NCD & zeolite scams. was Re: health update

Indeed Rich, it not only "sounds to good to be
true"; it "is to good to be true."

This zeolite-NCD stuff is bullshit,
e.g. take a look at :
www.newstarget.com/015232.html

It's pure sales pitch for a MLM business out of
the wellness and anti-aging bizz.
Zeolite is a mineral deposit from volcanic rock
and ash, that has undergone a chemical reaction
over 1000's of years under water in the see or ocean.
How do you dissolve such a rock in plain water to make a liquid
, ... were are the so called negative charged zeolite-crystals in it ?
This stuff, this few drops a day, this latest
fashion snake oil, are not gonna cure your cancer,
and it's not gonna drain your heavy metal load.
( Zeolite in powder form can adsorb heavy metals,
but in this watery solution? )

It only drains your wallet Sandy

Convince yourself, do some reading :
www.medicalnewstoday.com/medicalnews.php?newsid=12050
www.cqs.com/zeolite.htm
www.herbological.com/herblog/?p=20
http://www.herbological.com/herblog/?m=200704
April 24, 2007
Zeolite - plagiarism of Wairora “chief scientist” exposed.
Fortunately the zeolilte zombies have
been giving me a wide berth these days: the
“science heavies” from Waiora who contacted
HERBLOG threatening to set me straight about the
science of my challenges to their rubbish
literature in person never materialized. Pity.
However, in the MLM universe it appears that
zeolite is continuing to mint money for its
upliners and dupe its gullible downliners.
There’s one born every minute as they say.
[ read more via the link ]

And more recent news about NCD:
http://herbalscienceresearch.com/aggregator/categories/3

Zeolite “inventor” sues Waiora, Dietsch and downliners.

Jonathan Treasure's Herblog - Mon, 2007-05-14 18:01
If anyone is still interested in the MLM
zeolite scam perpetrated by Waiora and their
volcanic wonder supplement scam called NCD,
take note that Lifelink Pharmaceuticals Inc. who
hold Dr Harvey Kauffman’s patent on the Zeolite
product, is currently suing Waiora (and its phony
scientist and chief plagiarist Dietsch)
for patent infringement. The link to the case
is here. What is going on is not clear at this
stage, but we look forward to seeing the
brown stuff fly before long….note that downline
distributors are also being sued in the
case. Perhaps Kauffman is irked about all the
money they are making by phony cancer cure
claims…meanwhile the famous “about to be
published” case of all those terminal cancer
patients miraculously being cured by
zeolite (NCD) referred to in much of the Waiora
downliner literature has yet to surface. Don’t hold your breath.

Why does : http://my.waiora.com/products/item26000-NCD.php
makes this statement on there site:
* These statements have not been
evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration.
These products are not intended to
diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.
if it cures cancer and works fine as a heavy metal detoxer?

Stay away from NCD and other MLM scammers.
;-)
Bruno M. ( a chemist; who has used synthetic zeolites in lab applications)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

> This stuff, this few drops a day, this latest
> fashion snake oil, are not gonna cure your cancer,
> and it's not gonna drain your heavy metal load.

Unfortunately Bruno, you do not make a convincing
argument. Calling something a "scam" does not
make it one. Some of the most effective things
that I have tried over the years have been called
"scams" by people more convincing than you. :-)

You should try subscribing to some heavy metal
discussion groups, perhaps the ones with parents
of autistic children who are treating their kids
with NCD. Perhaps you should perform a heavy
metal challenge test with NCD and verify on
your own body that it chelates metals. Here is
link that will easily allow you to do that:

http://ncdtest.com/

Perhaps you should interview some Doctors
who are treating their heavy metal toxic
patients with NCD, and see what results they
report.

It's easy to sit back, do an Internet search,
and find reasons to label something a scam.
It's much more difficult to actually arrive
at the truth.

Marc

(note that I am not recommending NCD to anyone,
nor have I taken much of it myself, but I have
seen convincing evidence that it does work for
some people)

This seems to me like a positive article for Zeolite.
I am misreading something?
Andrew
On May 30, 2007, at 7:03 PM, Bruno M. wrote:

> This zeolite-NCD stuff is bullshit,
> e.g. take a look at :
> www.newstarget.com/015232.html

Andrew McAfee wrote:
> This seems to me like a positive article for Zeolite.
> I am misreading something?
>> www.newstarget.com/015232.html

I believe Bruno's point is that NCD is overhyped and too good
to be true. And to a point, I agree that there is a lot
of hype. I agree that their chief spokesman (Rik) is
a rather questionable fellow. But the people who
market it are not the people who invented it. And
all that's important in the end is whether it works.
You're only going to find that out by listening to
people who are using it.

Marc

In reply to Bruno M.: Why does :
<http://my.waiora.com/products/item26000-NCD.php>
http://my.waiora.com/products/item26000-NCD.php
makes this statement on there site:
* These statements have not been
evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration.
These products are not intended to
diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease.
if it cures cancer and works fine as a heavy metal detoxer?

The reason is that this is a legal requirement (and it shows that they are
complying with the law). Claims to "cure and prevent" can only be published
without this disclaimer if backed up by extensive clinical trials including
"controls" (placebo). The problem is that these are extremely expensive to
do.

So we end up with two "levels" of health products:

1. Those which have gone through clinical trials and are fully proven to
have an effect - mainly pharmaceutical drugs. But the clinical trials are
very expensive to set up, and if the results are inconclusive the drug does
not get approval, so there is a high wastage rate. Hence the high cost of
pharma drugs, and the use of patents to protect them from competition.

2. Those which have not gone through clinical trials but about which there
is more or less evidence that they may help with various conditions.
Typically "natural" or herbal or non-pharma products. These all have to
carry the disclaimer above on any advertising - not unreasonably. Being
natural, they cannot be patented, so cannot recoup the cost of clinical
trials. So it is very difficult to get evidence whether they really do
work, or are "snake oil" simply making money for the manufacturers. Both
types abound!

The ideal would be some sort of simplified trial on natural products, maybe
paid for by the government with some assistance from manufacturers, to try
to establish whether some of the better known products do have efficacy. In
some cases this has already been done so that "natural" treatments such as
evening primrose oil are recognised as having a real effect and doctors
prescribe them. Otherwise, one has to resort to trying to find out whether
brand X really has worked for people or whether the claims on a website are
just marketing hype. Hence the rise of website groups like this where one
gets a good spectrum of honest feedback. Not ideal, but often the best
available at present.

One problem is that for many products we don't really know why they work.
Sellers often resort to exaggerated pseudoscience claims to "explain" their
effect. A good scientist or doctor will see through this and naturally
suspects a scam. In fact some of these products do seem to work quite well,
but not for the reasons given! But these claims can undermine their
credibility and make it more difficult for mainstream medicine (or the
common-sense man-in-the-street) to accept them.

Ian


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