like it would be OK (as long as the backlight is kept at maximum). If you need something bigger, maybe something that is as close to this model number as possible would work.

Hope it works out for you,

~Svetaswan

--- In [hidden email], Loni <loni326@...> wrote:







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> Thank you for this thorough recommendation Svetaswan. I turned the backlight up. 

I always turn the backlight DOWN for LCD TV's that have a florescent backlight.
That always makes me feel better.  But you've got an LED backlight, so I don't have
any experience with that.

What about the signal source?  Are you using a cable box?  DVD/Bluray?  off-the-air
antenna?  If you are using a cable box or DVD/Bluray, you can experiment with the
types of cables used to feed the signal (component vs. HDMI) and the resolution
of those signals (720p, 1080i, 1080p).  I find 720p/1080i input signals are easier to
tolerate than 1080p, but don't notice any difference between component/HDMI
cables.

Marc

Hi Marc, I am using a cable box. So you are saying that if I change the type of cable feeding the tv from the cable box that might have a difference?  What about any type of filter?
 
Loni


--- On Thu, 7/7/11, Marc Martin <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: Marc Martin <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: New TV Advice? Svetaswan
To: [hidden email]
Date: Thursday, July 7, 2011, 10:45 AM


 



> Thank you for this thorough recommendation Svetaswan. I turned the backlight up. 

I always turn the backlight DOWN for LCD TV's that have a florescent backlight.
That always makes me feel better. But you've got an LED backlight, so I don't have
any experience with that.

What about the signal source? Are you using a cable box? DVD/Bluray? off-the-air
antenna? If you are using a cable box or DVD/Bluray, you can experiment with the
types of cables used to feed the signal (component vs. HDMI) and the resolution
of those signals (720p, 1080i, 1080p). I find 720p/1080i input signals are easier to
tolerate than 1080p, but don't notice any difference between component/HDMI
cables.

Marc







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

What do you think about placing thick foil barrier between wall and back of tv? Would that block anything?  Loni

--- On Thu, 7/7/11, Marc Martin <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: Marc Martin <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: New TV Advice? Svetaswan
To: [hidden email]
Date: Thursday, July 7, 2011, 10:45 AM


 



> Thank you for this thorough recommendation Svetaswan. I turned the backlight up. 

I always turn the backlight DOWN for LCD TV's that have a florescent backlight.
That always makes me feel better. But you've got an LED backlight, so I don't have
any experience with that.

What about the signal source? Are you using a cable box? DVD/Bluray? off-the-air
antenna? If you are using a cable box or DVD/Bluray, you can experiment with the
types of cables used to feed the signal (component vs. HDMI) and the resolution
of those signals (720p, 1080i, 1080p). I find 720p/1080i input signals are easier to
tolerate than 1080p, but don't notice any difference between component/HDMI
cables.

Marc







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

> What do you think about placing thick foil barrier between wall and back of tv? Would that block anything?

Seems like that would reflect the EMF from the back of the TV towards the viewer, making your problems worse?

Or are you worried about being in a room on the other side of the wall?

Personally, I find barriers to often just make problems worse...

Marc

> Hi Marc, I am using a cable box. So you are saying that if I change the type
> of cable feeding the tv from the cable box that might have a difference? 
> What about any type of filter?

It's possible (although I don't know how likely) that using a different kind
of cable between your cable box and your TV (component vs. HDMI) might
make a difference.

It's also possible that changing the output signal from your cable box
from 1080i to 720p might make a difference (I don't believe cable boxes
can output 1080p, but if yours does, then try changing that to 1080i or
720p and see if it makes a difference).

Filter?  You mean for the cables?  Or in front of the screen?

Ultimately, it sounds like this a TV problem, since I don't think you had
this problem with your previous TV.  Can you return it or exchange it
for a different TV?

Marc

Ok thanks Marc, Probably because they are not grounded. Loni
 

--- On Thu, 7/7/11, Marc Martin <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: Marc Martin <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: New TV Advice?
To: [hidden email]
Date: Thursday, July 7, 2011, 1:01 PM


 



> What do you think about placing thick foil barrier between wall and back of tv? Would that block anything?

Seems like that would reflect the EMF from the back of the TV towards the viewer, making your problems worse?

Or are you worried about being in a room on the other side of the wall?

Personally, I find barriers to often just make problems worse...

Marc







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

No I had the problem with my other tv but new I was changing it so didn't do anything about it. I have difficulty with the smaller tv's as well so it's just that I'm severely EHS. I may be just stuck. But the other thing is the over exposure here with the cell antennas & power plant close. I'm just overexposed so there ya go.
 
I just enjoy the tv & wish it didn't cause the symptoms. I sit as far back as I possibly can without banging in to the counter in the kitchen!  lol      Loni

--- On Thu, 7/7/11, Marc Martin <[hidden email]> wrote:


From: Marc Martin <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: New TV Advice?
To: [hidden email]
Date: Thursday, July 7, 2011, 1:26 PM


 



> Hi Marc, I am using a cable box. So you are saying that if I change the type
> of cable feeding the tv from the cable box that might have a difference? 
> What about any type of filter?

It's possible (although I don't know how likely) that using a different kind
of cable between your cable box and your TV (component vs. HDMI) might
make a difference.

It's also possible that changing the output signal from your cable box
from 1080i to 720p might make a difference (I don't believe cable boxes
can output 1080p, but if yours does, then try changing that to 1080i or
720p and see if it makes a difference).

Filter? You mean for the cables? Or in front of the screen?

Ultimately, it sounds like this a TV problem, since I don't think you had
this problem with your previous TV. Can you return it or exchange it
for a different TV?

Marc







[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]