LCD vs. CRT

Hi all,

Well, I got my new 19" LCD monitor (1280x1024 pixels) several days ago.
However, I quickly realized that this monitor is *not* easier to tolerate
than my old 19" CRT monitor running at 800x600 resolution. In fact, my
initial impression is that it is *more difficult* to tolerate!! Symptoms
are familiar, but things that I haven't experienced for a while --
headaches and a burning sensation on my face. Interesting.

I recall once when I was talking on the phone with a sales representative
for the Quantum Products devices, they said that a lot of people have
trouble with the noise generated by the computer's video card, and this
noise get transferred to the field emitted by the monitor. So I just
pulled out my old "Quantum Monitor" device and am experimenting with using
this on top of my Springlife Polarizer pendants (this does seem to help).
Also, this new monitor has a DVI-D input, so I will try and see if using a
DVI-D cable has an effect versus using a standard VGA cable.

Note that unlike the previous LCD monitor I tried years ago, this one has
it's AC-to-DC transformer in the monitor itself, which I think would make
it more difficult to tolerate than if the transformer was part of the plug
or part of the power cord.

Oh well, at least this is an opportunity to experiment and learn something
new... :-)
It's a nice monitor, but I didn't expect it to be *worse* from an ES
standpoint than my CRT!

Marc

Hello Marc,

it is not good having this AC/DC transformer near you.
All tranformers must be at leat 2.5 meteres away.

Remember I wrote you a few weeks ago about this Tecno AO product for the
monitor?

A few days ago I received this Springlife OM Polarizer Pendant.
It seems that it helps a bit against the high frequency, but certainly not
against the lowfrequency electrosmog.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
www.hetbitje.nl
checked by Norton Antivirus


----- Original Message -----
From: "Marc Martin" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Sunday, June 20, 2004 19:10
Subject: [eSens] LCD vs. CRT

>it is not good having this AC/DC transformer near you.
>All tranformers must be at leat 2.5 meteres away.

Presumably there must be some sort of device that I could put onto the
monitor which counters this transformer?

Also, presumably the conversion of the analog VGA to the digital signal
used by the LCD could be considered a "transformation" of sorts, and also
could be causing problems. It'll be interesting to see if the DVI cable
makes any difference at all.

>A few days ago I received this Springlife OM Polarizer Pendant.
>It seems that it helps a bit against the high frequency, but certainly not
>against the lowfrequency electrosmog.

So what specific situations are you finding it helpful and not helpful? I
don't know exactly what you mean by high/low frequency electrosmog, and it
would be easier for me to have specific things you've tried it on (TVs,
computers, cell phones, cell antennas, etc)

Marc

By the way, I used my EMF Field Tester (A.W. Sperry EMF-200A), and measured
a maximum reading of 15.0 milligauss coming from this new LCD monitor, near
where the power cord enters the monitor. When measuring my old 15" LCD
monitor (which my wife currently uses), the maximum reading is only 0.3
milligauss!

I'm really surprised that this monitor has the DC transformer inside the
monitor. I thought *all* LCD monitors had external transformers!

But of course, that's been my luck these past few years with monitor
purchases. The monitors I have gotten at work or purchased for home use
have mostly seemed more difficult to tolerate than seemingly equivalent
monitors I've used elsewhere. Oh well... makes things more challenging, I
guess... :-)

Marc

Hello Marc,

> I'm really surprised that this monitor has the DC transformer inside the
> monitor. I thought *all* LCD monitors had external transformers!

(sorry bad english) ... I would like to tell you, that I have simmilar
problems with CRT ant LCD as you described. CRTs causes a burning
feeling in my face, an makes the skin looks like sunburn. This allways
happens at work in front of my 19" CRT. After some time an additional
muzzy feeling comes, that stays long, and which often makes working
difficult. This was the same with some other CRTs before, but the effect
increases by the time. In front of my 5 years old CRT at home there is
only this muzzy feeling, but no red skin, but also I feel a form of
burniung in my face.

My CRT has an external transformer, and I think, that in my case not the
transformer is the reason for this effects, but I dont know the real
reasons, and it seems, that nobody knows.

regards Ralf

>My CRT has an external transformer, and I think, that in my case not the
>transformer is the reason for this effects, but I dont know the real
>reasons, and it seems, that nobody knows.

Well, I think *some* people must know... perhaps we just don't understand
it though.

Given a return of my old symptoms with this new monitor, I revisited some
of my old solutions, and my tolerance seems to be improved already. The
things I changed were:

* insert a "Quantum Monitor" device into the VGA cable to the monitor
(the "Quantum Byte" software should be equivalent)
* put a small Springlife Polarizer pendant onto the VGA cable
* increase my intake of antioxidants ("Active H-" aka "Mega H-")
* increase my intake of "Green Magma" barley grass powder
* start taking Garden of Life's "Primal Defense" probiotic tablets
* start taking Standard Process' "e-Poise" multi-vitamin

I don't know which of these helps the most -- in my experimentation
from years ago, I found that they all seemed to help to varying
degrees...

Marc

Ralf and Marc,

It is well known that CRT's have health effects (commonly known as VDU
syndrome), from which I personally suffer. The visible signs of these effects
are much like sunburn - skin reddening and peeling. This is caused either by:
(1.) The strong magnetic fields associated with CRT's (50Hz AC)
(2.) The strong electric fields associated with CRT's (50Hz AC)
(3.) EM Radiation emitted from CRT's with higher, unknown frequencies (I'd be
interested to know if anyone has made measurements using a spectrum analyser)
(4.) Electromagnetic transients (dirty power) generated by switch mode power
supplies (these types of power supply are a bit like the transformer in an LCD
monitor, and they usually generate a lot of electromagnetic noise/transients,
which can apparently cause health problems for many people)
(5.) The flicker (flashing) of the screen (usually 50 flashes per second
(=50Hz), depending on the screens refresh rate)
(6.) Chemicals used in the manufacture of CRT's (such as Brominated fire
retardants)
(7.) A combination of the five factors listed above

I suggest that (7.) is the most likely option and the impact of different
combinations of the five factors mentioned (and others) could partly explain
why different electrically sensitive people experience different symptoms and
require different remedies (I personally believe that sufferers of VDU syndrome
are a subset of electrically sensitive people). I must also add that in the
modern office, it is likely that many people suffering from 'VDU Syndrome' have
at some point sat near the back of one or more CRT monitors without necessarily
realising (it/they may have been on the other side of an office partition or
wall) - EM fields at the back of CRT monitors are MUCH stronger than those at
the front and the magnetic field will pass directly through most materials). I
believe that sitting near the back of a number of monitors for prolonged
periods contributed to the triggering of my symptoms and have little doubt that
this is the case for many others with VDU syndrome.

It has previously been suggested in this group that LCD screens have two main
components that could have health effects.
The first is the transformer and the second is the fluorescent 'back light'.

(1.) The transformer generates significant magnetic fields and should probably
be kept as far away from the body as possible. If the transformer is external,
then one can simply buy or make an extension cord for the cord that plugs into
the computer, allowing the transformer to be situated away from the body. If,
as has been discussed, the transformer is internal, then there is probably
little that one can do to avoid the relatively strong magnetic fields
associated with these devices.

(2.) The fluorescent 'back light' can possibly cause various health related
problems, particularly for electrically sensitive people. This could relate to
the low frequency 'flicker' (e.g. 50Hz, depending on the refresh rate setting
of the screen) or the EM fields associated with the ballast of the fluorescent
light. I plan to deactivate the fluorescent 'back light' in my LCD screen to
observe the impacts on the performance of the screen and personal health.

I apologise for the length of this message but I felt that there could have
been some confusion regarding the issues associated with computer screens. I
would like to discuss this further with anyone who is interested to help
broaden my knowledge. Thanks

Lachlan

>(7.) A combination of the five factors listed above

I think one should an (8) here -- I'm sticking with my theory that the
waveforms coming out of some monitors are such that they "stir up" toxins
which are otherwise stashed away in your cells. The headaches, the burning
face, etc. could be explained by this as well. Especially when one can
solve the problem with taking lots of antioxidants, minerals, and
proteins/amino acids.

I really think people should also experiment with the resolution of their
monitors. With CRTs, I tolerate the lower resolutions better than the
higher resolutions. With LCDs, I don't think it would make any difference,
since the resolution of the panel is fixed. Although if the problem is
also in the video card or the VGA cable, then it might make a difference.

Note that I bought and tried out a DVI cable on my new LCD monitor, and it
didn't appear to make a difference. This LCD monitor is perhaps the most
difficult to tolerate monitor I've ever encountered! (figures) However,
I'm still experimenting -- the Quantum Monitor makes it far more tolerable,
and also using the larger Springlife Polarizers helps as well.

>modern office, it is likely that many people suffering from 'VDU Syndrome'
>have
>at some point sat near the back of one or more CRT monitors without
>necessarily
>realising

During the year that my health was going progressively downhill, the desks
in my office cubicle were arranged so that I not only had my CRT monitor in
front of me, but the backs of 2 other CRT monitors very close to me. Plus
we had a low ceiling with florescent lights.

I'd be interested in hearing if turning off the LCD florescent backlight
makes any difference in your tolerance, Lachlan. Common sense says it
would, but common sense doesn't seem to always seem to apply with ES... :-)

Marc

I'm interested to know what waveforms you mean. I recently read that the
action of heavy metal dumping was something like the following (though please
correct me if this is wrong as I do not have a good understanding):
-heavy metals enter body
-body does not generally have an immediate use for them or a simple means of
elimination so stores them in tissue
-at some point, body attempts to draw nutrients stored in tissue for cellular
activities and in this process heavy metals are drawn from the tissue, which
then proceed to wreak havoc on the cells etc.

I have also been thinking about the connection between calcium, and the
associated interference induced by EMF on calcium efflux (movement) in cells.
This is of particular interest to me since, like myself, a few people on the
list are vegetarians who theoretically often have low calcium levels in the
body. Perhaps when you don't have enough calcium (which may be caused by a
combination of diet and excess requirements in high EMF environments), then
when the body goes looking for calcium stores in tissues and does not find any,
it gets the closest looking molecule/ion (which in the case of those with heavy
metals stored in the tissue could perhaps be lead or mercury - though I don't
know whether these molecules or ions look similar to the body). This is a lay
theory and probably completely flawed, though I'd be interested to know what
others with more knowledge think on this matter???? I'm also keen to keep the
debate on LCD's and CRT's going to try to understand more on this issue.
Thanks

Lachlan

-----Original Message-----
From: Marc Martin [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Wednesday, 23 June 2004 12:42 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: RE: [eSens] LCD vs. CRT

>(7.) A combination of the five factors listed above

I think one should an (8) here -- I'm sticking with my theory that the
waveforms coming out of some monitors are such that they "stir up" toxins
which are otherwise stashed away in your cells. The headaches, the burning
face, etc. could be explained by this as well. Especially when one can
solve the problem with taking lots of antioxidants, minerals, and
proteins/amino acids.

I really think people should also experiment with the resolution of their
monitors. With CRTs, I tolerate the lower resolutions better than the
higher resolutions. With LCDs, I don't think it would make any difference,
since the resolution of the panel is fixed. Although if the problem is
also in the video card or the VGA cable, then it might make a difference.

Note that I bought and tried out a DVI cable on my new LCD monitor, and it
didn't appear to make a difference. This LCD monitor is perhaps the most
difficult to tolerate monitor I've ever encountered! (figures) However,
I'm still experimenting -- the Quantum Monitor makes it far more tolerable,
and also using the larger Springlife Polarizers helps as well.

>modern office, it is likely that many people suffering from 'VDU Syndrome'
>have
>at some point sat near the back of one or more CRT monitors without
>necessarily
>realising

During the year that my health was going progressively downhill, the desks
in my office cubicle were arranged so that I not only had my CRT monitor in
front of me, but the backs of 2 other CRT monitors very close to me. Plus
we had a low ceiling with florescent lights.

I'd be interested in hearing if turning off the LCD florescent backlight
makes any difference in your tolerance, Lachlan. Common sense says it
would, but common sense doesn't seem to always seem to apply with ES... :-)

Marc




Yahoo! Groups Links

>I'm interested to know what waveforms you mean.

The studies that looked at mercury amalgam corrosion rates due to EMF
pointed out that it was the square-wave ("pulsed" might have been a term
they used) frequencies that really caused a lot of mercury mobilization.
And CRTs and LCDs both have these sorts of waveforms.

Marc

I'd be interested to know what these studies are, just to clarify exactly what
we are talking about here. Is it the transients induced by the switch mode
power supply (though I imagine that this wouldn't be the same for an LCD screen
- maybe an old one though) or perhaps some harmonics of the 50Hz field that
break off and are transmitted in the form of EMR as opposed to EMF. Anyway, if
you can remember or easily chase a reference to a paper, I'd appreciate it,
otherwise I'll start hunting. Thanks

Lachlan

-----Original Message-----
From: Marc Martin [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: Wednesday, 23 June 2004 11:30 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: RE: [eSens] LCD vs. CRT

>I'm interested to know what waveforms you mean.

The studies that looked at mercury amalgam corrosion rates due to EMF
pointed out that it was the square-wave ("pulsed" might have been a term
they used) frequencies that really caused a lot of mercury mobilization.
And CRTs and LCDs both have these sorts of waveforms.

Marc




Yahoo! Groups Links

>I'd be interested to know what these studies are, just to clarify exactly what
>we are talking about here.

I'm referring to a sentence that's in the booklet "ABC on Mercury - Poisoing
from Dental Amalgam Fillings", by the Swedish Association of Dental Mercury
Patients, 1997. It says:


A special problem is that some amalgam-poisoned persons develop a
notable sensitivity to electro-magnetic fields, often also to fluorescent
lamps. Certain heavy metals like mercury increase the effects of various
types of radiation and can cause skin-sensitivity to light. The problem
is most likely connected to the formation of free radicals. Antioxidants
and amalgam removal (all metals in the mouth!) will usually help, but
the electro-allergy is one of the most persistent of the problems. It seems
to decline very slowly. Note that non-symmetrical, pulsing magnetic
fields induce corrosion currents in amalgam fillings and considerably
enhances mercury release from the fillings. A computer terminal
produces such pulses.

Also, there was the following study, which appears to only be available
online as an abstract:

http://www.algonet.se/~leif/yfORT91a.html

Marc

>I'm also keen to keep the debate on LCD's and CRT's going to try to
>understand more on this issue.

All I know is that the common perception that LCDs are benign in comparison
to CRTs is definitely not true for me. What I was seeing a few years ago,
and even today with this new LCD monitor, is that LCDs can be much harder
to tolerate than CRTs. Also, my sensitivity to monitors vary with the
model of monitor due to unknown factors. So theoretically, there could be
a CRT or LCD model out there that's far easier for me to tolerate than the
ones I've got.

In any case, I'm going to visit my electrodermal screener, and see if she's
got any special suggestions for supplementation and/or devices to improve
my tolerance to this new LCD monitor. Otherwise, it'll be back to my old
CRT (which I tolerate just fine as long as I keep the resolution less than
800x600 pixels).

Marc