FM band

Low, you seem o have misunderstood my question...

I think that you owe us the answer what are you looking for at this
list?!!!?

If you don't believe in ES (than you think all of us are lunatics, or
what?!), and having no material interest (in advestising etc.), why do you
waste your time reading our discussions?!

Drasko

Drasco, because i finde it usefull to give some "real" basics on emf
if people ask me. Thats why millions of people are on other usegroups
too. They just do it for no special purpose its just chat thats all.

--- In [hidden email], "Drasko Cvijovic" <pecina@c...> wrote:
>
> Low, you seem o have misunderstood my question...
>
> I think that you owe us the answer what are you looking for at this
> list?!!!?
>
> If you don't believe in ES (than you think all of us are lunatics, or
> what?!), and having no material interest (in advestising etc.), why
do you

So, Low, you are also a good fairy?! :-)

Well, tell us why don't you believe in ES?!

By the way, you mentioned "the other" (presumably non - Aaronia?) meters
some days ago... Which?

Drasko

----- Original Message -----
From: "low_emf" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 3:38 PM
Subject: [eSens] Re: Low doesn't believe!?

Thats easy Drasco: If ES would REALY exist you would get the Nobel
Price and a lot of money and for SURE you would get the 1.000.000 US$
at the "Million Dollar Challange" at www.randi.org
So, why dosent somone collect that money ???

The other "portable" devices i often use for EMF readings together
with my LogPer antenna are:
FSH6 from R&S
Anritsu MS2711D

All other devices are not portable and only usefull for my lab but are MUCH more accurate (if someone needs it)...

--- In [hidden email], "Drasko Cvijovic" <pecina@c...> wrote:
>
> So, Low, you are also a good fairy?! :-)
>
> Well, tell us why don't you believe in ES?!

Hello Drasko,

don't get upset.
He is just teasing you.
It is his business te sell meters to people who have or fear ES.
So, don't mind.

He hasn't read much.
Otherwise he would have known better.

See blackonwhite, which is a free PDF, or *the Invisible Disease* by Gunni
Nordström.

His behaviour is also a testimonial, that his marketing is a shambles.
Otherwise he would have encountered many people who do have ES.

He is just sitting behind his desk on his behind and grinning.

On the other hand, I am certainly not impressed with his so-called technical
knowledge.
The fact that he owns or rents spectrumanalysers does not qualify.
If he does not work for that certain company, why does he need other
spectrumanalysers, if his Spectrans are so good?

That is a good question, isn't it?

I've heard from a technician who has a lifelong experience with real
spectrumanalysers, who tried to measure a DECT phone with a Spectran, but
only found a GSM transmitter outside his house.

Outside Low, I have not seen any positive reports from people who have
Spectrans.

Greetings,
Charles Claessens
member Verband Baubiologie
www.milieuziektes.nl
www.milieuziektes.be
www.hetbitje.nl
checked by Norton Antivirus


----- Original Message -----
From: "low_emf" <[hidden email]>
To: <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, July 25, 2005 20:11
Subject: [eSens] Re: Low doesn't believe!?

MUCH more accurate (if someone needs it)...
>
> --- In [hidden email], "Drasko Cvijovic" <pecina@c...> wrote:
> >
> > So, Low, you are also a good fairy?! :-)
> >
> > Well, tell us why don't you believe in ES?!

> don't get upset.
> He is just teasing you.
> It is his business te sell meters to people who have or fear ES.
> So, don't mind.

Anyone have any objections if I ban LOW_EMF from the
list?

He doesn't have ES.

He doesn't believe ES is real.

His only interest seems to be to promote a certain brand
of EMF meter.

Seems to me that he doesn't belong here.

Marc

Hi,

I've been doing quite some research w.r.t. mercury-intoxication and I discovered that my eSens-symptoms are equal to the symptoms I get from using any of the following:

* MSM
* Chlorella
* Lipoic Acid

I get extreme brain fogs, tingling sensations, concentration difficulties, muscle spasms, difficulity finding words and I become emotionally unstable.

I recently did a DMPS test and it showed some mercury toxicity, even though I have never had any fillings.
My mother, however, did have a lot of fillings when I was born and I've had the usual vaccinations ofcourse.
The DMPS test was quite extreme. I got the above symptoms in very heavy forms and it kept going on for almost a week.

Right now I'm searching the internet for hours and hours and think I have found a relatively safe way to detox, using alpha lipoic acid.
I've ordered the book on http://www.noamalgam.com/ for all details. Here are some details on the protocol he uses: http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/Andy_dose_sched.html .
Quite nasty and dangerous business: chelating mercury, because it might end up in the brain, doing more damage than it already did.

Today I stumbled on a very interesting site, which has three articles on the relation between EM-radiation and mercury.

Check out:
http://www.mercurypoisoned.com/

And then check the links below the heading "Electromagnetic Waves, Cell Phones and Mercury Poisoning":

* The Deadly Dangers of Mercury and Electromagnetic Fields Cell phone dangers
* Radiation from Cellular Tower Melts Mercury Fillings in German Woman
* The Menace of Cell Phone Towers by Carol Ward, Vice President of DAMS

I tend to believe that mercury (and probably other heavy metals and perhaps also chemicals) is a major cofactor w.r.t. eSens.
I also think that mercury on its own might be tolerated by a lot of people, but combined with exposure to radiation it tends to leak into the body and eventually into the brain/ear/eyes/nerves, causing nasty symptoms.

Alas, it's of no use to ask if someone on this list without mercury in his mouth has eSens.. 99% of people in Western worlds have mercury or have at least had vaccinations or had a mother with mercury or have dropped a thermometer some day in their life.
Otherwise it would have been a lot easier to find a relation between mercury exposure and eSens.

A possibly interesting test would be:
* Measure urine mercury excretion before exposure to EM radiation
* Again, measure urine mercury (and/or other metals) excretion *after* exposure

I think radiation mobilizes heavy metals and toxins and some of these will probably show up in the urine.
I think that after each exposure to EM radiation, the mercury can reach deeper tissue levels in the brain, nerves, glands and organs and thereby increase eSens.

Well, that's the result of my recent research. I think a lot of you already knew about the relation between EM and mercury, but I think this post will be interesting to some of you.

Greetings from the Netherlands,

Ed

> Right now I'm searching the internet for hours and hours and think I have
> found a relatively safe way to detox, using alpha lipoic acid.

Yes, the mercury + ES connection was something I first read about in
2000, and immediately jumped on it, having my mercury fillings removed
and starting chelation programs. I've spent thousands of dollars
on various chelators that I've taken for years, and yet the detox
never seems to stop. So either the chelators are merely moving
things around in my body (and not getting it out), or the rate
that I can comfortably detox is extremely low compared to the high
amount of mercury that was originally in my body.

I think detoxing is a great idea in theory, but I wouldn't expect
to see much benefit from it in the nearterm.

And also, if environmental EMF is already mobilizing metals into
your system and causing ES symptoms, then taking chelators on
top of that will just make you worse. The solution is to instead
take stuff that merely binds (and not mobilize) the mercury...
things like charcoal, clay, anti-oxidants, etc. Plus things
that help your body detoxify in general (excercise, good foods,
supplements, etc.)

Marc

Seeing as this list is for people who have ES and are exploring ways of
overcoming the attendant difficulties, I think anyone who does not have
ES or is not involved as a healer or medico is a) superflous, and b) a
distraction.  

It doesn't matter if he or anyone else doesn't believe it exists.
Chronic Fatigue Syndrome existed for 30 years before it was recognised
by the medical establishment - ES has only been around for ten.

If people selling meters want to drum up business then they could be
encouraged to state what they want to sell and then either remain silent
or go elsewhere.

That's my 2 cents worth.

Sarah


-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
Marc Martin
Sent: Tuesday, 26 July 2005 4:47 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [eSens] Re: Low doesn't believe!?


> don't get upset.
> He is just teasing you.
> It is his business te sell meters to people who have or fear ES. So,
> don't mind.

Anyone have any objections if I ban LOW_EMF from the
list?

He doesn't have ES.

He doesn't believe ES is real.

His only interest seems to be to promote a certain brand
of EMF meter.

Seems to me that he doesn't belong here.

Marc


 
Yahoo! Groups Links



 

If "low" is committed to contributing positively to our general healing
and well being, then I don't have a problem with anyone being on the
list that is a non believer. If anyone invalidates another persons
symptoms as fake or as an imaginary illness, then that person should be
removed.
Let's pose this question to "low" as see what his intentions are?
Andrew
On Jul 25, 2005, at 2:46 PM, Marc Martin wrote:

> Right now I'm searching the internet for hours and hours and think I
> have found a relatively safe way to detox, using alpha lipoic acid.
> I've ordered the book on http://www.noamalgam.com/ for all details.
> Here are some details on the protocol he uses: http://home.earthlink.net/~moriam/Andy_dose_sched.html .

By the way, have you tried DMSA before? Many people cannot do
Andy Cutler's mercury removal protocols, because they cannot
stand the awful side effects of using DMSA. I personally
think Andy is too close-minded, and has dismissed some good
alternatives. And reading his book, his suggestions are mostly
pharmaceuticals, which aren't that helpful for folks with
chemical sensitivities or people who prefer more natural
options.

For me, the most tolerable mercury chelator I've tried is CNLZ,
but this is an obscure and hard-to-find herbal supplement. Sea
Greens is much easier to find, and fairly tolerable. NDF is
a bit harder to tolerate, although I did find that it helped
my ES symptoms, which is unusual in a chelator. And PCA-Rx
seems interesting, although I have a bottle and its definitely
not as free of side effects as they claim.

Marc

On Tue, 26 Jul 2005 13:16:20 -0700, Marc Martin wrote:

>By the way, have you tried DMSA before? Many people cannot do
>Andy Cutler's mercury removal protocols, because they cannot
>stand the awful side effects of using DMSA. I personally
>think Andy is too close-minded, and has dismissed some good
>alternatives.

Hi Marc,

I do get the same feeling that Andy is probably too close-minded. But his protocol does make sense. Perhaps exchanging DMSA for NDF of PCA-Rx or something else makes sense?

The DMSA I will not use for now. Had some nasty experience with DMPS (kidneys started to ache quite badly), so I won't go near chemical stuff like that.
I've started the protocol with just ALA (lipoic acid) yesterday morning.
So far, I've only had some side effects from the first three doses. I use 33mg every 3 hours, also during the night.
This morning I felt more energy than I normally have and right now I just came back from running, which I often also didn't have the energy for. This time, today, I felt like running.
So, so far so good, but I don't have enough data to conclude anything. ALA is nice because it does cross the blood brain barrier and is a real chelator (two sulfur bonds if I'm correct).

Chlorella I've tried a few times, but I felt quite ill all day long, so I stopped using it.

I'll keep you updated of my progress. Have you tried the ALA before?

Disclaimer for all readers:
Please note: It's advised to not do any chelating when you still have fillings with mercury.
ALA crosses the blood-brain barrier and shouldn't be used until at least 3 months after all fillings have been removed.
Don't experiment with chelating until you've at least read and understand the linked articles and have done your own extensive research. Chelating mercury and heavy metals is potentially very dangerous!

Greetings from the Netherlands,

Ed

>Perhaps exchanging DMSA for NDF of PCA-Rx or
>something else makes sense?

There doesn't seem to be any need to follow
an every-four-hour-dosage protocol with these
other products. Both NDF and PCA-Rx are to
be taken once or twice a day, and one adjusts
the dosage to your tolerance level.

> Chlorella I've tried a few times, but I felt
> quite ill all day long, so I stopped using it.

Yes, chlorella seems to almost universally provoke
bad reactions to people on mailing lists. It's
a wonder that health care practitioners still
recommend it!

> Have you tried the ALA before?

Not by itself. It's been listed as an ingredient
in some things that I've tried over the years, but
I haven't had any specific observations on ALA and
its effects on me.

Marc

A while ago, Marc mentioned that he had been editing low_emf's posts to
remove insulting and inflammatory language. If that's still the case,
then the rest of us don't actually know "low" and can only guess at the
amount of time Marc is investing in keeping these threads civil. Those
issues are at least as important as whether he actually 'believes' or
not.

Emma


On Jul 26, 2005, at 15:22, Andrew McAfee wrote:

> If "low" is committed to contributing positively to our general healing
> and well being, then I don't have a problem with anyone being on the
> list that is a non believer. If anyone invalidates another persons
> symptoms as fake or as an imaginary illness, then that person should be
> removed.
> Let's pose this question to "low" as see what his intentions are?


>> Anyone have any objections if I ban LOW_EMF from the
>> list?

Anybody knows about alternative fillings ? I mean in order not to
use mercury amalgam.

It's not quite the topic of the list, although, yes it is related.
So if anybody knows website about it. So far I've read
that "biocompatibility" should be checked for composite material.

jean.

--- In [hidden email], "Ed - Netherlands" <groups@n...> wrote: But his protocol does make sense. Perhaps exchanging DMSA for NDF of
PCA-Rx or something else makes sense?
>
> The DMSA I will not use for now. Had some nasty experience with
DMPS (kidneys started to ache quite badly), so I won't go near
chemical stuff like that.
> I've started the protocol with just ALA (lipoic acid) yesterday
morning.
> So far, I've only had some side effects from the first three doses.
I use 33mg every 3 hours, also during the night.
> This morning I felt more energy than I normally have and right now
I just came back from running, which I often also didn't have the
energy for. This time, today, I felt like running.
> So, so far so good, but I don't have enough data to conclude
anything. ALA is nice because it does cross the blood brain barrier
and is a real chelator (two sulfur bonds if I'm correct).
>
> Chlorella I've tried a few times, but I felt quite ill all day
long, so I stopped using it.
>
> I'll keep you updated of my progress. Have you tried the ALA before?
>
> Disclaimer for all readers:
> Please note: It's advised to not do any chelating when you still
have fillings with mercury.
> ALA crosses the blood-brain barrier and shouldn't be used until at
least 3 months after all fillings have been removed.
> Don't experiment with chelating until you've at least read and
understand the linked articles and have done your own extensive
research. Chelating mercury and heavy metals is potentially very
dangerous!
>
> Greetings from the Netherlands,
>
> Ed

tdx244 wrote:
> Anybody knows about alternative fillings ? I mean in order not to
> use mercury amalgam.

There are metal-free materials that can be used for fillings,
crowns, implants, etc. I had all the metal removed from my
mouth 5 years ago, including a porcelain crown which contains
uranium.

I think most dentists know about composite fillings these days,
don't they? My dentist offered them back in the 1980's.

And certainly if you can find a "holistic" dentist in your area,
they know about blood tests or muscle tests for biocompatibility.

Marc

There is a company in the U.S. called Clifford Consulting & Research
(www.ccrlabs.com) that provides biocompatibility testing of dental
materials using a blood sample. The service is available for domestic
and international clients through any healthcare provider that can
legally order lab blood tests and is willing to place the order with CCR.

The test is called the Clifford Materials Reactivity Test. Here is a
snippet from the site's "What is CMRT?" page:

"The Clifford Materials Reactivity Testing (CMRT) is a laboratory
screening process used to help identify existing sensitivity problems
to various chemical groups and families of compounds in an individual
patient. It specifically looks for existing systemic sensitivity which
could be associated with various bio-materials and restorative
products that are used to repair and reconstruct teeth, bone
structures, joints and other body tissue. The CMRT is performed from
blood serum using classical immunological methods in a CLIA-licensed
interstate laboratory."

I had this testing done before mercury amalgam replacement and it
significantly narrowed the dental restorative materials that could be
used with me. One nice thing about the service is that you get your
own copy of the report for reference purposes with any dentist or
orthodontist you see. At the time I ordered mine the testing report
contained 46 pages of info. You'll have to contact CCR for the
current test price.

Once you and your dentist settle on a biochemically safe amalgam
replacement material(s) I would recommend "energetic compatibility"
testing of that choice as further screening. If you know someone who
does this kind of testing, such as an energetic healer, acupuncturist,
etc., who has had a good track record of discerning the beneficial and
detrimental effects of substances and energies on you, take a sample
of the material(s) to them. (I mention materials because sometimes
there is more than one material used during placement of composites.)

I should also mention the test will also narrow what preservative
agents, like those used in anesthetic shots, you can biochemically
tolerate. You might want to have those energetically tested, too.

-Beau

--- In [hidden email], "tdx244" <tdx244@y...> wrote:

Yeah, I had them removed too lately. And now I'm getting the
fillings. But that's the phase my intuition raised an alarm, since the
dentist did not discuss it, he just said "no metal" and "it's a good
material", when I asked him about that.

Now I might try to ask for more information before i get them.
Hum...not sure, since he alrady gave me a reduction compared to the
normal price.

jean.


--- In [hidden email], Marc Martin <marc@u...> wrote:

Thanks, that's very interesting too. Now, as I said the problem
might be the cost. Oh well, I should have thought about all that
before. I'll get the composite in within a month or two. Argh,
seems it's too late to start something on the sides.

All right thanks much. I don't want to develop the thread on this
topic, since it's not the main topic. But as I can read it here ES
and heavy metal intoxication might be linked together


jean.


--- In [hidden email], "bbin37" <netfarer2@y...> wrote:
> There is a company in the U.S. called Clifford Consulting & Research
> (www.ccrlabs.com) that provides biocompatibility testing of dental
> materials using a blood sample. The service is available for
domestic
> and international clients through any healthcare provider that can
> legally order lab blood tests and is willing to place the order
with CCR.
>
> The test is called the Clifford Materials Reactivity Test. Here is
a
> snippet from the site's "What is CMRT?" page:
>
> "The Clifford Materials Reactivity Testing (CMRT) is a laboratory
> screening process used to help identify existing sensitivity
problems
> to various chemical groups and families of compounds in an
individual
> patient. It specifically looks for existing systemic sensitivity
which
> could be associated with various bio-materials and restorative
> products that are used to repair and reconstruct teeth, bone
> structures, joints and other body tissue. The CMRT is performed from
> blood serum using classical immunological methods in a CLIA-licensed
> interstate laboratory."
>
> I had this testing done before mercury amalgam replacement and it
> significantly narrowed the dental restorative materials that could
be
> used with me. One nice thing about the service is that you get your
> own copy of the report for reference purposes with any dentist or
> orthodontist you see. At the time I ordered mine the testing report
> contained 46 pages of info. You'll have to contact CCR for the
> current test price.
>
> Once you and your dentist settle on a biochemically safe amalgam
> replacement material(s) I would recommend "energetic compatibility"
> testing of that choice as further screening. If you know someone
who
> does this kind of testing, such as an energetic healer,
acupuncturist,
> etc., who has had a good track record of discerning the beneficial
and
> detrimental effects of substances and energies on you, take a sample
> of the material(s) to them. (I mention materials because sometimes
> there is more than one material used during placement of
composites.)
>
> I should also mention the test will also narrow what preservative
> agents, like those used in anesthetic shots, you can biochemically
> tolerate. You might want to have those energetically tested, too.
>
> -Beau
>
> --- In [hidden email], "tdx244" <tdx244@y...> wrote:
> > Anybody knows about alternative fillings ? I mean in order not
to
> > use mercury amalgam.
> >
> > It's not quite the topic of the list, although, yes it is
related.
> > So if anybody knows website about it. So far I've read
> > that "biocompatibility" should be checked for composite material.
> >
> > jean.
> >
> > --- In [hidden email], "Ed - Netherlands" <groups@n...>
wrote: minded.
> > But his protocol does make sense. Perhaps exchanging DMSA for NDF
of
> > PCA-Rx or something else makes sense?
> > >
> > > The DMSA I will not use for now. Had some nasty experience with
> > DMPS (kidneys started to ache quite badly), so I won't go near
> > chemical stuff like that.
> > > I've started the protocol with just ALA (lipoic acid) yesterday
> > morning.
> > > So far, I've only had some side effects from the first three
doses.
> > I use 33mg every 3 hours, also during the night.
> > > This morning I felt more energy than I normally have and right
now
> > I just came back from running, which I often also didn't have the
> > energy for. This time, today, I felt like running.
> > > So, so far so good, but I don't have enough data to conclude
> > anything. ALA is nice because it does cross the blood brain
barrier
> > and is a real chelator (two sulfur bonds if I'm correct).
> > >
> > > Chlorella I've tried a few times, but I felt quite ill all day
> > long, so I stopped using it.
> > >
> > > I'll keep you updated of my progress. Have you tried the ALA
before?
> > >
> > > Disclaimer for all readers:
> > > Please note: It's advised to not do any chelating when you
still
> > have fillings with mercury.
> > > ALA crosses the blood-brain barrier and shouldn't be used until
at
> > least 3 months after all fillings have been removed.
> > > Don't experiment with chelating until you've at least read and
> > understand the linked articles and have done your own extensive
> > research. Chelating mercury and heavy metals is potentially very
> > dangerous!
> > >
> > > Greetings from the Netherlands,
> > >
> > > Ed

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